Please remove the P IV 70 from the game

[SANTIAGO]

Please.

I never got so mad at a tank before... This wehraboo piece of crap has nothing to do at 5.3
It's better than the Panther, can't be penned frontally with the Soviet 85mm unlike the Panther
Can hull down
is always used to camp and do horrible things

Please

[Mahd78]

If you want to kill him with your soviet tanks use IS-2 or PT-76B (has heatfs) or use one of your tank destroyers at that BR like ISU-152 or ISU-122.
All of these vehicles that mentioned can kill Panzer IV/70 (V) from front with little to no difficulty.

[uɐɐılʎʇs]

Dakota の投稿を引用：

As for the pen, funny enough in a discussion about the jumbo recently with another person he called me a liar for saying the 57mm that the soviets get could pen the Jumbo as it was too close of a distance. Jumbo, for reference, is at the same BR as this tank.

For reference: Jumbo lower infront of the transmission is around 135mm at the crest, hull is around 165, turret 167 against the Panzer IV/70(V)'s gun. The Panzer IV/70(V) against the same gun has 137mm on its lower and about 170 on its upper hull. The side armor is within 5mm of the Jumbo's. The Panzer IV/70(V) has nearly double the penetration with its APHE and also gets APCR to top it off.

German players still complain about the Jumbo at 5.3 despite having a Jumbo with double pen at the same BR. We are told to just flank it as it fires through our fronts.

In short, the vehicle's obviously either OP or perhaps the Jumbo is barely cut out for 4.7 in comparison. Either way, German mains complain about anything not in their favor.

Comparing a TD with a Heavy? Fine, ill play this game.
Jumbo is able to push offensively quite well, can defend itself far better against more mobile light/open targets and score kills with its .50 and prevent them from getting side on, has a turret allowing it to react faster on the move. Not so vulnerable to air.
PZ IV/70 is pretty much stuck in a TD role of finding a line of fire to hold, Gun can only aim a certain small zone in front, easy to flank and kill.

Its almost like comparing 2 different vehicle types wih 2 completely different roles is a bad idea.

And how is jumbo barely cut for 4.7 even in comparison to a vehicle where you are only comparing 2 similarities. That part you are starting to sound exactly like those german players who whine the tiger 1 should be dropped in BR even further.

The majority of slow casemate TDs have 1 main tactic the have to rely on to score well. Be prepared in a good position and make the most of the gun.

Now i didnt have an issue wtih jumbo at 5.0 either. If uptiered to them youd realise instantly due to spawn costs and id just have to change tactic a bit. Jumbos would rush mid so just be patient and pick a good spot in cover on the flank.
But tank BRs are done by how they perform by players ingame. And if youve ever played a game you can see that a good number of players are hopeless.Porbably why the Jumbo is now higher as most players rushed it head on, bounce a few shots and only then realise its not a regular sherman.
Maybe thats also why the PZ IV/70 is also 5.3, most TDs can punch above their weight, if you play them in a reserved patient manner. But how many do that.

[Kwoh]

This is an example why War Thunder & Gaijin are making every tank's armor useless.
No tank can have a decent armor, even tho, to disable a IV/70 only needs a shot on its lower glassies, and the WEAK side armor can be penned at so high angles you don't even need to go fully on it's sides.
If a player can't blindly pen a tank, then it's OP and needs to be moved up. Then minutes later the same community yells saying "EVERY TANK IS ONE SHOT ARMOR MEANS NOTHING ANYMORE"
And I don't feel surprised when I see a KV-122 player complaining about these stuff. A tank that basically destroys everything with a troll armor.
And before everyone uses "CRY WEHRABOO", my most played nation is Britain, and pretty much every tank with a 17pounder can pen that frontally, the 4.7 Sherman SA50 can, a 3.7 Achilles can, a little angle on the side can be penned by almost any gun, it's lower glassies is pretty much penned by everything. Being hull down is hard, yes, you have to drive, find a spot, IF that spot even has enemies near it, Poland? no hull down, Eastern Europe? the one near spawn, which every other tank goes there. It has no good spot or no spot at all in maps like Sweden, Port N. maps with hills? it has no gun depression.
If a tank that you dont have patience to learn how to kill needs to be deleted, then delete the OBJ 279, which bounced 120mm APDS from the SIDE.
the 85mm strengh was never penetration, you can't just always turn off your brain to play USRR, the 85mm strengh is pretty much having one of the BIGGEST explosive filler by mm in the game, with 164g of explosive, a one shot machine that's only 85mm with a good reload time.
The T-34-85 is way faster than a IV70, you can work your way around, not just long range shooting like 80% the players do.
I can't find a good reason other than "OP PLS NERF" which has been ruining the game for some time now.
Please learn the game, I know by my self experience that frustation makes you say dumb stuff on Discussions.

Dakota の投稿を引用：

Unstoppable Juggernaut の投稿を引用：

How is "poor" in other directions an excuse? That's the case of pretty much every TD of the game, including the T95, Jagdpanther and alike. This thing can't be penned anywhere upfront and has a very good gun (despite poor post pen). Good mobility, invincible armor frontally and good gun and people don't consider it OP? At 5.3?

How come everyone keeps crying the Soviets are OP and blabla, meanwhile Germany has like tons of OP lolwagons in their regular tank line and nobody cares lol

Its a German tank, they get to be OP and if you talk against it you gotta just git gud bro. Germany is the only nation allowed to have vehicles that are very armored for their BR and have a gun that easily deals with whatever it comes across.

EXACTLY BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE YOU GUYS. When a tank has good armor "pls nerf armor". Everytime, no one has armor because: no one is allowed to because it's too OP.

[PFC Demigo [29th ID]]

Well just had a Match and a Panther D, KV1s and T-34s unable to pen me being Hulldown with the PanzerIV. Died to a KV2 though but that's to be expected from a HE Nuke.

[Kwoh]

♋️LunarCainEX🐶 の投稿を引用：

Well just had a Match and a Panther D, KV1s and T-34s unable to pen me being Hulldown with the PanzerIV. Died to a KV2 though but that's to be expected from a HE Nuke.

a KV-1 can't pen anything and it's 4.3, KV has literally 84mm of pen in the filler round.
if you had a match against a Panther D, it means youre arcade? or just bs?

[PFC Demigo [29th ID]]

Kwoh の投稿を引用：

♋️LunarCainEX🐶 の投稿を引用：

Well just had a Match and a Panther D, KV1s and T-34s unable to pen me being Hulldown with the PanzerIV. Died to a KV2 though but that's to be expected from a HE Nuke.

a KV-1 can't pen anything and it's 4.3, KV has literally 84mm of pen in the filler round.
if you had a match against a Panther D, it means youre arcade? or just bs?

Arcade. Hell I'm even going against Tiger II with the Uptier Bullsht when I go Nashorn, Tiger H1 and PanzerIV.

[HansGruber]

The first time I saw a Jagdpanzer IV I was in a Panzer IV Ausf.J, and I scored a frontal one shot kill...So...They can't be all that bad.

[Zeradus]

♋️LunarCainEX🐶 の投稿を引用：

Kwoh の投稿を引用：

a KV-1 can't pen anything and it's 4.3, KV has literally 84mm of pen in the filler round.
if you had a match against a Panther D, it means youre arcade? or just bs?

Arcade. Hell I'm even going against Tiger II with the Uptier Bullsht when I go Nashorn, Tiger H1 and PanzerIV.

I think the fact that you are playing arcade is a big tell here. Most of have played arcade or just straight up learned to play in realistic where we don't have to rely on a + to tell us our chances of being able to pen a target.

The fact that you keep doing oh so great in it just means you keep going up against players that don't know where to shoot. If you switch over to RB or SIM I am sure you are going to find that you die frontally quite often.

https://warthunder.com/en/community/userinfo/?nick=*Dreadhurst&__cf_chl_jschl_tk__=ea7dca06991d3010d883205626c97b42e9ee93f9-1588411508-0-AQbzeK9VQzUXuXTEMOKKyK8MQ3KC_-tA2Tuz6SY4WBz2pZ72ZNKV2pZPkllBepXd_Znd8i0ZR66JNuScyAANNe4896WKpshFcCY7Q2QfDEd2n6nV4vaHhPDgbrX8zuYE41D0JM5Ibd_iphfvp5lpkWwh7Fa18yzADQBn4mLYu7vJrwg0vA3tgmdQQJrW-8K-3aP_v7a7HUtXUWhD_wZ2Jm7EZKCzkWV7-CKpkuO6m316cEeIf3jra61s8Nq2bo6NuAx-n-LJQxC8e181hChYLEg1L2uJmzCFSRw2BcKdEBuiaawZIkZzbneFOUC9BJb9g7u_wvex8SLnv8Khsa_n3oHCEpT0TleRC5krgIt7G_O8YLrS2Ng0EzP6ZmE0NmTtMw


You can see by my profile for PS4 that I have played both Russia and German quite a bit. When playing as Russia I have no problems destroying panzerIV/70s from the front, and when I use to play them I would frequently get snipped so yeah....

[KΞyboardFox🔰]

no

[SANTIAGO]

Kwoh の投稿を引用：

This is an example why War Thunder & Gaijin are making every tank's armor useless.
No tank can have a decent armor, even tho, to disable a IV/70 only needs a shot on its lower glassies, and the WEAK side armor can be penned at so high angles you don't even need to go fully on it's sides.
If a player can't blindly pen a tank, then it's OP and needs to be moved up. Then minutes later the same community yells saying "EVERY TANK IS ONE SHOT ARMOR MEANS NOTHING ANYMORE"
And I don't feel surprised when I see a KV-122 player complaining about these stuff. A tank that basically destroys everything with a troll armor.
And before everyone uses "CRY WEHRABOO", my most played nation is Britain, and pretty much every tank with a 17pounder can pen that frontally, the 4.7 Sherman SA50 can, a 3.7 Achilles can, a little angle on the side can be penned by almost any gun, it's lower glassies is pretty much penned by everything. Being hull down is hard, yes, you have to drive, find a spot, IF that spot even has enemies near it, Poland? no hull down, Eastern Europe? the one near spawn, which every other tank goes there. It has no good spot or no spot at all in maps like Sweden, Port N. maps with hills? it has no gun depression.
If a tank that you dont have patience to learn how to kill needs to be deleted, then delete the OBJ 279, which bounced 120mm APDS from the SIDE.
the 85mm strengh was never penetration, you can't just always turn off your brain to play USRR, the 85mm strengh is pretty much having one of the BIGGEST explosive filler by mm in the game, with 164g of explosive, a one shot machine that's only 85mm with a good reload time.
The T-34-85 is way faster than a IV70, you can work your way around, not just long range shooting like 80% the players do.
I can't find a good reason other than "OP PLS NERF" which has been ruining the game for some time now.
Please learn the game, I know by my self experience that frustation makes you say dumb stuff on Discussions.

Dakota の投稿を引用：

Its a German tank, they get to be OP and if you talk against it you gotta just git gud bro. Germany is the only nation allowed to have vehicles that are very armored for their BR and have a gun that easily deals with whatever it comes across.

EXACTLY BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE YOU GUYS. When a tank has good armor "pls nerf armor". Everytime, no one has armor because: no one is allowed to because it's too OP.

I think you meant KV-220* not 122 lol, 122 is made of toilet paper.
But yeah I get your point. As I said, when I asked for the P IV 70 to be removed I was really pissed and frustrated, not to be taken seriously anymore.

And I am amongst the ones complaining that armor doesn't mean anything anymore very often, so I get your point even more.

What got me pissed is that when playing the KV-220, I always get loads of kills, even 13+ sometimes, but almost EVERY SINGLE time, I get one shot by some lolwagon IV 70 camping somewhere outside of my range without being able to pen it.

[Kangaroo Salesman]

My panther D pens it no problem. Have you considered aiming better?

[Dakota]

Kangaroo Salesman の投稿を引用：

My panther D pens it no problem. Have you considered aiming better?

To be fair, the panther D has way more pen than everything else around that BR except for the TDs with long 88s.

[Kangaroo Salesman]

Dakota の投稿を引用：

Kangaroo Salesman の投稿を引用：

My panther D pens it no problem. Have you considered aiming better?

To be fair, the panther D has way more pen than everything else around that BR except for the TDs with long 88s.

Agreed, but if you can aim at the turret of the Panther D you realize it's easy to pen also. Yet if you can't you can deflect a tiger 2's shot some how. Man it's like angles are the way to go. XD

[Dakota]

Kangaroo Salesman の投稿を引用：

Dakota の投稿を引用：

To be fair, the panther D has way more pen than everything else around that BR except for the TDs with long 88s.

Agreed, but if you can aim at the turret of the Panther D you realize it's easy to pen also. Yet if you can't you can deflect a tiger 2's shot some how. Man it's like angles are the way to go. XD

Its kinda nuts how often I see Tiger II drivers fail their shots. I was in an SU-152 fighting a Tiger II and he shot my breech out and I repaired the thing infront of him while he failed a shot or two against me then ran away and then I finshed repairing and drove after him and shot him in the back of the turret.

[PFC Demigo [29th ID]]

Kangaroo Salesman の投稿を引用：

Dakota の投稿を引用：

To be fair, the panther D has way more pen than everything else around that BR except for the TDs with long 88s.

Agreed, but if you can aim at the turret of the Panther D you realize it's easy to pen also. Yet if you can't you can deflect a tiger 2's shot some how. Man it's like angles are the way to go. XD

If I recall people complain that shooting the Panther D turret frontally is Pure RNG that either you kill the Gun Crew or Deal Absolute Zero Dmg