incoming changes to APDSFS

[NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div]

spreadsheet showing the changes.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vTdPVAFQuSz5Z_u5X_bcjxzab4oLT35oJDj0j-YjkspYRzIR8j49QJzeFsksjG1IgCoz6iYvYm5xhj-/pubhtml?gid=2087102741&single=true
the link is from the recent Q&A on balistics update
https://warthunder.com/en/news/6023-qa-ballistic-update-questions-and-answers-from-the-developers-en
incase you missed it.

[saymyname]

WHY are they using Lanz-Odermatt and not de Marre for APDS-FS ? They have no explosive mass whatsoever... which is exactly the reason why they have higher penetration and De Marre is the best way to find it out.

What a joke................................They are just unhistorically nerfing NATO high tier again.

[saymyname]

12cm DM33 and M774 lose 60mm of penetration....
Russia gets a massive buff.
310mm pen for IS7

But no Bias comrade XAXAXAXAXAXAXAX :)))))))))))

I applaud Gaijin tho, they made the effort to make up some convoluted nonsensical calculation that buffs SU, instead of simple ninja patch changes.

Such level of mental gymnastics is impressive.

[NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div]

does it still surprise you after all these years?

[Kozi]

Lmfao M1’s M774 is going down to 358mm I’m literally crying cant wait to tank in M1’s in a freaking T-34.

[saymyname]

Obviously AP is getting a good buff, they are using De Marre with it (which is right, is a solid shot)

APHE is getting nonsensically nerfed, they are using De Marre for it TOO ? What are they smoking ?

OBIVIOUSLY.. Japan ammunitions are going to be unhistorically nerfed, using this formula...

NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div님이 먼저 게시:

does it still surprise you after all these years?

Being in game since 2013, it is getting worse.. Gaijlol used to mess up some stuff, but this......they are trying to make wrong calculations pass as standard rule.
That's way too much. This is another nail in this game coffin.

[saymyname]

On the russian side ----> Mostly unaffected because APBC comrade XAXAXAXA

The biggest and on eof the few losses is penetration for 152mm cannon but you can use HE.

That and 30mm of pen for the zis 6.

The rest is unaffected or even buffed (all the D shells)

They nerfed APHE without nerfing stalinium OPHE.

Gaijin are (evil) geniouses

[Azi]

Not really because of comrade xaxaxa, but rather because Gaijin loves to lick off WWII Ballistics - Armor and Gunnery, despite said source being proven wrong many times. The fact they are switching to full De Marre, coincidentally the same formula used in the source referenced above just keeps showing the same...

Honestly, despite being against the idea of Russian Bias and heavily being the Devil's Advocate in favor of Gaijin, wonder what in the world is going on trough their heads, this is worse than LMS... Even more sad is to see the lack of backlash from the player-base despite them ruling over absurd developers decisions trough the same meaning...

[saymyname]

Azarias님이 먼저 게시:

Not really because of comrade xaxaxa, but rather because Gaijin loves to lick off WWII Ballistics - Armor and Gunnery, despite said source being proven wrong many times. The fact they are switching to full De Marre, coincidentally the same formula used in the source referenced above just keeps showing the same...

Honestly, despite being against the idea of Russian Bias and heavily being the Devil's Advocate in favor of Gaijin, wonder what in the world is going on trough their heads, this is worse than LMS... Even more sad is to see the lack of backlash from the player-base despite them ruling over absurd developers decisions trough the same meaning...

But they are not switching ONLY to Le Marre.

Le Marre is fine for solid shots, and gives an "acceptable" estimate of long rod penetrators.

The problem is with APC, APCBC, APBC, APHE in general.

WW2 Gunnery and Ballistics ALWAYS nailed WW2 era AP shells penetration, but gave bad estimates of aphe penetration, which resulted in APHE meta. (that and AP spalling was nerfed to Oblivion before being rebuffed recently because Papa Stalin Forbid if a shell not used by Russians performed much better like it actually did historically).

WW2 gunnery and ballistic also includes much better penetration for German 10.5mm and 128mm guns and was straight up ignored by Bias, so it's clearly NOT the reason, as they never fully sticked to one source. (gonna post the bug reports pages where community members PULL OUT the pages of WW2 G&B in the face of devs reporting it, but those reports were archived and ignored)

Is factual that this is a massive buff to SU.
At which point people defending Gaijin would actually stop calling people tinfoil hat conspiracy theorist and actually pose some questions.

IS this another "accidental but very convenient bug/oversight" ? Just like the never fixed since 3 ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ years APBC shell slope modifier (shell that is even getting a buff with this formula).

Low caliber APC is also getting a massive nerf, that will affect GER and USA mainly and is quasi 0 degree Soviets.

After this patch all bottom low tier Japanese and French tanks will have less than 12 mm of penetration.

[NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div]

120mm DM33 does get a massive buff agaisnt angles. but the current list only includes 2 russian shells they are missing 3BM3/12/15/22.

[saymyname]

NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div님이 먼저 게시:

120mm DM33 does get a massive buff agaisnt angles. but the current list only includes 2 russian shells they are missing 3BM12/15/22.

No, it gets a nerf all around but at very extreme angles.
At 30 degrees angles (so basically most shots) is already a downgrade.

In general, the new formula "buffs" 60 degrees angles penetration for long rod shots, but not because it is a better formula, simply because those angle modifiers were complete ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ to begin with.

You innocent creature fell in Gaijobles smokescreen trap, not the only one tho.

[NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div]

SAY_MY_NAME님이 먼저 게시:

NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div님이 먼저 게시:

120mm DM33 does get a massive buff agaisnt angles. but the current list only includes 2 russian shells they are missing 3BM12/15/22.

No, it gets a nerf all around but at very extreme angles.
At 30 degrees angles (so basically most shots) is already a downgrade.

You innocent creature fell in Gaijobles smokescreen trap, not the only one tho.

i dont know, i think the buff agaisnt angles is gonna work well for it.

[NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div]

what tank uses the 120mm DM33 ?

[Azi]

NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div님이 먼저 게시:

what tank uses the 120mm DM33 ?

Type-90 does

[NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div]

Azarias님이 먼저 게시:

NAF-5th.Legion-Waffen.Div님이 먼저 게시:

what tank uses the 120mm DM33 ?

Type-90 does

youre right, thats the one, they just call it JM33 ingame, thanks.

[Colors]

so, now m774 gonna get 360mm pen a cost 900SL? Or WUT...