I hate CAS

[lathrix army]

i have played almost every country from 2.0-6.7 to try and avoid CAS but no matter what if i start doing good or start driving out of spawn i get a 1000kg bomb dropped in my face

how about open tops/AA both of these are susceptible to strafing or HE rockets and bombs with almost no protection making some of the most fun vehicles not fun because of CAS

light armored cars have the same problem with strafing and some planes even have cannons like the ME 262 A1/U4 witch has one tapped many of my heavier tanks like the Jumbo or M26 or maybe the Is-1/2 no matter what tier i go to planes with big bombs follow me and it only makes the game less fun

please for the sake of my sanity give me pure tanks

[𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner]

There was actually one brief update that introduced what I suspect was a bug into the game, but made AA feel so much better. For one limited update, I don't remember which or when, you were able to lock onto vehicles in RB like you were in arcade.

You didn't have the lead indicator, but it made it feel a lot easier to play AA because you could consistently track and your biggest worry would be just leading the target properly. The biggest issue was that every ground vehicle could lock, so Americas cult of the 50cal was outperforming AA anyway.

[Eftwyrd]

Originally posted by lathrix army:

please for the sake of my sanity give me pure tanks

This is one thing you will never get and I thank gaijin for maintaining that stance, if you want to talk ways to mitigate cas impact I’m perfectly content to discuss and have plenty of ideas that would make it anywhere from harder to near impossible for the pilots while still giving us a chance to try, personally I would enjoy the challenge, but when the anti cas crowd insists on playing the all or nothing card I will fight you to the last.

Combined arms has been fundamental to warthunder from day one, if you joined the wrong game that’s tough, it’s in every description of the game ever, if they change that now however that will be a deal breaker for many of us long term players. I have written essays on this forum on why splitting the modes and including both would likely lead to the slow death of one or the other, tearing gaijins priorities in multiple directions as they try to appease not one but two playerbase hostile to each other, as well as losing the barrier and unique selling point that makes warthunder different from its biggest competitor

[lathrix army]

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

Originally posted by lathrix army:

please for the sake of my sanity give me pure tanks

This is one thing you will never get and I thank gaijin for maintaining that stance, if you want to talk ways to mitigate cas impact I’m perfectly content to discuss and have plenty of ideas that would make it anywhere from harder to near impossible for the pilots while still giving us a chance to try, personally I would enjoy the challenge, but when the anti cas crowd insists on playing the all or nothing card I will fight you to the last.

it doesnt need to be no CAS like i previously stated (after 5 games of multiple deaths to CAS) but it definitely needs to be harder like maybe planes shouldnt be able to see the cap points

[Cha Cha Real Rough]

I dont think cas should be removed, because I like to shoot down the planes, but it probably would be better if planes required more spawn points

[Eftwyrd]

Originally posted by lathrix army:

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

This is one thing you will never get and I thank gaijin for maintaining that stance, if you want to talk ways to mitigate cas impact I’m perfectly content to discuss and have plenty of ideas that would make it anywhere from harder to near impossible for the pilots while still giving us a chance to try, personally I would enjoy the challenge, but when the anti cas crowd insists on playing the all or nothing card I will fight you to the last.

it doesnt need to be no CAS like i previously stated (after 5 games of multiple deaths to CAS) but it definitely needs to be harder like maybe planes shouldnt be able to see the cap points

My answer is to reintroduce some of the old extreme weather states

So back in the day when sim air was its own mode with regular matchmaking rather than hidden in the events menu we had some different weathers you could see, one particular match I recall occurred at night in a storm. Zero visibility for aircraft all the way up to about 5000m when you broke through the top of the clouds, in and below the clouds being blown around by strong winds and having to navigate by instruments because you couldn’t see landmarks, it’s easy to get disoriented and not even be aware you are flying upside down if you are not paying close attention, most players in that match crashed and there were zero actual kills

I would be all for filthy weather conditions being added, ground vehicles can fight in a storm that would ground all but the most suicidal pilots, I would enjoy the challenge of trying even so. Now this wouldn’t be every match but it would give some variety

[SpiralRazor]

Originally posted by Cha Cha Real Rough:

I dont think cas should be removed, because I like to shoot down the planes, but it probably would be better if planes required more spawn points

Like ..triple the spawn points. Not rush to cap, die, and spawn in death heli/death jet.

[Eftwyrd]

Originally posted by SpiralRazor:

Originally posted by Cha Cha Real Rough:

I dont think cas should be removed, because I like to shoot down the planes, but it probably would be better if planes required more spawn points

Like ..triple the spawn points. Not rush to cap, die, and spawn in death heli/death jet.

I would also argue and hear me out, lower spawn points for dedicated air to air, there is a huge untapped playerbase bored in air rb who would happily first spawn a fighter to hunt down all the ground pounders, they are the bottom of the food chain in air modes and flying CAP would be more interesting in a lot of ways

[𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner]

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

I would also argue and hear me out, lower spawn points for dedicated air to air, there is a huge untapped playerbase bored in air rb who would happily first spawn a fighter to hunt down all the ground pounders, they are the bottom of the food chain in air modes and flying CAP would be more interesting in a lot of ways

The issue lies with Gajins inability to decide how to properly manage SP. A lot of fighters have potential to carry bombs. Sure, maybe one or two kills, but probably would get the same effect with a ground pounder.

Doesn't help that them introducing the loadout selector, which isn't a bad system tbh, complicates their SP mathematics.

[Eftwyrd]

Originally posted by 『Sinner』:

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

I would also argue and hear me out, lower spawn points for dedicated air to air, there is a huge untapped playerbase bored in air rb who would happily first spawn a fighter to hunt down all the ground pounders, they are the bottom of the food chain in air modes and flying CAP would be more interesting in a lot of ways

The issue lies with Gajins inability to decide how to properly manage SP. A lot of fighters have potential to carry bombs. Sure, maybe one or two kills, but probably would get the same effect with a ground pounder.

Doesn't help that them introducing the loadout selector, which isn't a bad system tbh, complicates their SP mathematics.

They just need to have an SP cost per bomb, and not give free reloads so you have to pay it again each time. While the skilled would be able to keep the snowball rolling a lot would not. It’s not a complete answer but it’s a start, but this is why we need people discussing actual answers rather than ‘hurr durr remove it completely’

If all those idiots in the remove CAS megathread actually put some effort into discussing rebalance solutions rather than circle jerking over their all or nothing idea with no chance of success we could have actually come up with something reasonable, and for all the hate the latest generation of forumgoers throws their way and like to claim otherwise, gaijin have taken ideas on in the past. The anti CAS crowd just need to come to the discussion with something less than absolute removal

[lathrix army]

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

Originally posted by 『Sinner』:

The issue lies with Gajins inability to decide how to properly manage SP. A lot of fighters have potential to carry bombs. Sure, maybe one or two kills, but probably would get the same effect with a ground pounder.

Doesn't help that them introducing the loadout selector, which isn't a bad system tbh, complicates their SP mathematics.

They just need to have an SP cost per bomb, and not give free reloads so you have to pay it again each time. While the skilled would be able to keep the snowball rolling a lot would not. It’s not a complete answer but it’s a start, but this is why we need people discussing actual answers rather than ‘hurr durr remove it completely’

If all those idiots in the remove CAS megathread actually put some effort into discussing rebalance solutions rather than circle jerking over their all or nothing idea with no chance of success we could have actually come up with something reasonable, and for all the hate the latest generation of forumgoers throws their way and like to claim otherwise, gaijin have taken ideas on in the past. The anti CAS crowd just need to come to the discussion with something less than absolute removal

honestly another thing could be limiting the amount of planes there can be cause i have seen over half the team be in planes before and while sure you can cap the points its also really boring and annoying when you die without being able to fight back

[mogami_99]

I only hate CAS when it is my team being killed.

[Eftwyrd]

Originally posted by Venom Thanos:

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

They just need to have an SP cost per bomb, and not give free reloads so you have to pay it again each time. While the skilled would be able to keep the snowball rolling a lot would not. It’s not a complete answer but it’s a start, but this is why we need people discussing actual answers rather than ‘hurr durr remove it completely’

If all those idiots in the remove CAS megathread actually put some effort into discussing rebalance solutions rather than circle jerking over their all or nothing idea with no chance of success we could have actually come up with something reasonable, and for all the hate the latest generation of forumgoers throws their way and like to claim otherwise, gaijin have taken ideas on in the past. The anti CAS crowd just need to come to the discussion with something less than absolute removal

Didn't anti CAS crowd also suggested something like adding a new ground only vehicles mode?? How was that not a proper solution lmao

CAS degens:
wRoNg GaMe BrO, gO pLaY wOt

ThIs Is A pLaNe GaMe, pLaNe Is HeRe FiRsT, rEmEmBeR tHaT

I will happily repeat my essay if you require, I posted it at least four times in that mega thread and no one so much as came up with a counter argument

there are multiple problems with splitting the playerbase not limited to potential queue times (no one here has the data to refute), for those of you who are evidently newer some food for thought, modes have already died due to this, you don’t just have to be good at peek times but also the dead zones between on the least populated servers, sim air and ground which used to be distinct queues are now relegated to events and between the lowered population and different mechanics you can’t even consistently play the lineups you want

split priorities with gaijin having to appease not one but two playerbase hostile to each others existence, as well as a lowered threshhold for jumping ship as they would essentially be reducing the differences between them and their nearest competitor, the threats of large portions of their playerbase leaving if their competitor then makes a change they are not willing to match blow to blow could see mass player migration, and if they do match the, blow for blow they risk alienating the other portion of the playerbase

and the slowly changing demographics as risk averse new players choose the lower skill threshold without CAS and over time simply stick with it, slowly bleeding dry the mode that keeps some of us older players around as we receive fewer of the newer players which will aggravate the other problems with queues, and larger portions of the population now being far easier for wargaming to steal when the direct competition heats up because it just takes one ‘killer feature’ that the other fails to match to kill one of the games at that point.

Keeping their game disctinct and the playerbase intact makes the most sense in the long run. It is no coincidence that the only playerbase they can guarantee is safe from this effect are those of us who came for what makes warthunder distinct in the first place, risking watering down their own loyal fan base would be laughed out of any meeting it was proposed in

Now this is just a shallow overview but it can be greatly expanded on

if you just keep being unproductive and making strawman arguments you are never going to get what you want, try actually joining the discussion with something that stands a chance, of course ‘gaijin don’t listen’ if all you bring to the table is “do this thing, I don’t care about the potential consequences”

[Eftwyrd]

Originally posted by Venom Thanos:

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

I will happily repeat my essay if you require, I posted it at least four times in that mega thread and no one so much as came up with a counter argument

there are multiple problems with splitting the playerbase not limited to potential queue times (no one here has the data to refute),

split priorities with gaijin having to appease not one but two playerbase hostile to each others existence, as well as a lowered threshhold for jumping ship as they would essentially be reducing the differences between them and their nearest competitor, the threats of large portions of their playerbase leaving if their competitor then makes a change they are not willing to match blow to blow could see mass player migration, and if they do match the, blow for blow they risk alienating the other portion of the playerbase

and the slowly changing demographics as risk averse new players choose the lower skill threshold without CAS and over time simply stick with it, slowly bleeding dry the mode that keeps some of us older players around as we receive fewer of the newer players which will aggravate the other problems with queues, and larger portions of the population now being far easier for wargaming to steal when the direct competition heats up because it just takes one ‘killer feature’ that the other fails to match to kill one of the games at that point.

Keeping their game disctinct and the playerbase intact makes the most sense in the long run

Now this is just a shallow overview but it can be greatly expanded on

if you can just keep being unproductive and making strawman arguments, you are never going to get what you want

You can write 10 sentences or 100 essays it doesn't matter since it's just you telling them to suck it up 1000 times over, if these guys lose interests and start playing other games, then you no longer get to bomb them with your bomber and you also don't get to play the ground only mode with them because they don't exists.

And yet here we are a decade into the game perfectly happy, if you want to come late the party and argue tens of thousands of us have been doing it wrong for that long that’s on you

if you want to leave let the numbers speak for themselves, I think you will be disappointed to learn it will be far from disastrous for gaijin, but you are clearly not the type to let petty things like rational discussion get in the way of your prejudices as demonstrated by your arguing both that there are enough players for both modes and that there are not and the game will die without you…

so keep screaming away at the heavens and being ignored. You always have the option to grow up and contribute. Splitting the modes or removing cas is not on the table so try come up with something to balance its effect or whatever it is that annoys you,

I am perfectly happy with the way things are but have already contributed a couple of ideas you can build on because that’s how mature adults have discussions. Not by repeated ultimatums and threats you can never carry out while refusing to budge an inch repeating yourself like a broken record even when it’s long established such an absolute change stands no chance of success

[Eftwyrd]

Originally posted by Venom Thanos:

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

And yet here we are a decade into the game perfectly happy, if you want to come late the party and argue tens of thousands of us have been doing it wrong for that long that’s on you, if you want to leave let the numbers speak for themselves, I think you will be disappointed to learn it will be far from disastrous for gaijin, but you are clearly not the type to let petty things like rational discussion get in the way of your prejudices as demonstrated by your arguing both that there are enough players for both modes and that there are not and the game will die without you…

so keep screaming away at the heavens and being ignored. You always have the option to grow up and contribute

Who says game will die lol we didn't say that, you definitely ain't no business man, kaijin can make a lot of money from someone who perfectly content with the mixed battle, they can make EVEN more money by adding a ground only mode to keep the tankers happy, why choose to earn less when you can earn more? Been here for a long time doesn't make your comment hold any more weight than someone who is newer and spent more money in one year than you in ten years. Sometimes I think some of you old timers need to get off your high horse.

Not only has it not been established there is more money to be had, you are pulling that argument out of nowhere, I have already answered why splitting the playerbase would be courting disaster in my earlier post which you saw fit to mock and ignore, this is why no one listens to you. I had held off on doing so but as you seem to have nothing to contribute to an actual discussion or answering any points anyone has made I will be blocking you rather than waste my time repeating myself, enjoy your monologue

[lathrix army]

Originally posted by Eftwyrd:

Originally posted by Venom Thanos:

Who says game will die lol we didn't say that, you definitely ain't no business man, kaijin can make a lot of money from someone who perfectly content with the mixed battle, they can make EVEN more money by adding a ground only mode to keep the tankers happy, why choose to earn less when you can earn more? Been here for a long time doesn't make your comment hold any more weight than someone who is newer and spent more money in one year than you in ten years. Sometimes I think some of you old timers need to get off your high horse.

Not only has it not been established there is more money to be had, you are pulling that argument out of nowhere, I have already answered why splitting the playerbase would be courting disaster in my earlier post which you saw fit to mock and ignore, this is why no one listens to you. I had held off on doing so but as you seem to have nothing to contribute to an actual discussion or answering any points I have made I will be blocking you, enjoy your monologue

if people really want this mode so bad why not have a level requirement for it so people who do enjoy mixed can, but people who dont have to tolerate it until they reach the minimum?

im trying to appease both sides an i think having a level req would make it even out