Seeds do disappear

[Spada]

Hi i planted Seeds and when harvest like potatoes or corns after they fully grown the seeds disappear and i have to plant the seeds again which doesn’t seem right considering i can craft 1 seed from 5 potatoes/corn
Do i need a Special Tool for the harvesting?

[aY227]

Intended.
Welcome to A20

[Kauldric]

In A20 you don’t really need to plant seeds early gsme due to massive amounts of corn and potatoes found in medium and large cities.

Late game you will need 3 points in the farming perm in Fortitude. Unsure if I agree with this design philosophy but basically crafting requires spending perks.

[Taity]

Originally posted by Spada:

Hi i planted Seeds and when harvest like potatoes or corns after they fully grown the seeds disappear and i have to plant the seeds again which doesn’t seem right considering i can craft 1 seed from 5 potatoes/corn
Do i need a Special Tool for the harvesting?

Currently with farming without investing in the appropriate perk then the return on investment is not typically worth it. It does not mean that you cant or shouldn't use farming without taking the appropriate perk, but to get the most value and to make the ability to farm more continuous through higher seed return, you need to as suggested invest those points which can often be better used elsewhere unless you are specifically investing those points there for some reason (normally farming is a mid-late game thing).

Essentially early-mid game dont rely on farming to supply you with food, feel free to use it if you have the seeds and want to grow some stuff to help early game food management, but you can also hold onto those seeds until your able to spec more towards farming later in the game and get the most value out of them. It is entirely your choice how you go about farming and if you choose to farm right away without investing, or choose if and when to invest in farming. It is initially designed like this to make early game farming exploitation's alot harder because it requires so many of any 'x' plant to get a seed of that plant type and unless you invest points to increase the ability to get seeds through various means you cannot endlessly sustain a farm with only a handful of seeds.

[Jolly]

Protip: You can eat a Sham Chowder +1 Fortitude and put on the Tough Guy Glasses +1 Fortitude when you're about to harvest and save yourself 2 skill points if you're going max in Living Off The Land.

Otherwise you can just a have few Farm plots and any seeds you find you can just plant it for some food for later, maybe get lucky and 50% to get another seed.

Obviously there needs to be a balance for the skills and hopefully A21 does that.

[irish_vampyre]

Honestly, my new experience with farming in general is that it's a completely worthless endeavor now. You're better off just farming quests and buying foods as needed. Farming has so little chance these days to produce enough product to justify seed costs unless you get lucky with a seed drop.

[Discipline Before Dishonor]

Don't you love how they're ruining every aspect of the game except for the graphics

[GutterWeasel]

Originally posted by irish_vampyre:

Honestly, my new experience with farming in general is that it's a completely worthless endeavor now. You're better off just farming quests and buying foods as needed. Farming has so little chance these days to produce enough product to justify seed costs unless you get lucky with a seed drop.

Even with 2/3 levels of the farming skill you get 4-5 goldenrod and it's 5 goldenrod to make new seeds. Harvesting a plant doesn't leave the plant behind anymore and the chance of harvesting seeds seems incredibly low. Last time I harvested 10 plants I got 1 seed, the time before that It might have been 3/10. Its low enough now that unless you max the skill out you'll lose product by farming and pumping 5 points into Fortitude so you can put 3 points into this skill will mean barely making a surplus. I admit with the old system I was rolling in food since after planting something once it left the plant behind and you could just harvest but now taking that mechanic away without increasing the amount produced so you can make seeds or lowering the cost of making seeds has kind of broken this. I guess its a useless skill and grilled meat for life once you cant find any eggs.

Originally posted by Taity:

Originally posted by Spada:

Hi i planted Seeds and when harvest like potatoes or corns after they fully grown the seeds disappear and i have to plant the seeds again which doesn’t seem right considering i can craft 1 seed from 5 potatoes/corn
Do i need a Special Tool for the harvesting?

Currently with farming without investing in the appropriate perk then the return on investment is not typically worth it. It does not mean that you cant or shouldn't use farming without taking the appropriate perk, but to get the most value and to make the ability to farm more continuous through higher seed return, you need to as suggested invest those points which can often be better used elsewhere unless you are specifically investing those points there for some reason (normally farming is a mid-late game thing).

Essentially early-mid game dont rely on farming to supply you with food, feel free to use it if you have the seeds and want to grow some stuff to help early game food management, but you can also hold onto those seeds until your able to spec more towards farming later in the game and get the most value out of them. It is entirely your choice how you go about farming and if you choose to farm right away without investing, or choose if and when to invest in farming. It is initially designed like this to make early game farming exploitation's alot harder because it requires so many of any 'x' plant to get a seed of that plant type and unless you invest points to increase the ability to get seeds through various means you cannot endlessly sustain a farm with only a handful of seeds.

This doesn't really fly for me
The Bicycle isn't slower than walking. People dont get it for the 10 storage slots. You dont say "yeah no vehicle is faster than jogging until you get the 4x4. You dont need to spend more resources making a lockpick than you get out of the safe you crack. And that's what we're talking about. This skill isn't Unproductive/mildlyproductive/Hyperproductive. Its Veryunproductive/unproductive/Slightlyproductive for its 3 levels. I suppose there is also level zero you could consider too so its Very unproductive/Pretty unproductive/slightly unproductive/slightlyproductive for its 4 levels from 0-3

[prpl_mage]

Living off the land used to have 5 levels way back, but you only needed a few to make it sustainable, having all 5 made it too good.
Then they reduced it to 3 levels, but at the same time they also reduced the yield.
I think there's still a chance for a seed to drop when you harvest it, but if not you might just barely make a profit when you recraft the seed.

I kinda dislike this chance, but also like it. I think the 3rd level should ensure profit better than it does now though.

Solution? Plant seeds you find. Trader quests sometimes reward you with one of those seed bundles, you can also get them from supply crates. And harvesting farms you find to make seeds from those.

[Midas]

Without the farming perk, seeds are just a way to grow some bonus food, but it's not sustainable. You use it to supplement, not to replace your food storage. If you have 1-2 points in Living Off The Land, then you can largely invest in a farm and mostly sustain it, but it'll be RNG how much you actually get out of it.

It's not until level 3 that you really get to lean on farming as a source of food, since your farm will always be growing at that point.

Honestly, before this, there was no point even having a farming perk since no one bothered to take it. Now you actually need to know what you're doing to sustain a farm in a post-apoc environment, and that really makes sense.

[Spider]

I thought we were done with farming complaints. I am proven wrong yet again. Invest 3 points into farming, or don't farm. Do you main clubs as a weapon with no points in it? Did you know you can't jump 3 blocks high without investing into it? Invest in what you want to do, or fail at it. That statement actually applies to real life, too, so take that how you will.

[Hades]

I do agree that 1 point in Living off the Land is pretty worthless... I actually made a mod that gives extra plants per harvest just so you could be do basic farming with a low yield - but definitely not go backward.

[[-=O=-]^FightinCock]

I wait till I can get 3 points in LOTL before my first harvest...

Farming is still till OP IMO...

Needs a mid to late game negative effect... like... Rot... fungus... maybe all you punkcans turn into mushroom.... lol.

[GutterWeasel]

Why not have it that you're unable to turn crops into seeds until level 3 then?

Its currently :
LV1- turn decorative plants like yucca and goldenrod into seeds! But if you do it costs 5 plants and gives you 4 back.
LV2- turn vegetables into seeds! But if you do you get 4 1/2 back for every 5 you spend.

If they really wanted to have farming non sustainable till level 3 why not make it that you cant make seeds until level 3.

Also 2 points in clubs and I'm killing it. Got a flaming shaft mod since I haven't found a helmet light mod. I'm good to go. 2 points in farming and Im a garbage farmer.

I guess it makes sense in the context that it's really a 5 tier skill trunkated to 3 tier, I dont remember that but I do remember putting zombie meat in my cement mixer to make fertilizer....

I guess if you're going to put 3 points in farmer it doesn't make sense to plant anything until you get all 3 points. Or at least dont harvest, because if you do you're only going to get 4-5 plants back and you wont be able to make more seeds. Not like food is super rare, I just liked farming on my roof and it kind of sucks now.

[Uncle Al]

There's a 50% chance of getting the seed back when you harvest.

That means:
LoTL 0 - not worth crafting seeds - just plant and harvest seeds you find
LoTL 1 - worth crafting seeds, but returns are small (and you need to find the recipes)
LoTL 2 - good returns overall, but you can still have crap luck on a particular harvest
LoTL 3 - excellent returns overall and guaranteed a return every harvest no matter how bad your luck is

There have been about 4 million posts on this, so go read one of the huge threads if you want to see lots of debate, but the math is pretty simple.

[Jolly]

Originally posted by Uncle Al:

There's a 50% chance of getting the seed back when you harvest.

That means:
LoTL 0 - not worth crafting seeds - just plant and harvest seeds you find
LoTL 1 - worth crafting seeds, but returns are small (and you need to find the recipes)
LoTL 2 - good returns overall, but you can still have crap luck on a particular harvest
LoTL 3 - excellent returns overall and guaranteed a return every harvest no matter how bad your luck is

There have been about 4 million posts on this, so go read one of the huge threads if you want to see lots of debate, but the math is pretty simple.

The math is not simple but the understanding of how a harvest turns out is. I wish I saw the actual math broken down to every detail of the question followed by the answer, tbh just to have the details so I can see what can be tweaked.