Why is Russian tank so stronger than other nations in same tier?

[Robbie Neng]

Or even Russian tank in lower tier, it shoots other upper tier down easier in one shot
so fantastic!!!

Russian tank is treated as spacial one?

[Tankoslav Tepyatdesyatpyatovich]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Glorified Badass:

How come T80BVM has a 52% survival rate while Leopard 2A6 has 9.9% when shot In the ammo? The T80BVM is 5x more likely to survive a shot through a fully loaded ammo rack than the Leopard. The BVM can still shoot back while the leopard can’t.

The reason the leopard survived middle of hull shot is the sheer emptiness in the middle of the hull. Every test for “3BM60 vs Leopard middle of hull” resulted in a severely damaged leopard, with (21.7%) of the time the leopard being able to shoot back. The BVM can shoot back 11/12 (92%) of the times during the same experiment.

Leopard 2a6 early 2000
T80bvm 2021
There is less time between the Maus vs T28 (soviet land ship) than the time between t80bvm vs leopard 2a6
Russian bias at its finest. Russia needs to fight NATO tanks 20-40 years its senior to stand a chance. Only in Russian games and Russia win against NATO."

1) If T-80BVM easily survives hits to the carousel from side most of the time, why won't you shoot at the gunner and commander instead? Ammo can go black and not explode, but black tanker = dead tanker, and having only 1 tanker left (driver) is enough in realistic and simulator for a tank to count as killed. Just common sense.

2) Maus fight neither T-28 nor T-35 (the actual land ship) in a standard match, and date of introduction doesn't mean that much when balancing stuff compared to actual capabilities in the game.

I wonder why people perceive it as bias when nation X gets vehicles that are several years or decades younger than vehicles of nation Y at the same br. For me, it always has been rather a compliment to the German technology of 1944-1945 that Fw 190D, Ta 152 and Bf 109K-4 fight against post-war P-51H, Bearcat, Tigercat, Yak-9P, La-9, Spitfires Mk. 22 and 24, Sea Fury and other props that were even shortly used in the Korean War. Like, doesn't that mean those fighters by Kurt Tank and Willy Messerschmitt were ahead of their time and competent against the fighters of their opponents that were yet to be designed? You as a NATO fanboy must be proud Leopard 2A6, the older vehicle, is so powerful Russia needs a T-80 modification which is younger by two decades to give a worthy rebuff...as long as both are in balance at 12.0, and I can't yet see why would T-80BVM be considered OP, especially as long as there's no statistical evidence to that from actual battles with K/D and winrate from the playerbase.

[🐾Weredragon🐲]

Самая слабая и бестолковая нация: СССР-Россия в War Thunder. Чем выше Боевой Рейтинг, тем проще уничтожать эти вёдра со взрывчаткой. О какой национализации игры может быть речь. И сколько раз было написано: Это не русская игра. Игра не для русских. Играть за такую нацию - только делать себе больно.

[Beast of War]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Eftwyrd:

Russian tanks are designed for poorly trained conscripts

This is literally the same for the US professional army, and that of EU countries as well.

Equipment may have incredible technology but it is packaged in plug & play modules, to be exchanged by a monkey if need be.

A family member who holds an OF-4 rank in the army once made me laugh when he said that he was appalled by the low quality of new recruits when my nation shifted from drafting conscripts to a professional army. Conscripts had higher IQ in general but were forced into low ranks, but those satisfied by low rank pay in professional armies are not the sharpest tools in the drawer.

[Ryan]

Heres some bias: I believe a small amount of the 2s38 were created and use for demonstration. It's a premium tank that can fill a whole team.

Then you also have a small amount of m1 abram having du hull armor yet none of the m1 have it in game.
Also the turret ring issues and not having the the apfs round that can pen the t80 frontal hull due do balancing reasons. Yet it's okay that m1 can get one shot anywhere below the turret.

Adding the pantsir when nato has no spaa to compete with it at the moment. Su 34 and ka 50 getting so many kills every game.

[Eftwyrd]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Beast of War:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Eftwyrd:

Russian tanks are designed for poorly trained conscripts

This is literally the same for the US professional army, and that of EU countries as well.

Equipment may have incredible technology but it is packaged in plug & play modules, to be exchanged by a monkey if need be.

A family member who holds an OF-4 rank in the army once made me laugh when he said that he was appalled by the low quality of new recruits when my nation shifted from drafting conscripts to a professional army. Conscripts had higher IQ in general but were forced into low ranks, but those satisfied by low rank pay in professional armies are not the sharpest tools in the drawer.

And yet western doctrine is designed around much more advanced tactics than the soviet era armoured spearheads

different nations approached this in different ways, eg the UK with its challengers desgined to engage soviet armour from hull down positions before repositioning in a fighting retreat

German leopards are designed for continous mobile engagements. though it is not really a factor in game their stabilisers remain effective over much rougher terrain than most of their counterparts

soviet era vehicles are designed to advance in large numbers. thats more or less it. And yet people in game seem to prefer brawling in flat urban terrain, the better maps were largely hated by the ignorant masses so i wonder why the western tanks arnt as good as western propaganda would have you believe...

contrary to 'common knowledge' the west was long aware soviet vehicles were not as bad as the average freeboo would have us believe, in a one on one engagement the US actually expected to lose

heres the declassified CIA analysis https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/DOC_0001066239.pdf

you will notice the US only expected to reach one on one parity with the soviet equivilents in the mid 80s, and that was based on the assumption of tech on the then prototype xm1 that was not actually included with the original production abrams.

its only surprisingly recently with its upgrades that the abrams even reached parity with russian tank design

[⚜Z3⚜ eris in cybersamsara]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von 同志:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Ranold Arzenschwegger🕹:

It's a Russian game. Unfortunately, this is the case and gaijin has no interest in a realistic representation of the tanks or historical accuracy. It's all about glorifying the Russian nation.

if it were realistic, then a Leopard 2 could not be destroyed head-on by a T-90, for example. Gaijin generally adds weakspots to all other nations that do not correspond to reality and reinforces the Russian models with armor or ERA reactive armor. However, the fact that the ERA does not work in practice is ignored by gaijin.

Also, anti-tank missiles of all other nations are enormously weakened. The Spikes and the TOW-2, for example, would 100% detonate a Russian tank immediately on the first hit. In the game, however, this only happens in the rarest of cases. Most rockets do no or very little damage. But if a BMP-2 hits a Leopard 2 A7, it will explode immediately in the game. There is a system behind it. But many don't want to admit it. That's really sad.

Interesting take...
Wrong, but interesting. But considering youre another one of those "muh russian bias" posters....who ignores the actual explanations people have brought up and seem to block anyone who doesnt follow your baseless claims. Tells me, and everyone else, that you arent to be listened to. You just want people to follow blindly behind you, and your baseless accusations.

the "im right, because I say so." mentality. Never is any evidence provided, that is actually solid. At best its usually data that has alot of factors incorporated into the final data. Or the other thing, that is usually what happens 90% of the time. "Trust me bro. I know, therefore it is fact."

Many things happen in the game, that occurs for every nation, that people can equate to some "bias". But people like you, only tunnel vision and focus on 1 of those nations...sometimes 2, if you are extra bias yourself.

Most of these "bias" claims are ill-informed, bias opinions, or have another purpose behind it, that are usually not accepting they made a mistake. Or the thought process "Everything Russian = bad" mentality.

im pretty sure its a copy pasta. i swear i saw this the last time this thread was around.

[Smokey]

skill issue

[Deadwinter]

Yup it is a law in ruzzie for gaming to promote the nation so the devs make fake stats for ruzzie tanks/planes...

[76561199636681007]

The age-old question. Why are Russian tanks so much stronger than everyone else’s in the same tier? It’s a mystery wrapped in an enigma wrapped in pure Soviet engineering magic. Seriously, when you fire a shot at a T-34, it’s like you’re shooting at a tank made of solid steel, reinforced by the spirit of Mother Russia herself. Meanwhile, the same tier tanks from other nations crumble like paper at the first sign of a Russian shell.

And Russian tanks in lower tiers. It’s like they’ve been blessed by the game’s developers. One shot, and suddenly that tank in the higher tier is gone. A magical, Soviet-level skill that defies all logic and balance – but hey, who needs balance when you’ve got Russian tanks in your corner?

But hey, it’s not bias. It’s realism. Any russian will tell you it's "a skill issue" :-)

[Manski]

If only the people calling it Russian bias ever played Russian tanks, so they can find out what stinkers some of them are

[jaxjace]

show me on the doll where russia hurt you.

[mans got drip✅]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Ranold Arzenschwegger🕹:

It's a Russian game. Unfortunately, this is the case and gaijin has no interest in a realistic representation of the tanks or historical accuracy. It's all about glorifying the Russian nation.

if it were realistic, then a Leopard 2 could not be destroyed head-on by a T-90, for example. Gaijin generally adds weakspots to all other nations that do not correspond to reality and reinforces the Russian models with armor or ERA reactive armor. However, the fact that the ERA does not work in practice is ignored by gaijin.

Also, anti-tank missiles of all other nations are enormously weakened. The Spikes and the TOW-2, for example, would 100% detonate a Russian tank immediately on the first hit. In the game, however, this only happens in the rarest of cases. Most rockets do no or very little damage. But if a BMP-2 hits a Leopard 2 A7, it will explode immediately in the game. There is a system behind it. But many don't want to admit it. That's really sad.

Source: I dreamt it

[Dr. Evin]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von BlackWolf9988:

another day another muh russian bias post

bc its since the closed beta in groundforces. i've playing for over 10 years and nothing has changed. anyone get the great experience with the 128mm Jagdtiger vs T34 frontal driver hatch? a meme since then. Sometime better sometimes GF is unplayable.

And not only the tanks himself, altough the MM, the mapdesign and which spawn the russian gets (guess what, mostly the easy), the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ nuclear sun burning your eyes if you try to the russkies facing you.

No matter which nation you play Mother russia is the greatest.

[Атомный]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Dr. Evin:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von BlackWolf9988:

another day another muh russian bias post

anyone get the great experience with the 128mm Jagdtiger vs T34 frontal driver hatch?

And not only the tanks himself, altough the MM, the mapdesign and which spawn the russian gets (guess what, mostly the easy), the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ nuclear sun burning your eyes if you try to the russkies facing you.

Hatch, should be the last place you shoot. Before Volumetric is was wonky. Then Volumetric made it worse...and volumetric effects other nations as well. but hey "muh russian bias."

Oh, and the second part is just getting into some serious tinfoil hat, living in a camper in the mountain side, type stuff.

Any excuse as to why you died to someone. Guess its better to complain about an imaginary issue, and create any excuse under the sun (no pun intended), as to why you lost an engagement, that you originally had the upperhand, because you fumbled the bag.

[Атомный]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Rambo Buddha:

The age-old question. Why are Russian tanks so much stronger than everyone else’s in the same tier? It’s a mystery wrapped in an enigma wrapped in pure Soviet engineering magic. Seriously, when you fire a shot at a T-34, it’s like you’re shooting at a tank made of solid steel, reinforced by the spirit of Mother Russia herself. Meanwhile, the same tier tanks from other nations crumble like paper at the first sign of a Russian shell.

And Russian tanks in lower tiers. It’s like they’ve been blessed by the game’s developers. One shot, and suddenly that tank in the higher tier is gone. A magical, Soviet-level skill that defies all logic and balance – but hey, who needs balance when you’ve got Russian tanks in your corner?

But hey, it’s not bias. It’s realism. Any russian will tell you it's "a skill issue" :-)

So most of the problem at lower tier, are people who dont even know how shell types work yet, and bunch of other factors leading up to the shooting and knocking someone out. So of course when they shoot a sloped armor, effected by volumetric, with a cannon that is like 50mm, and the round ricochets, its easy to complain about "bias", than to realize the common dominator in the situation, every single time.

If you are having trouble with Soviet tanks like that, especially low tier. I suggest watching videos on weakspots, and learning them. They are very easy to knock out. Except it tanks brain power outside the "hehe hold W, 88mm cannon, im invincible, kill everything" mentality.

Lastly, its not just Russians who deny it. People like me, neither Russian/Russian main, nor a dev.

*But hey, anything make it seem like the user isnt the issue. If the off chance its not the player, there are a bunch of other things that occur, that are weird, and shouldnt happen....but this happens for EVERY nation, not just Soviets. Its just easier to focus purely on one nation, "cuz dat where devs from! must be bias!"