How does someone actually have fun with P47s and P51s?

[Zook the Duke]

"Just sideclimb, just BNZ" That Spitfire, BF109, Yak, and A6M5 are still 5k feet above you so the only option is a kamikaze strike down to the deck or wait for them to do the same to give chase (That Yak is waiting for precisely that to pounce on you). I've been trying to play these planes for like 100+ hours already and it is normally interception while you're getting up to speed and altitude, or I get my dive kill, but it doesn't matter because I can't recover altitude or recover speed before the aforementioned yak is upon you with his cannon, or the third scenario which every complains about, you get to altitude and everyone is below you... And the whole team is dead so it's you versus 11.

I know I'm just gonna get hit with "Skill issue get good ♥♥♥ uninstall" but like... What is there for these planes that don't require luck and good conditions? If you don't win your first dive on the enemy then kiss that kill goodbye because the only way to survive is to tuck tail and run or lose a turn fight (And also a yak is diving from 14k feet because he sees your vulnerable). I really want to enjoy the two staple WW2 US warplanes in Europe, but the whole sideclimb BNZ ♥♥♥♥ only works one out of three times for me. They can't turn fight, their armaments are subpar compared to the other fighters they face, they have horrible energy retention and climb like bricks so any enemy ouclimbs or outruns you while you're trying to get to optimal speed. Global win rates for Air RB between 4.0 and 5.0 show the US do the worst of any nation. Is there something I can actually do to enjoy these planes? Or am I just doomed to air meta bullying me in perpetuity? (Also in case you didn't tell I've been killed by a few Yaks and I'm particularly bitter towards them).

[Lucky_Star_Fan]

I only use P-47s in GRB to bomb with, they're quite terrible in ARB without an airpspawn. For P-51s the C-10 and H-5 are good to great, and I think the D-20 is above average? The rest are simply outclassed by meta planes, which is a big problem with prop BRs. Everyone knows 109s, Yaks and spitfires are extremely good and so they get played a lot. They should be tweaked, but Gaijin only seems to change jet BRs these days.

[chima]

kill AIs :-)

[Warlock]

I don't recall them being much fun to spade up, and haven't been flying them out since then.

Might be worth a revisit

my favorite US prop fighter is the P-40E

[jaxjace]

climb at a lower rate and a higher speed

[lmkBEAST]

throw those planes in the trash, except that 6.3 p51. embrace airacobra and kingcobra instead.

[BTGbullseye]

Use them in Ground RB instead of air. They're borderline exceptional there, especially the P-51 with 1000lb bombs.

[KitoAce]

i fly the german and the ussr p47's all the time. way more than the usa's tree, so it helps but generally , side climb till i feel no ones going to get directly on my 6 than just BnZ or loop on people. i dont score many kills but i do well in the plane with assists, i set my guns to uni and or stealth and set them at 800 converg, anyone dumb enough to head on me i start spraying at 1.8k so by the time my stealth rounds hit em they dead. in head on's 50's cals fly fast and pretty accurate. so with stealth for me , at 1.5k aim above the canopy just a few hairs and do and small up and down wiggly. they always die. and for anything running away. if it is with in 700m i aim guns right below where landing gear would be. past 700m i aim for above canopy. i can generally get 2 to 3 kills a game if i get i bnz flow game or i can try to side climb wait for the furball to start, dive right into it. and loop it 2 or 3 times hope to get a kill or 2 with energy and hope my team has my back as im bait at this point,

[Arbus Arbus]

I mean if you just become defyn or smigol its easy but jokes aside I totally agree with you.

P51s are unkillable if played right, they're also just really bad at killing anything else in the process.

Zeros suck but a ton of other Japanese planes are straight up busted UFOs that are always 5 miles above you.

Even with the C10 and to a lesser extent the H you will end up losing all spotting when your team dives on the first bomber they see and then you get jumpscared by someone who just came down from orbit and only got spotted when they were 20m away from your ass (thanks Air RB spotting system)

If you somehow manage to hold off the whole enemy team and start making BNZ passes on them you'll just end up getting blue balled by either tickets or the match timer or your p51s radiator which just randomly stops working for whatever reason.

Anyways the airacobra and kingcobra line is wayyyy better, they have a gun that actually do damage and maneuverability that actually makes you competitive in the eastern front meta. (Gaijn please add more P63 variants they're way better than the P51 lol) Theres also the F4U-B, F8F and P38 which all are much more potent planes.

Or you could just do what all the other high level players that are stomping you did and jump ship to a nation like Britain, Japan or USSR (I swear the KI-44, Yaks, I-185s, LAs all fly like ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ UFOs and shoot nukes) Because USA teams seemed to be filled with either bots or beginners, meanwhile you get matched again 4 stack level 100s all in the most meta planes.

[I AM THE LAW!]

this is why I play the 3.7 p47. you can side climb and actually make it above enemy planes, and you can enjoy your plane, even in an uptier. but the 4.7, 5.0 p47s are just not fun for me, I can do well, but not nearly as well as the razorback p47.
My advice, is bring a teammate in a good plane to cover you from those nasty premium zeros and bf109s. Otherwise, you just have to pray you get a good match.

[Arbus Arbus]

Also these planes are way more fun in Sim but gaijn did their best to kill Sim so thats not really an option anymore lol

[Tankoslav Tepyatdesyatpyatovich]

P-47 are good planes overall, powerful enough for realistic, great for arcade and I guess not bad for simulator (didn't fly them there myself, but I liked their handling in test flight, add good cockpit view of all modifications but D-22 to it). You play it as a heavier FW 190 with worse roll (no hydraulic boosters unlike for the German boy), but exceptional level flight speed at higher altitudes (and not that bad at sea level), awesome armament, fantastic dive speed and good energy retention.
P-51...the worst family of American prop fighters in my view ngl, only potentially losing to F4F Wildcat (which is an ugly duckling in an otherwise cool line of the American naval fighters), largely overrated. I tend to believe most Westerners who drool when they see a Mustang are either Americans who saw them fly during numerous airshows and got emotionally hooked or watched some movies like Red tails or something featuring this aircraft, or Europeans whose countries didn't have better props in 1940-1950s produced by own industry. I'd always prefer any other American fighter or even striker to a Mustang which is not a 4-cannon variant or A-36 due to either better combination of specs or having some exceptional specs at the cost of awful to abysmal performance in another field (like the mentioned P-47 with which you shouldn't engage into turnfights and better avoid flying too low, but which beats P-51 in armament and speed, with potential to be a swift killer no one can catch), and flying any P-51 in sim is pure torture provided it starts wobbling in yaw axis after a slightest turn, while low ammo count doesn't allow spraying and praying. And we don't have long range bombers escort missions to use C and D versions Mustangs in their designated role in which they excelled and in which neither Germans nor Soviet (which outclass Mustangs in air superiority role due to fights usually taking places much lower than 9 km of altitude) could outperform them.

TL; DR sideclimb with P-47s and use great high altitude performance (all related to speed, in the first place) of the planes to your advantage; if you're not good with P-51s, don't be upset, the D and H variants aren't really worth playing in this game.

[Spungy bob]

My guy, if you are getting outclimbed by a Zero in a P-51, you did something wrong. As a Japanese main, the Zero is not a great climber, and I'm usually one of the lowest planes on my team. Even a bone stock P-51 will outclimb a spaded Zero.

[Arbus Arbus]

Originally posted by HottestKnees:

My guy, if you are getting outclimbed by a Zero in a P-51, you did something wrong. As a Japanese main, the Zero is not a great climber, and I'm usually one of the lowest planes on my team. Even a bone stock P-51 will outclimb a spaded Zero.

its not being out climbed by Zeros its brain dead Zeros chasing you all around the map even though they'll never catch you making your BNZ passes take ages, the zero sucks though. Try the KI-44 II though you will literally be above everyone in about a minute, and you can just dictate the terms of every fight because of your climb rate.

[SuperCrumpets]

play sim

[ThatOneDisco]

Originally posted by Пожилая Юность:

P-47 are good planes overall, powerful enough for realistic, great for arcade and I guess not bad for simulator (didn't fly them there myself, but I liked their handling in test flight, add good cockpit view of all modifications but D-22 to it). You play it as a heavier FW 190 with worse roll (no hydraulic boosters unlike for the German boy), but exceptional level flight speed at higher altitudes (and not that bad at sea level), awesome armament, fantastic dive speed and good energy retention.
P-51...the worst family of American prop fighters in my view ngl, only potentially losing to F4F Wildcat (which is an ugly duckling in an otherwise cool line of the American naval fighters), largely overrated. I tend to believe most Westerners who drool when they see a Mustang are either Americans who saw them fly during numerous airshows and got emotionally hooked or watched some movies like Red tails or something featuring this aircraft, or Europeans whose countries didn't have better props in 1940-1950s produced by own industry. I'd always prefer any other American fighter or even striker to a Mustang which is not a 4-cannon variant or A-36 due to either better combination of specs or having some exceptional specs at the cost of awful to abysmal performance in another field (like the mentioned P-47 with which you shouldn't engage into turnfights and better avoid flying too low, but which beats P-51 in armament and speed, with potential to be a swift killer no one can catch), and flying any P-51 in sim is pure torture provided it starts wobbling in yaw axis after a slightest turn, while low ammo count doesn't allow spraying and praying. And we don't have long range bombers escort missions to use C and D versions Mustangs in their designated role in which they excelled and in which neither Germans nor Soviet (which outclass Mustangs in air superiority role due to fights usually taking places much lower than 9 km of altitude) could outperform them.

TL; DR sideclimb with P-47s and use great high altitude performance (all related to speed, in the first place) of the planes to your advantage; if you're not good with P-51s, don't be upset, the D and H variants aren't really worth playing in this game.

The P-51H straight up out performs nearly every BF-109 in the game at or above 16,000 feet, the problem is the vast majority of players don't ever fly that high. try flying the aircraft the way they were actually designed to be flown, you'll do a lot more damage and have a lot more fun imo.

I fly P-40s, P-47s, P-51s, and I vastly prefer the P-47s for speed, and the P-51s for climb, up until you get the P-47N. as others have said, you should really stick to a lower climb angle, and maintain a higher speed, as most of the american fighters performance peaks on faster speeds than most other aircraft at their BRs.

it's a balancing act of knowing when you CAN out turn someone, and knowing when you CAN'T, and also knowing if and when you SHOULD.

just because you can out turn someone, like the BF-109K at 14,000 feet in a P-51H, doesn't mean you should commit, because at 14,000 feet, an Me-262 will climb from the ground to you in about 30 seconds, which is easy to not notice when you're locked in on one fighter trying to kill them.

btw, the gentler climb is straight up how P-40Es ran away from early Zeros in the pacific theater, it has actual proven combat experience being a good tactic in american planes.