The new "Severe Damage" mechanic has made air battles worse

[Cyrus]

I've played a dozen battles since they're introduced the mechanic, and not once do I feel like I've been rewarded for my performance more than I would have been under the old crit system. Way back before the Severe Damage changes (anytime before February 15th, two and a half weeks ago now, even before they officially turned the system on) you would be rewarded crits for setting fire to enemies, blowing off wings, etc. This system rewarded you more for systematic kills against the enemy, where you destroyed specific modules of the aircraft (or set fire, which would accomplish this for you). With multiple crits, you would receive more SL and RP than for just a kill, which was a good way for rewarding a player for sticking with a tough enemy and putting themselves at risk in the process. Now that you don't get a crit for doing those things, and instead you just get 80% of the kill, you don't get any extra reward for killing tough enemies - at best you will get one kill. In addition, since enemies are now not considered killed until they hit the ground or are completely eviscerated, players are encouraged to shoot at crippled (and ostensibly "dead") enemies instead of the combat-effective players. Moreover, the now-broken crit system is still used for battlepass tasks, making the those tasks FAR more difficult to achieve.

This tirade is honestly more about how they've crippled the critical hit mechanic to get the Severe Damage mechanic implemented, but I consider this a failure of the new mechanic as the broken crit system seems to be a result of the new mechanic. Lord knows its only "seems" because they won't outright confirm or deny it.

What did Gaijin expect this mechanic to do? To make the game more fun to play? Because its done nothing but make kills less satisfying and less rewarding.

[KiriOkami]

I honestly hate this mechanic, people now tend to just furball even im matches that are not toptier, it's just annoying at this point. I hated the mechanic and I still do. I think the idea is right but the way they implemented it is just bad.

[Ulvhamne]

Can't really say I've noticed any furball tendency changes, they were always happening, in low tier as well as high tier.

[Spungy bob]

I dunno, I kinda like the new Severe damage mechanic, I tend to get it a lot and it helps to know what I have actually done to the aircraft. I have gotten crit markers and the dude is just fine, this helps clarify it a little bit. Then again, just my opinion

[Spungy bob]

Red a écrit :

Kitty Cat a écrit :

LMFAO, have you ever used 7.7s?

Was literally going to say, check out this chad one shotting everyone with 7.7s xD
I guess does a lot of head ons where he knocks the pilot but also dies as well so it doesnt count.

I despise 7.7s, you could be hitting the engine or pilot area and get hits, I very rarely get crits in the first place, it's always hits or they die

[Su1cid3r]

It's a win some, loose some situation here. I understand what the OP is saying about crits, in an air arcade match with 10 Kills and 3 assists, I only got 2 critical hits. This makes the 100 Critical Hits task pretty much impossible. I didn't notice any difference in RP or SL gain though. It also make the tasks requiring Kills a tad easier and if you get a severe damage on you first pass you don't have to waste any more energy turning around to confirm a kill, you can just leave them for someone else to finish off . So much better for you own survive-ability. And you also don't see a lot of complaining in the chat anymore about kill stealing. Everybody's happy lol. So all in all, I believe it's a step in the right direction, it maybe needs some improvements of course.

[Cyrus]

Su1cid3r a écrit :

I didn't notice any difference in RP or SL gain though.

This is really interesting to me, because ostensibly you're now getting less points, especially when one player does severe damage and another finishes off the enemy. In that case, one player gets 80% of a kill reward, and the other gets 40%. Assuming that an assist was around 40% (I can't find a number for assists but that sounds about right), the other player is getting only 80% of a kill when they would have gotten a 100% of a kill before. That's 20% lost to the ether. (Granted, before this change it was the player that landed the killing blow that got the kill, and the one that landed a crit on the enemy that got the assist, but I don't think that flipping that is worth losing 20% of the kill reward). This is all in addition to the aforementioned change making crits harder to achieve, making it harder for you to get any sort of additional reward for careful play.

So, if you're not noticing a reduction in rewards, maybe Gaijin actually did re-balance some things? I doubt it, given their track record of slowly making the game harder and harder to progress in, and Lord knows they won't just TELL us about those sorts of changes.

Su1cid3r a écrit :

you can just leave them for someone else to finish off .

This brings up an interesting point - I think one of the bigger issues with the mechanic is that other players have no indication that the enemy is severely damaged. The player who severely damages the enemy gets notified that the enemy is crippled, but that damage is not always easily visible. It feels somewhat unfair for crippled enemies to appear just as dangerous as ones that aren't crippled, it could lead to players wrongly prioritizing an enemy that they only get 40% reward for killing. If I knew that I wasn't going to be fully or even half rewarded for killing a particular enemy, I wouldn't go after them. But under this system, I CAN'T know. And that's frustrating.

[Su1cid3r]

Cyrus a écrit :

Su1cid3r a écrit :

I didn't notice any difference in RP or SL gain though.

So, if you're not noticing a reduction in rewards, maybe Gaijin actually did re-balance some things? I doubt it, given their track record of slowly making the game harder and harder to progress in, and Lord knows they won't just TELL us about those sorts of changes.

Su1cid3r a écrit :

you can just leave them for someone else to finish off .

I'm not saying you're wrong here, just that for similar matches, i didn't notice a difference that would make me go, wait something is wrong here, like in the case of crits which is dead obvious.

Cyrus a écrit :

Su1cid3r a écrit :

I didn't notice any difference in RP or SL gain though.

This brings up an interesting point - I think one of the bigger issues with the mechanic is that other players have no indication that the enemy is severely damaged. The player who severely damages the enemy gets notified that the enemy is crippled, but that damage is not always easily visible. It feels somewhat unfair for crippled enemies to appear just as dangerous as ones that aren't crippled, it could lead to players wrongly prioritizing an enemy that they only get 40% reward for killing. If I knew that I wasn't going to be fully or even half rewarded for killing a particular enemy, I wouldn't go after them. But under this system, I CAN'T know. And that's frustrating.

Yep, again not saying your points aren't valid and not just prioritizing for rewards but also to what danger an enemy poses. That's why I said, win some, loose some on this one. We'll just have to wait and see what the general consensus will be. But for sure, I just lost my favorite , stress free task (Critical hits) :(

[Ulvhamne]

Cyrus a écrit :

Su1cid3r a écrit :

I didn't notice any difference in RP or SL gain though.

This is really interesting to me, because ostensibly you're now getting less points, especially when one player does severe damage and another finishes off the enemy. In that case, one player gets 80% of a kill reward, and the other gets 40%. Assuming that an assist was around 40% (I can't find a number for assists but that sounds about right), the other player is getting only 80% of a kill when they would have gotten a 100% of a kill before. That's 20% lost to the ether. (Granted, before this change it was the player that landed the killing blow that got the kill, and the one that landed a crit on the enemy that got the assist, but I don't think that flipping that is worth losing 20% of the kill reward). This is all in addition to the aforementioned change making crits harder to achieve, making it harder for you to get any sort of additional reward for careful play.

So, if you're not noticing a reduction in rewards, maybe Gaijin actually did re-balance some things? I doubt it, given their track record of slowly making the game harder and harder to progress in, and Lord knows they won't just TELL us about those sorts of changes.

Su1cid3r a écrit :

you can just leave them for someone else to finish off .

This brings up an interesting point - I think one of the bigger issues with the mechanic is that other players have no indication that the enemy is severely damaged. The player who severely damages the enemy gets notified that the enemy is crippled, but that damage is not always easily visible. It feels somewhat unfair for crippled enemies to appear just as dangerous as ones that aren't crippled, it could lead to players wrongly prioritizing an enemy that they only get 40% reward for killing. If I knew that I wasn't going to be fully or even half rewarded for killing a particular enemy, I wouldn't go after them. But under this system, I CAN'T know. And that's frustrating.

There are still the same number of kills being had, more or less. But now, for "kill steals" there is 20% more rewards in total than there was before, because the severe damage nets you 80% of the total kill, and of someone else finishes them off, they get 40%. If you finish them off or they just crash, you get the remaining 20%.
So, technically, there should be a slight bit more rewards for the same match now.

[Cyrus]

Ulvhamne a écrit :

for "kill steals" there is 20% more rewards in total than there was before, because the severe damage nets you 80% of the total kill, and of someone else finishes them off, they get 40%. If you finish them off or they just crash, you get the remaining 20%.
So, technically, there should be a slight bit more rewards for the same match now.

I don't think that math is quite right - or, rather, it is assuming that before there was only 100% of a kill reward available, which isn't correct.

Before the Severe Damage changes, a "kill steal" or assist scenario would net the player that crippled the enemy an assist, and the player that finished off the enemy a kill. That's (what I assume to be, as I don't have solid numbers on how much an Assist is worth) 40% of a kill reward for player 1, and 100% of a kill reward for player 2. 40%+100%=140%

After the Severe Damage changes, player 1 gets 80% of a kill reward for Severely Damaging and enemy, and player 2 gets 40% of a kill reward for finishing off a Severely Damaged foe. 80%+40%=120%

So, unless my assumption about assists being worth roughly 40% of a kill is wrong, and they're actually worth 20% or less of a kill, there's now less reward given to the players involved in this scenario, the scenario this new mechanic was ostensibly introduced to improve.

In addition (and sorry to be a broken record on this point but) now that some forms of damage that used to be crits are now just severe damage, we're losing out on even more battle rewards that we would have had before, beyond the aforementioned 20%ish difference.

[Cyrus]

Su1cid3r a écrit :

Yep, again not saying your points aren't valid and not just prioritizing for rewards but also to what danger an enemy poses. That's why I said, win some, loose some on this one. We'll just have to wait and see what the general consensus will be. But for sure, I just lost my favorite , stress free task (Critical hits) :(

We're on the same page brother That task is what made me aware of the change in crits, actually. I guess Gaijin doesn't like it when we have a stress-free gaming experience :^)

[Black_Fox]

Cyrus a écrit :

Ulvhamne a écrit :

for "kill steals" there is 20% more rewards in total than there was before, because the severe damage nets you 80% of the total kill, and of someone else finishes them off, they get 40%. If you finish them off or they just crash, you get the remaining 20%.
So, technically, there should be a slight bit more rewards for the same match now.

I don't think that math is quite right - or, rather, it is assuming that before there was only 100% of a kill reward available, which isn't correct.

Before the Severe Damage changes, a "kill steal" or assist scenario would net the player that crippled the enemy an assist, and the player that finished off the enemy a kill. That's (what I assume to be, as I don't have solid numbers on how much an Assist is worth) 40% of a kill reward for player 1, and 100% of a kill reward for player 2. 40%+100%=140%

After the Severe Damage changes, player 1 gets 80% of a kill reward for Severely Damaging and enemy, and player 2 gets 40% of a kill reward for finishing off a Severely Damaged foe. 80%+40%=120%

So, unless my assumption about assists being worth roughly 40% of a kill is wrong, and they're actually worth 20% or less of a kill, there's now less reward given to the players involved in this scenario, the scenario this new mechanic was ostensibly introduced to improve.

In addition (and sorry to be a broken record on this point but) now that some forms of damage that used to be crits are now just severe damage, we're losing out on even more battle rewards that we would have had before, beyond the aforementioned 20%ish difference.

An assist gave 25% beforehand and 100% for a kill. So a killstealer would have gotten the full reward and the guy setting the enemy on lethal fire only 1/4 of it.

Cyrus a écrit :

Su1cid3r a écrit :

Yep, again not saying your points aren't valid and not just prioritizing for rewards but also to what danger an enemy poses. That's why I said, win some, loose some on this one. We'll just have to wait and see what the general consensus will be. But for sure, I just lost my favorite , stress free task (Critical hits) :(

We're on the same page brother That task is what made me aware of the change in crits, actually. I guess Gaijin doesn't like it when we have a stress-free gaming experience :^)

It makes kills and multiple strike tasks easier though

[Cyrus]

Black_Fox a écrit :

An assist gave 25% beforehand and 100% for a kill. So a killstealer would have gotten the full reward and the guy setting the enemy on lethal fire only 1/4 of it.

Ah, so it was 25% and not 40%? If that's the case, that still means that there's less points awarded now, but if the drop is only 5% its not quite as bitter a pill to swallow. I still don't understand why Gaijin felt the need to reward players less, though.

Still mad about the crits though :(

[Black_Fox]

Cyrus a écrit :

Black_Fox a écrit :

An assist gave 25% beforehand and 100% for a kill. So a killstealer would have gotten the full reward and the guy setting the enemy on lethal fire only 1/4 of it.

Ah, so it was 25% and not 40%? If that's the case, that still means that there's less points awarded now, but if the drop is only 5% its not quite as bitter a pill to swallow. I still don't understand why Gaijin felt the need to reward players less, though.

Still mad about the crits though :(

In comparison we get actually more, a kill will still give you the full reward - 80% on severe damage and the additional 20% of the overall reward if you get the kill message.

And you still get a kill credited
If somebody else finishes the enemy up

[cercata]

Yes, behind the severe damage update, they nerfed the crits, typical snail XD

[Cyrus]

Black_Fox a écrit :

And you still get a kill credited
If somebody else finishes the enemy up

It counts as a kill in your statistics even if someone else finishes off the enemy, yes, but you don't get the last 20% of the kill reward in this situation. You only get the 80% for crippling the enemy.