Sagittario 2 needs BR change like now!

[Grimz FF]

Just got to the Sagittario 2 and at 9.0 this honestly feels worse than anything else at this BR
I would love for the devs to just fly it stock for 10 battles to see if they can do anything it's beyond ridiculous and I need to use it to research 190k RP for the next plane. 8.3 is the max I could see this planes BR.

[LordBUM]

it actually use to be at 8.3 but for some reason they moved it up even though nobody asked them to.

[Kogoro]

Originally posted by LordBUM:

it actually use to be at 8.3 but for some reason they moved it up even though nobody asked them to.

Do they ever ask anyone when they make BR changes, It's just their secret data that says they should.

[Legendbee]

It’s pretty insane vehicle ngl, I own the ariete too and that thing easily wins any dogfight in its br range

[ArtemisHunt]

It's unfortunate but the devs do not play their own game. One will no doubt pop into to the thread to reply to this comment and say "no, we do play the game" but based on prior public statements like "We don't want there to be farming vehicles" shows that if they do "play the game" they're definitely not paying attention because farming vehicles are everywhere. Which might be an even more damning indictment idk.

BRs are unfortunately tied to player performance rather than vehicle performance so there ya go.

Originally posted by Kogoro:

Originally posted by LordBUM:

it actually use to be at 8.3 but for some reason they moved it up even though nobody asked them to.

Do they ever ask anyone when they make BR changes, It's just their secret data that says they should.

The data isn't secret. Thunderskill scrapes the database they use, you can see the winrates of the vehicles. There may be some other factors they're not telling us about but we can see vehicle performance on Thunderskill so we have a rough idea of what they're using.

[256_Swerve]

Gaijin don't use Thunderskill and although it does give a workable view of game stats it is far from a complete data set.

Thunderskill only scrapes data when requested by searching an IGN. If you have not searched your own IGN, and nobody else has, then your data will not be in its database

[ArtemisHunt]

Originally posted by 256_Swerve:

Gaijin don't use Thunderskill and although it does give a workable view of game stats it is far from a complete data set.

Thunderskill only scrapes data when requested by searching an IGN. If you have not searched your own IGN, and nobody else has, then your data will not be in its database

No one said Gaijin uses Thunderskill. Thunderskill scrapes the database Gaijin uses. These are two different statements. I don't know why this was so difficult for you to understand. It doesn't matter if you don't have EVERYBODY'S data, you just need a representative sample. The United States (a country with 200 million-ish eligible voters) runs moderately good polling with 1000-3000 samples. Thunderskill more than provides a representative sample due to how many people use it. Which is why keeping an eye on it is sufficient to see where Gaijin is headed.

[256_Swerve]

My reply was more of a general comment that might help newer readers understand Thunderskill rather than a disagreement

However....

It's more nuanced than that. Most frequent Thunderskill users, i.e. those that are invested in some way in monitoring their own performance, are likely to noticeably skew the dataset. It's not reliable and invested parties have said such in the past.

[ArtemisHunt]

Originally posted by 256_Swerve:

It's more nuanced than that. Most frequent Thunderskill users, i.e. those that are invested in some way in monitoring their own performance, are likely to noticeably skew the dataset. It's not reliable and invested parties have said such in the past.

This isn't even true but even if it were, again, United States elections polls are usually given to people invested in the prosperity of their country so this idea that "If you are invested in your performance your data is more / less valuable" doesn't fly. It's no coincidence that the German and USSR vehicles with excellent thunderskill stats all got their BRs raised in addition to some of the Swedish vehicles that really didn't deserve it if you ask me.

[9imperator8]

Originally posted by ArtemisHunt:

Originally posted by 256_Swerve:

It's more nuanced than that. Most frequent Thunderskill users, i.e. those that are invested in some way in monitoring their own performance, are likely to noticeably skew the dataset. It's not reliable and invested parties have said such in the past.

This isn't even true but even if it were, again, United States elections polls are usually given to people invested in the prosperity of their country so this idea that "If you are invested in your performance your data is more / less valuable" doesn't fly. It's no coincidence that the German and USSR vehicles with excellent thunderskill stats all got their BRs raised in addition to some of the Swedish vehicles that really didn't deserve it if you ask me.

An election poll is a bit different than... warthunder. I hope you do know that.

[ArtemisHunt]

Originally posted by alarik98:

Originally posted by ArtemisHunt:

This isn't even true but even if it were, again, United States elections polls are usually given to people invested in the prosperity of their country so this idea that "If you are invested in your performance your data is more / less valuable" doesn't fly. It's no coincidence that the German and USSR vehicles with excellent thunderskill stats all got their BRs raised in addition to some of the Swedish vehicles that really didn't deserve it if you ask me.

An election poll is a bit different than... warthunder. I hope you do know that.

The point is to show that you do not need everyone to utilize a service to get a representative sample. Which is why it's fairly easy to predict BR changes if you keep an eye on Thunderskill. For example I called the T-34(42)'s BR change to 4.0 because it was one of the most successful vehicles in its BR range at the time.

[redned]

Originally posted by LordBUM:

it actually use to be at 8.3 but for some reason they moved it up even though nobody asked them to.

what do you mean nobody asked them to.

the reason it got moved up is because gaijin would repeatedly increase it's repair cost when it was 8.3 and 8.7 so everyone that played it said they would rather it have a lower repair cost and play it at a higher BR then pay 45k SL to repair it. now it's 9.0 with a playable repair cost.

it's extremely manoeuvrable if you're dying in that thing it's not the planes fault.
it's still easily better then any saber or MiG-15 at 8.7 and so should not be the same BR as either of them.

[redned]

Originally posted by Kogoro:

Originally posted by LordBUM:

it actually use to be at 8.3 but for some reason they moved it up even though nobody asked them to.

Do they ever ask anyone when they make BR changes, It's just their secret data that says they should.

don't need secret data to know the Sagi 2 is a great vehicle

[redned]

Originally posted by ArtemisHunt:

Originally posted by 256_Swerve:

Gaijin don't use Thunderskill and although it does give a workable view of game stats it is far from a complete data set.

Thunderskill only scrapes data when requested by searching an IGN. If you have not searched your own IGN, and nobody else has, then your data will not be in its database

No one said Gaijin uses Thunderskill. Thunderskill scrapes the database Gaijin uses. These are two different statements. I don't know why this was so difficult for you to understand. It doesn't matter if you don't have EVERYBODY'S data, you just need a representative sample. The United States (a country with 200 million-ish eligible voters) runs moderately good polling with 1000-3000 samples. Thunderskill more than provides a representative sample due to how many people use it. Which is why keeping an eye on it is sufficient to see where Gaijin is headed.

TS is far from representative and should not even be considered.
easy to poll people on a 2 party system. it's literally 50/50 and you still see several polls showing vastly different results.like how often do you see polls saying one thing then everyone acts shocked it goes the complete opposite way. all the damn time that's how often
just like TS is bias since it only polls from people who request and just so you know many top squadrons use TS to check a players stats in vehicles. so if many good players are using TS then TS is not a representation of the player base. in fact the only people I hear talk about TS when I am on discord is sweats boasting about their skill.

[redned]

Originally posted by ArtemisHunt:

Originally posted by alarik98:

An election poll is a bit different than... warthunder. I hope you do know that.

The point is to show that you do not need everyone to utilize a service to get a representative sample. Which is why it's fairly easy to predict BR changes if you keep an eye on Thunderskill. For example I called the T-34(42)'s BR change to 4.0 because it was one of the most successful vehicles in its BR range at the time.

polling the rich will not represent the poor nor will polling good players represent bad players

[ArtemisHunt]

Originally posted by redned:

Originally posted by ArtemisHunt:

No one said Gaijin uses Thunderskill. Thunderskill scrapes the database Gaijin uses. These are two different statements. I don't know why this was so difficult for you to understand. It doesn't matter if you don't have EVERYBODY'S data, you just need a representative sample. The United States (a country with 200 million-ish eligible voters) runs moderately good polling with 1000-3000 samples. Thunderskill more than provides a representative sample due to how many people use it. Which is why keeping an eye on it is sufficient to see where Gaijin is headed.

TS is far from representative and should not even be considered.
easy to poll people on a 2 party system. it's literally 50/50 and you still see several polls showing vastly different results.like how often do you see polls saying one thing then everyone acts shocked it goes the complete opposite way. all the damn time that's how often
just like TS is bias since it only polls from people who request and just so you know many top squadrons use TS to check a players stats in vehicles. so if many good players are using TS then TS is not a representation of the player base. in fact the only people I hear talk about TS when I am on discord is sweats boasting about their skill.

Ahhh so you think the sweats boasting about their skill are going to be in the vehicles that lose more often thus those vehicles will not get their BRs raised? Rather than... literally the exact opposite? Again if you observe thunder skill you could have literally called at least half of the most recent BR update. Germany was ruining 5.3-7.3 and you could see it in the stats.