You just shouldn't play italians.

[dragneel552]

The italy tree is garbage. Tanks, aircraft and partially helicopters.
So tanks are extremely underarmored, slightly faster in just some cases than others with the exception of the only saving grace in the whole tree, the R3 T20. Guns penetrate less than other countries, tanks are easier to take down, no heavy bois.
Airplanes are decent up to a certain point, as in they aren't garbage but why use italians when literally every other country does whatever you try to do better.
Helicopters are a gimmick. The AB205 has two 7,62x51 miniguns. At 7.7. The alouette has TOW. The Mi-4 has TOW. The only Anti Tank capability you have is 14 of the worst rockets.
And the sight is not even aligned in any way.
There is no saving grace for the italian tech trees for tanks, under armoured, under armed and with no heavies, the slight speed benefit you have is meaningless at a certain point. When you fire 76mm out of the M4 Sherman Vc, which btw is a decent tank, you can almost hear the germans with tigers and the russians with their KVs laughing at you and bouncing most shots.
As of where I am now, 8.3 BR, you are completely under equipped compared to most other countries.
There are gimmicks, such as the TOW M113 Launcher, the SIDAM is decent once you unlock apds, the VBC is kinda garbage...the OF-40 mk2 doesn't stand a chance against Leopards A1L44 and stuff like that. It has barely even a speed advantage at that point, as the Leopard can easily come after you.
The Ariete Aircraft is at BR 9.3
9.3
It means that while everyone around you is using stuff with guided rockets, flares, afterburners and supersonic flight, you have 240 ammo of 30mm ammo, which is very good btw in this occasion, but are slower, with less defense, no countermeasures, not even a missile alarm, no radar (the ♥♥♥♥♥♥' Bf-110 G4 has a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ radar) and MiG-21s come at you swarming and strike you without you even noticing. At least that's the premium plane and it's not the only plane at that BR but ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

Honestly the thing that bothers me the most is the helicopter. At 7.7 you can find easily AA that has radars. And that's completely fine, helis are good anti tank machines and should be countered in some way.
But to give a Helicopter, a machine designed specifically for the purpose of being an anti tank flying vehicle, two miniguns and 14 ♥♥♥♥♥♥ rockets is a really really bad joke. The AB helicopter is the italian version of the UH-1 Huey under built and distributed with license.
The american version of the heli has TOW missiles in game. It's also the only helicopter at 7.7, it's not even usable. At 7.7 you can get the Maus on the ground. You can't take that down with those ♥♥♥♥♥♥ rockets. What the ♥♥♥♥. Balance a bit better your ♥♥♥♥, at least with BRs. Or with modifications and the possibility to at least unlock a 20mm or a 30mm gun.

[Wandering Flare]

Their WWII fighters are great though, perfect guns and setup of them, decent turning ability and energy retention, and they survive being shot pretty well somehow. If I cared about performance more than aesthetic, I'd be maining those.

[dragneel552]

Originally posted by Wandering Flare:

Their WWII fighters are great though, perfect guns and setup of them, decent turning ability and energy retention, and they survive being shot pretty well somehow. If I cared about performance more than aesthetic, I'd be maining those.

I agree completely, the airplanes are very performing up to 5.0. Didn't get further yet, got the Ariete because I wanted to try jets but welp. That wasn't a very good move :P

[shipdesignerdude]

When did they give the 8.3 Alouette TOWs? Most of your points just are completely irrelevant. The radar on the 110 is about as useful as the one on the ariete.

Doesn't the Sherman VC get APDS? At 5.3? you gotta be aiming for the air not to pen a tiger hull.

Did you just say an SPAA gets good once it gets 80 rounds of APDS? You're having a bad time cause your using 25mm cannons for anti tank uses.

Russian helicopters can't even get TOWs.... at least try to research your points or admit if you haven't. Neither does the 8.3 Alouette. The 9.7 one does however. And helicopters aren't designed to destroy tanks; attack helicopters are. If you've ever looked at the internet you would know that the Huey is used for troop transport duties. Another thing; the 8.7 German Huey gets TOWs, a full BR up from the italian one...

I'm not saying Italy is a good tree, but you've hyperfocused on too few bad vehicles... and then calling the Ariete bad.

[Shyue Chou]

The Semoventes at BR 2.0, 2.3, etc are not bad at all, the EPS M42 HEAT gives a 100 mm penetration at all ranges. It will effectively penetrate any vehicle of that BR.

The two OF-40 MBTs are pretty decent.

[Roma Invicta]

Originally posted by shipdesignerdude:

When did they give the 8.3 Alouette TOWs? Most of your points just are completely irrelevant. The radar on the 110 is about as useful as the one on the ariete.

Doesn't the Sherman VC get APDS? At 5.3? you gotta be aiming for the air not to pen a tiger hull.

Did you just say an SPAA gets good once it gets 80 rounds of APDS? You're having a bad time cause your using 25mm cannons for anti tank uses.

Russian helicopters can't even get TOWs.... at least try to research your points or admit if you haven't. Neither does the 8.3 Alouette. The 9.7 one does however. And helicopters aren't designed to destroy tanks; attack helicopters are. If you've ever looked at the internet you would know that the Huey is used for troop transport duties. Another thing; the 8.7 German Huey gets TOWs, a full BR up from the italian one...

I'm not saying Italy is a good tree, but you've hyperfocused on too few bad vehicles... and then calling the Ariete bad.

personally i think when he saying tows he saying missile so yea 8.3 alouette have missile
2 for the spaa i think hes saying that while yes spaa is not meant to attack tank but look at all other spaa they can pen tank from the side some of them from the front while the sidam have an ammazing 3 mm pen so if you get attacked by everything but armor truck(wich there will be none) u can't do anything u get sent back to the hangar
3 yeat again while not tows they have missile for 0.3 0.6 br and some who don't have better and much more missile
and the If you've ever looked at the internet you would know that the Huey yea and i mean its a game not real life we need to do something balanced not this

so finally i think whyle not all of this is wrong there is many good tank on italien italien need a really good rework

[Roma Invicta]

oh i forgot for the sidam so then in order to deal damage to tank and other spaa u have to get the apds because targetting plane is nice but it would be nicer if u can kill tank because killing only play may help winning but will not win the game while killing tank will.

[shipdesignerdude]

Originally posted by Roma Invicta:

oh i forgot for the sidam so then in order to deal damage to tank and other spaa u have to get the apds because targetting plane is nice but it would be nicer if u can kill tank because killing only play may help winning but will not win the game while killing tank will.

Thats totally fine, but I just think that the fact having to unlock apds for an SPAA should not be a primary reason Italy is trash. Italy just really sucked and lagged behind other countries, and used very few vehicles postwar :/

[SpiralRazor]

The APDS restrictions on some SPAA is stupid. Devs are very sus in the general intelligence area.

[shipdesignerdude]

Originally posted by SpiralRazor:

The APDS restrictions on some SPAA is stupid. Devs are very sus in the general intelligence area.

This is probably so Gepard users don't become better than the actual Leopard users at killing tanks. While it should be different vehicle to vehicle, I think it is a smart system.

[shipdesignerdude]

Originally posted by Mirage:

SIDAM costs 10k SL for a tin can and is not allowed more than a single belt of APDS which is like 60 rounds even though other SPAA gets a ton more AP.

Other SPAA like Type 87 may get full AP belts, but not APDS. The APDS is much stronger, henceforth Gajin only caring about limiting APDS. SIDAM should def get a raise in it's APDS count because lack of ap shells however.

[Roma Invicta]

Originally posted by shipdesignerdude:

Originally posted by Roma Invicta:

oh i forgot for the sidam so then in order to deal damage to tank and other spaa u have to get the apds because targetting plane is nice but it would be nicer if u can kill tank because killing only play may help winning but will not win the game while killing tank will.

Thats totally fine, but I just think that the fact having to unlock apds for an SPAA should not be a primary reason Italy is trash. Italy just really sucked and lagged behind other countries, and used very few vehicles postwar :/

i did not said italy was trash howerver like u said after some tank need a rework(plane and helicopter maybe too)

[♠Gamer3106♠]

E se ti dicessi di no?



Italy tree best tree

[Ninja Tuna]

At this point Italy is a meme nation

[♠Gamer3106♠]

"tigers and panther and kv's will laugh at your Sherman VC bouncing all your shots"

It's clear you've not even played the tipo VC because that has 226mm apds pen

[SONZ-INA]

low tier ground italy fun, and pretty decent. i haven't reached mid-tiers yet i'm at 4.0 rn and it's decent.