Way to much Artillery... It's almost constant... Bad game design.

[InfernusMatrix]

I think artillery should be limited to one per match per person. I've had instances where 5 to 8 are called down on the same spot more than once.

Not only is it beyond obnoxious because of the noise it breaks the flow of the game, it ruins meta of close up tank battles because anytime you are playing hide and seek with an enemy peeking and poking about, they will drop arty on you... How is this fun?

The orange smoke needs to go. It's distracting, hard to see through, and plain weird!

I also find artillery is way too accurate. You can think you're safe between two buildings, hills, or mountains very much covered from side to side and it will hit you dead center with perfect precision. The main issue is the artillery goes exactly where you tell it too, no variance, no randomness at all... If artillery was this accurate I would think the shells were being guided with lasers.

There should be some random drift on the artillery to simulate how inaccurate it can be.

I cannot be the only one who finds the implementation of artillery to be very poor.

[highfivingbears]

Yeah, no. Artillery is a vital part of the game. You're unlikely to get a kill with it on an enclosed vehicle due to the inherent inaccuracy, but it's nearly a death sentence for light open-topped vehicles.

I see what you mean about the orange smoke, but I don't mind it. It's supposed to be spotting smoke, which is helpful in more ways than one. If you're on the ground, it can obscure vision, and not getting spotted is better than getting shot at. Additionally, the arty smoke is highly visible from the air, which enhances teamwork in a natural way without needing to actually call anyone out. The orange smoke lets your friendly fellas in the air with a whole lotta ordnance know where the enemy is, and that's a good thing.

Artillery accuracy is based on crew skill, along with how fast it's called down. So, uh, there already is what you're talking about in terms of "random drift on the artillery". Plus, you're highly underestimated how accurate artillery *can* be. If you're zooming around in a tank from the 1990's with an F-14 flying overhead, ATGM's zipping about the place while you're looking at the whole scene from a thermal sight that can make out the words on a newspaper from three kilometers out, it would make no sense at all for the artillery to be portrayed as this lumbering, inaccurate fire-by-volume type of deal.

[InfernusMatrix]

Postat inițial de highfivingbears:

Yeah, no. Artillery is a vital part of the game. You're unlikely to get a kill with it on an enclosed vehicle due to the inherent inaccuracy, but it's nearly a death sentence for light open-topped vehicles.

I see what you mean about the orange smoke, but I don't mind it. It's supposed to be spotting smoke, which is helpful in more ways than one. If you're on the ground, it can obscure vision, and not getting spotted is better than getting shot at. Additionally, the arty smoke is highly visible from the air, which enhances teamwork in a natural way without needing to actually call anyone out. The orange smoke lets your friendly fellas in the air with a whole lotta ordnance know where the enemy is, and that's a good thing.

Artillery accuracy is based on crew skill, along with how fast it's called down. So, uh, there already is what you're talking about in terms of "random drift on the artillery". Plus, you're highly underestimated how accurate artillery *can* be. If you're zooming around in a tank from the 1990's with an F-14 flying overhead, ATGM's zipping about the place while you're looking at the whole scene from a thermal sight that can make out the words on a newspaper from three kilometers out, it would make no sense at all for the artillery to be portrayed as this lumbering, inaccurate fire-by-volume type of deal.

Perhaps one per vehicle per spawn then? The orange smoke is pretty distracting a lot of people have complained about it. Also not all tanks had radios (if we are talking about WW2) so the idea of calling down instant artillery support is even more non-nonsensical in this regard.

Furthermore the artillery be fired is rather ambiguous. What type are firing? What is the caliber? What nation is crewing them? What is their skill level? None of this I think is calculated. It would be neat if they included nation specific artillery. The Germans getting a Nebelwerfer barrage would be pretty cool.

I could care less about high tier, I don't find auto killing things with missiles and sniping from miles away with thermal vision very fun or skill based. Few times I tried high tier I couldn't even leave spawn due to planes carpet bombing us. This is another issue altogether...

First off its a game and there are many things about it not very realistic so changing something to improve the "fun factor" is a good thing in my opinion. I remember in the past versions arty kills used to be kind of rare so it felt genuinely awesome if you landed a successfully volley. However since arty has been buffed going anywhere near it is instant death for open tops as you've mentioned.

The drift on the artillery is not enough. I am not questioning the fact artillery can be very accurate but if we think back to WW2 era it was used in mass to be most effective.

What I am saying is "Do we need it to be so accurate in this game we play for fun?" which for me is a solid No.

There are so many factors here that Warthunder is not taking into consideration.

This seems like a reasonable analysis to the question of "How accurate was WW2 Artillary":

---Posted from source---
wotan_weevil

Accuracy of WW2 artillery was often a CEP (circular error probably) of about 0.5% of the range, for ranges of about 4-5km and greater. That is, at a range of 10km, most rounds should hit within 50m of the target, and at 5km, within 25m. At closer ranges, the accuracy is better, but it doesn't improve as quickly any more. Of course, to achieve this accuracy, the position of both the gun and the target must be known precisely. These CEPs are comparable to the distance at which rounds are likely to kill - about 30m for 105mm, 50m for 155mm (and these rounds are dangerous to much greater distances). Where maps were good, targets can be located within 5-10m. In this case, multiple rounds aren't usually needed to make up for lack of accuracy. Multiple rounds are fired because the target is spread out - for example, a platoon might be spread over 100-200m when attacking, and an artillery battery spread over about 150m. The rounds should not be aimed at exactly the same point, but this is easy for a battery - since the guns in a battery are spread out, if all of the guns fire on the same bearing, the rounds will be spread out on the target.

[Toblm]

Postat inițial de InfernusMatrix:

Furthermore the artillery be fired is rather ambiguous. What type are firing? What is the caliber? What nation is crewing them? What is their skill level? None of this I think is calculated. It would be neat if they included nation specific artillery. The Germans getting a Nebelwerfer barrage would be pretty cool.

Its all the same artillery. The caliber is dangerous. Nation is irreverent, there is no such thing as friendly incoming artillery. Skill level isnt something you'd know before it all lands in one place and depends on crew skill.

[InfernusMatrix]

It would make more sense if at High BR the artillery was more accurate and less accurate at lower BR against WW2 tanks. The fact the artillery is the same regardless of the nation calling it shows how poorly implemented it really is. So regardless whether you are fighting in WW2 tanks or a modern MBT its the same artillery..... great....

How does my crew skill in my tank dictate how skilled the artillery crew is far away? Weird...

[Toblm]

Postat inițial de InfernusMatrix:

It would make more sense if at High BR the artillery was more accurate and less accurate at lower BR against WW2 tanks. The fact the artillery is the same regardless of the nation calling it shows how poorly implemented it really is.

How does my crew skill dictate how skilled the artillery crew is? Weird...

Basically everyone used and still uses some flavor of ~155mm which all about acts the same.
There is an artillery category under the radio crew.

[InfernusMatrix]

But what about WW2 tanks that didn't use radios? At least early on.

Germans I think had up to 220 mm howitzers they used for artillery. This does not include ridiculous guns like the raiway mounted Gustav Gun.

[Toblm]

Postat inițial de InfernusMatrix:

But what about WW2 tanks that didn't use radios? At least early on.

It is a video game. Everyone is a command tank.

[InfernusMatrix]

Okay its a video game. Therefor artillery should not be so accurate against WW2 era tanks. See above for more information.

Not the best argument there... See? I can do that too.

[Toblm]

Postat inițial de InfernusMatrix:

Okay its a video game. Therefor artillery should not be so accurate against WW2 era tanks.

Not the best argument there... See? I can do that too.

Except it doesnt hold up as well on your end because artillery accuracy is a crew skill. Has nothing to do with the tank, or the era.

[InfernusMatrix]

Postat inițial de Toblm:

Postat inițial de InfernusMatrix:

Okay its a video game. Therefor artillery should not be so accurate against WW2 era tanks.

Not the best argument there... See? I can do that too.

Except it doesnt hold up as well on your end because artillery accuracy is a crew skill. Has nothing to do with the tank, or the era.

Oh brother... Don't even think you read anything I posted above.

[Toblm]

Postat inițial de Mirage:

Postat inițial de Toblm:

It is a video game. Everyone is a command tank.

Convenient for some nations as to what is and what isn't implemented.

Heavy tank heavy nations lose out on artillery support. The usual "bias nations" dont really benefit from this abstraction.

[InfernusMatrix]

Postat inițial de Mirage:

Postat inițial de Toblm:

It is a video game. Everyone is a command tank.

Convenient for some nations as to what is and what isn't implemented.

Yeah like at low tier most Allied tanks have free floating 50 cal guns. Which can operate with no crew in them. But then something like the flakpanzers can't even have its full crew modeled.... Which is pretty weird considering Type94 and other nations AA vehicles have their standing or supporting crew modeled.

But hey "ITS JUST A VIDEO GAME" so don't think about things like this I guess?

[Lord Maximus]

If you watch the Arty Circle, it gets smaller as you get closer to the target area. So if your firing at max range your circle is huge.

[Toblm]

Postat inițial de Mirage:

At the end of the day I never understood the point of artillery, a free RNG button for a free RNG kill you don't deserve or a death you don't deserve.
Lets add some RNG to a game cripped with RNG because that's a good idea.

Anyone one who sits in the orange smoke deserves whats coming to them...

[-reno-FR-]

Postat inițial de InfernusMatrix:

I think artillery should be limited to one per match per person. I've had instances where 5 to 8 are called down on the same spot more than once.

Not only is it beyond obnoxious because of the noise it breaks the flow of the game, it ruins meta of close up tank battles because anytime you are playing hide and seek with an enemy peeking and poking about, they will drop arty on you... How is this fun?

The orange smoke needs to go. It's distracting, hard to see through, and plain weird!

I also find artillery is way too accurate. You can think you're safe between two buildings, hills, or mountains very much covered from side to side and it will hit you dead center with perfect precision. The main issue is the artillery goes exactly where you tell it too, no variance, no randomness at all... If artillery was this accurate I would think the shells were being guided with lasers.

There should be some random drift on the artillery to simulate how inaccurate it can be.

I cannot be the only one who finds the implementation of artillery to be very poor.

Skill issue.

If you die by artillery, it's really because you wanted to die by it.

I'm really fed up, I'm really pi**ed off by such complaining threads & BS players.

You have the chance , yeah, THE HOLY F*****G CHANCE, to have SUCH A COMPLETE GAME, which translate into a UNIQUE GAME most of what can be a Battlefield, with Tanks, CAS, SPAAs, Artillery, Scouts, etc etc

And what?
You want a kid boom boom game ?

Pathetic.