Ask chat gpt about lower front plate (LFP) of the M1 Abrams series

[EEE]

In **War Thunder**, the **lower front plate (LFP) of the M1 Abrams series** is often considered **too weak compared to real-world estimations**. Many players have criticized the game’s modeling of **KE (Kinetic Energy) and CE (Chemical Energy) protection** for the LFP, especially when facing high-penetration **APFSDS rounds**.

---

### **Key Problems with M1 Abrams LFP in War Thunder**
#### **1. Unrealistically Low KE Protection**
- In-game, the **LFP protection is much lower than real-world estimates**.
- Many high-tier **APFSDS rounds (e.g., 3BM42 Mango, DM53, etc.)** penetrate the LFP with ease, whereas in real life, modern **Abrams variants (M1A2 SEP v2/v3)** should have **~600mm RHAe vs KE threats**.

#### **2. CE (Chemical Energy) Protection Issues**
- The in-game LFP is **extremely vulnerable to HEAT-FS rounds**, including older **Cold War-era rounds** that should not be effective against later Abrams models.
- Real-world **Chobham/Dorchester composite armor** and **anti-HEAT layering** should offer better protection.

#### **3. Overperformance of Soviet/Russian Ammo**
- Many **Russian tanks (T-80, T-90, etc.)** can easily penetrate the LFP with **APFSDS rounds** that, in reality, might struggle against later Abrams variants.
- Some Soviet **3BM42 (Mango) and 3BM60 rounds** penetrate the Abrams LFP **too easily compared to real-world data**.

#### **4. Lack of ERA/TUSK Representation**
- **TUSK armor packages** (which include ERA and additional plating on the LFP) are missing in War Thunder.
- This makes Abrams variants much weaker in **urban combat scenarios**, unlike their real-world counterparts.

#### **5. Lack of Realistic Armor Angling Effects**
- The **lower front plate is angled**, meaning real-world performance should have more **deflections** and increased effective armor.
- In War Thunder, **angle effectiveness seems reduced**, making the LFP easier to penetrate than it should be.

---

### **How Does This Affect Gameplay?**
- **Abrams tanks are easily knocked out** by **front-on shots**, even from tanks they should be resistant to.
- Players must rely on **hull-down positions** to avoid exposing the weak LFP.
- Many **late Cold War tanks (T-72B, T-80U, etc.)** can penetrate Abrams LFP more easily than real-world reports suggest.

---

### **Possible Fixes War Thunder Should Implement**
1. **Increase KE protection** (~500–600mm RHAe on M1A2 SEP v2/v3).
2. **Improve CE resistance** (~800–900mm RHAe vs HEAT).
3. **Properly model armor angling benefits**.
4. **Add TUSK armor options** for urban protection.
5. **Rebalance Soviet/Russian APFSDS performance** to match real-world values.

Would you like a comparison with specific in-game tanks?

[EEE]

Ask gpt for ref

The concerns about the **M1 Abrams' lower front plate (LFP) armor in War Thunder** are based on a mix of **real-world armor estimations, developer statements, and in-game observations**. Here are references and sources to support my answer:

---

### **1. Real-World M1 Abrams Armor Estimates**
- **Primary Sources:**
- "M1 Abrams at War" by Michael Green (Armor & protection details).
- "Tank War: Central Front NATO vs Warsaw Pact" by Steven Zaloga (Estimates of armor protection).
- U.S. Army FSTC (Foreign Science and Technology Center) reports on armor performance (declassified portions).

- **Estimated Lower Front Plate (LFP) Protection:**
- **KE Resistance:** ~450–600mm RHAe (varies by variant).
- **CE Resistance:** ~700–900mm RHAe (due to composite armor & spaced layering).

---

### **2. War Thunder-Specific Evidence**
- **Gaijin’s Armor Modeling:**
- **Datamining & Armor Viewer (X-ray mode in-game)** → Shows LFP as a weak point.
- War Thunder’s **DeviantArt armor model leaks** (various sources, not official but widely analyzed).
- **War Thunder Dev Server tests**: Community members conduct live-fire tests to determine real in-game protection values.

- **Common Issues Reported by Players & Content Creators:**
- **YouTube/Twitch War Thunder tank reviewers:**
- *Spookston* → Frequent criticisms of Abrams' weak lower plate.
- *PhlyDaily* → Notes on Abrams being overmatched by Soviet APFSDS.
- *OddBawZ* → Regularly discusses War Thunder armor inconsistencies.

- **Forum Discussions & Bug Reports:**
- War Thunder official forums → **Players have reported Abrams LFP underperforming vs real-world estimations.**
- **Reddit War Thunder Community r/Warthunder** → Frequent posts discussing **APFSDS overperformance against the Abrams**.

---

### **3. Overperformance of Soviet APFSDS Rounds in War Thunder**
- **Soviet APFSDS rounds in War Thunder (especially 3BM42, 3BM46, and 3BM60) appear stronger than real-world estimates.**
- Real-world penetration data from:
- **U.S. Army TRADOC (Training and Doctrine Command) reports**.
- **Russian Army technical manuals** (limited declassified info).
- In-game testing shows **Russian tanks penetrate Abrams LFP too easily**.

---

### **Conclusion: War Thunder's Abrams LFP Needs Rebalancing**
- **Real-world Abrams armor estimates do not match in-game performance.**
- **Gaijin’s modeling may underestimate composite armor effectiveness.**
- **APFSDS rounds from Soviet/Russian tanks may be overperforming.**
- **Community feedback and dev server tests confirm that Abrams tanks are too weak in the LFP.**

Would you like links to specific forum discussions or community tests?

[Akagi]

Cool, now go ahead and ask Chat GPT for a recommended end game armor set in MHGU for the greatsword. Let's see how many armor sets it's going to spit out that aren't even in the game.

[^4Steel ^1Jackal^2~FYANB~]

source:it made it the * insert a10 brrt noise here * up

[ikstarven]

Originally posted by ^4Steel ^1Jackal^2~FYANB~:

source:it made it the * insert a10 brrt noise here * up

even if it had a source, gaijin will never change it lmao, they don't even acknowledge manufacturer's statements, they only trust their own "sources" which just highball everything russian and lowball nato

[Ranold Arzenschwegger🕹]

It's no longer a secret that gaijin doesn't stick to real values.

The Natopanzers were intentionally depicted so weak in War Thunder to make the glorious Russian tanks look better.

Leopard 2, for example. The hull armor of the Leopard 2A4-2A7 is almost frontally impenetrable for the Soviet KE shells.
The Abrams is definitely weaker armored in reality, but not as depicted in the game. This also applies to the Challanger 2, Leclerc and even Ariete.

If you can google, you will quickly find what you are looking for.
The only ones that will not be significantly weakened are the Russian tanks. These are sometimes even portrayed more strongly than they are in reality.

The ERA reactive armor, for example, has proven to be not nearly as effective in real battles as shown in the game. The Soviet T-models are also extremely susceptible to rocket fire. The tower roof can withstand much less in real life than shown in the game. The game is programmed by Russians. The developers spin it the way they like it. Unfortunately, we will have to live with this and draw our own conclusions from it.

But I'm glad that there is more and more resistance to this that gaijin puts the players through here.

[Kay]

if you can't be bothered to write your post/research your topic, I can't be bothered to read what you've posted.

Originally posted by Ranold Arzenschwegger🕹:

It's no longer a secret that gaijin doesn't stick to real values.

They literally stated it when getting into modern tanks because there are no reliable figures for their armour protection.

[Eftwyrd]

Are people really this ignorant they are taking anything 'AI' says seriously

with the right prompts you can get chat gpt to give you a recipe that uses cyanide as seasoning

nothing about it is intelligent, its just pattern matching based on whatever it was trained on, which might just have involved posts like this with zero value

and from that extremely low bar can be further broken by continuing to prompt it with unrealistic scenarios or roleplay to say just about anything you want it to

nevermind hallucination which can lead to ai providing incorrect but plausible sounding answers because that it sounds plausible is all it really cares about, actually being correct is something completely different it has no real way of determining

so now we have this wonderful feedback loop of worthless drivel where your own
worthless posts will be scraped by bots to use as inputs to provide just as worthless answers to future prompts too

[Betrayer]

you should ask the AI about US team mates at top tier aswell
im actually curious about that lol

[Franss the Coffee Addict]

Originally posted by Akagi:

Cool, now go ahead and ask Chat GPT for a recommended end game armor set in MHGU for the greatsword. Let's see how many armor sets it's going to spit out that aren't even in the game.

Youre not allowed to do that

[Franss the Coffee Addict]

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

Are people really this ignorant they are taking anything 'AI' says seriously

There's even a substory in Like a Dragon Gaiden where a young man uses a machine learning AI on almost everything called "seeking advice". Yes even to try to date a gril

Honestly wouldnt be suprised

[󠀡󠀡󠀡⁧⁧Myrkkysieni]

Butlerian Jihad when?

[legaroojack]

Ah yes chat GPT thats totally not wrong the majority of the time.

[legaroojack]

Originally posted by 󠀡󠀡󠀡⁧⁧Hirtehinen:

Butlerian Jihad when?

Any day now brother