Could somebody please explain why the M4A3 105 is only 2.7?

[Foxxious]

I was grinding my low tier soviets and stumbled across some of these and began wondering: why on earth a tank with mobility of a bit slow M4, the armour of a KV-1 and the cannon of a Stuh-42 is at the tiny battlerating of 2.7? that thing is fast enough to get into action at a reasonable speed, armour good enough to stand on its own 2 tracks in uptier and the powerful cannon that could be compared to the Stuh-42 in a turret, even the Stuh is a fearsome vehicle at .3 br higher, so why is the superior M4A3 .3 lower than it?.
I just cannot figure it out, out of all of the weird battleratings in WT, this one is the weirdest

[Scheneighnay]

Because for some reason, Gaijin decided to give it nothing but HE at stock, so it's pure ♥♥♥♥ until it unlocks HEAT.
Which shouldn't take long, but it's still stupid.

[Sobolewski]

Originally posted by Scheneighnay:

Because for some reason, Gaijin decided to give it nothing but HE at stock, so it's pure ♥♥♥♥ until it unlocks HEAT.
Which shouldn't take long, but it's still stupid.

And then it becomes a living god among 2.7 tanks. Just Gaijin retarded logic. Would it hurt to give it stock HEAT then kick it up to 3.0 or 3.3?

I mean, how difficult it is to see that 63.5mm sloped at 48 degrees UFP plus 80-120+ turret armor depending on spot hit at 2.7 PLUS good mobility courtesy of the M4A3's HVSS suspension and 550 hp engine, AND over 100mm of HEAT penetration in a 105mm shell is just plain broken?

[Scheneighnay]

Originally posted by Sobolewski:

Originally posted by Scheneighnay:

Because for some reason, Gaijin decided to give it nothing but HE at stock, so it's pure ♥♥♥♥ until it unlocks HEAT.
Which shouldn't take long, but it's still stupid.

And then it becomes a living god among 2.7 tanks. Just Gaijin retarded logic. Would it hurt to give it stock HEAT then kick it up to 3.0 or 3.3?

I mean, how difficult it is to see that 63.5mm sloped at 48 degrees UFP plus 80-120+ turret armor depending on spot hit at 2.7 PLUS good mobility courtesy of the M4A3's HVSS suspension and 550 hp engine, AND over 100mm of HEAT penetration in a 105mm shell is just plain broken?

but if it had HEAT at stock, the grind would be shorter

[Sobolewski]

Originally posted by Scheneighnay:

Originally posted by Sobolewski:

And then it becomes a living god among 2.7 tanks. Just Gaijin retarded logic. Would it hurt to give it stock HEAT then kick it up to 3.0 or 3.3?

I mean, how difficult it is to see that 63.5mm sloped at 48 degrees UFP plus 80-120+ turret armor depending on spot hit at 2.7 PLUS good mobility courtesy of the M4A3's HVSS suspension and 550 hp engine, AND over 100mm of HEAT penetration in a 105mm shell is just plain broken?

but if it had HEAT at stock, the grind would be shorter

IIRC it's a tier 1 or 2 mod. Wouldn't change much.

[Scheneighnay]

Originally posted by Sobolewski:

Originally posted by Scheneighnay:

but if it had HEAT at stock, the grind would be shorter

IIRC it's a tier 1 or 2 mod. Wouldn't change much.

gaijin needs rubles

[Sobolewski]

Originally posted by Scheneighnay:

Originally posted by Sobolewski:

IIRC it's a tier 1 or 2 mod. Wouldn't change much.

gaijin needs rubles

You probably nailed the reason there. Don't know why anyone would spend GE to unlock such an early mod in a decently mobile vehicle that can both cap in early game and soak up shots to farm that initial RP needed, thought.

[Stridswombat]

Originally posted by Sobolewski:

You probably nailed the reason there. Don't know why anyone would spend GE to unlock such an early mod in a decently mobile vehicle that can both cap in early game and soak up shots to farm that initial RP needed, thought.

The people that spend money on these things probably aren't known for their patience.

[halolo39]

Originally posted by Sobolewski:

And then it becomes a living god among 2.7 tanks. Just Gaijin retarded logic. Would it hurt to give it stock HEAT then kick it up to 3.0 or 3.3?

I mean, how difficult it is to see that 63.5mm sloped at 48 degrees UFP plus 80-120+ turret armor depending on spot hit at 2.7 PLUS good mobility courtesy of the M4A3's HVSS suspension and 550 hp engine, AND over 100mm of HEAT penetration in a 105mm shell is just plain broken?

there are other tanks that has HEAT shell nearing to the 100mm mark and are at a lower BR than the sherman. by your logic everyone that has access to HEAT needs to be upped by 0.7 in BR.

[Foxxious]

Originally posted by halolo39:

Originally posted by Sobolewski:

And then it becomes a living god among 2.7 tanks. Just Gaijin retarded logic. Would it hurt to give it stock HEAT then kick it up to 3.0 or 3.3?

I mean, how difficult it is to see that 63.5mm sloped at 48 degrees UFP plus 80-120+ turret armor depending on spot hit at 2.7 PLUS good mobility courtesy of the M4A3's HVSS suspension and 550 hp engine, AND over 100mm of HEAT penetration in a 105mm shell is just plain broken?

there are other tanks that has HEAT shell nearing to the 100mm mark and are at a lower BR than the sherman. by your logic everyone that has access to HEAT needs to be upped by 0.7 in BR.

You bloody idiot, there is nothing wrong with having 100mm heat pen (for example panzer 4) the sherman just has better mobility, 3 times the armour, and 130mm of HEAT pen

[halolo39]

Originally posted by POTTU98:

You bloody idiot, there is nothing wrong with having 100mm heat pen (for example panzer 4) the sherman just has better mobility, 3 times the armour, and 130mm of HEAT pen

yeah no the armour is 63mm at 47degs which is still easy for tanks with HEAT to kill it or just flank this bulky tank. the mobility is a blessing to the fact the turret traverse is comically slow at 5 degs per secs and dont tell me you cant flank this big tank compared to it's peers in that BR range. the tank has low velocity gun and quite a huge caliber to boot, of course it's good to have a high pen HEAT round as an unlockable to make it a worth while vehicle to play, this tank isnt a miracle that it can suddenly kill people at long ranges once you unlock the HEAT. if you have problems killing this tank, i'm more certain that it is a learn to play issue.

[Scheneighnay]

Originally posted by halolo39:

Originally posted by POTTU98:

You bloody idiot, there is nothing wrong with having 100mm heat pen (for example panzer 4) the sherman just has better mobility, 3 times the armour, and 130mm of HEAT pen

yeah no the armour is 63mm at 47degs which is still easy for tanks with HEAT to kill it or just flank this bulky tank. the mobility is a blessing to the fact the turret traverse is comically slow at 5 degs per secs and dont tell me you cant flank this big tank compared to it's peers in that BR range. the tank has low velocity gun and quite a huge caliber to boot, of course it's good to have a high pen HEAT round as an unlockable to make it a worth while vehicle to play, this tank isnt a miracle that it can suddenly kill people at long ranges once you unlock the HEAT. if you have problems killing this tank, i'm more certain that it is a learn to play issue.

it has the same armor of 3.7 shermans which have above-average armor for their tier. At 2.7 the armor is absolutely formidable in the situations you find yourself in game, and not the magical world where you can teleport to someone's flank at will without getting shot 20 times by the sherman and its entire team in the process.

[Stridswombat]

Originally posted by halolo39:

yeah no the armour is 63mm at 47degs which is still easy for tanks with HEAT to kill it or just flank this bulky tank. the mobility is a blessing to the fact the turret traverse is comically slow at 5 degs per secs and dont tell me you cant flank this big tank compared to it's peers in that BR range. the tank has low velocity gun and quite a huge caliber to boot, of course it's good to have a high pen HEAT round as an unlockable to make it a worth while vehicle to play, this tank isnt a miracle that it can suddenly kill people at long ranges once you unlock the HEAT. if you have problems killing this tank, i'm more certain that it is a learn to play issue.

That armour is incredibly hard for 1.7-2.7 guns to penetrate and even up to 3.7 it still offers protection. It gives better protection than the 3.3 Sherman while simultaneously having better mobility.

[burg4401]

I normally don't take much notice of this tank, but shot two up today then got killed in a french arl44, br 3.7. And I do mean shot up, 5 or 6 shots before I got killed.

Took a look at its armour pen analysis afterwards, turns out I was wasting my time trying to shoot it.
Dam thing has the same armour as the shermans several brs above.
Note to self, drive round this thing or shoot it with a pz4.

I can only guess and it has happened before with some odd vehicles, that this tank isn't used much so they dropped it down to get us to play it and those that had been playing it, had not been doing very well in it........till now.

In sticking to form, if they still can't balance it, it will be a br 2.7 with a 25k repair bill.

[-=GHS=-BoonDock™]

plenty of ways to kill it from the front at its own br. puma can pzr3 j1 can easly, russian td's have no issue, Italy has no issue and soon swedan will lolpen everything at that br. a good sherman 105 player knows how to angle, and dont forget it only has 38mm of side armor and a dreadfully slow turret so if you charge it and avoid the slow gun you will kill it every time. its my most used vehicle and i know how to play it well, is its armor good for the br? yes likewise with the gun. if its tier changed to 3.0-3.3 it would still do just fine.

PS, heat acts very strange alot of the time, sometimes side shots on tanks do nothing but track it or just fizzle out.

https://warthunder.com/en/tournament/replay/82704504435341453 a game i just had using it about 10 minutes ago map knowledge and knowing your tank means everything. 15-3 btw

ingame name is Goatforeplay

[Scheneighnay]

Originally posted by -=GHS=-BoonDock™:

plenty of ways to kill it from the front at its own br. puma can pzr3 j1 can easly, russian td's have no issue, Italy has no issue and soon swedan will lolpen everything at that br. a good sherman 105 player knows how to angle, and dont forget it only has 38mm of side armor and a dreadfully slow turret so if you charge it and avoid the slow gun you will kill it every time. its my most used vehicle and i know how to play it well, is its armor good for the br? yes likewise with the gun. if its tier changed to 3.0-3.3 it would still do just fine.

PS, heat acts very strange alot of the time, sometimes side shots on tanks do nothing but track it or just fizzle out.

https://warthunder.com/en/tournament/replay/82704504435341453 a game i just had using it about 10 minutes ago map knowledge and knowing your tank means everything. 15-3 btw

ingame name is Goatforeplay

Italy can't even consistently pen it from the side, much less the front.

"The armor isn't that good because the vehicles with the highest pen in the BR might be able to pen it" isn't a very strong case.