Bomber Armor and Toughness

[MAKO]

Do you guys think bombers should be harder to kill?
I think theyre a bit too easy.

[CT center]

yeah they really do go down waaaay too easy,
i know on some of the wellingtons had canvas over their frame so the shots went straight through and did no damage whatsoever, theres literally dozens not if more images of wellingtons being shredded to bits yet managing to fly back over europe and land at home.

[Солевой берсерк]

Originally posted by Ghojo:

Yeah the bomber damage model is totally stupid. It is well known that WW2 bombers could take an immense amount of damage and still fly, but I guess then the warthunder kiddies will cry because they can't be oneshotted anymore.

And we know that Gaijin cares most about the arcade folks, who happen to also pay the most for premium and ♥♥♥♥.

Gaijin cares about vocal minority.
Also better use word "casual" instead of arcade when you're talking about these sissies.

[CT center]

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=wellington+bomber+hit&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiVirnI8PHeAhVFmbQKHYDTB3oQ_AUIDigB&biw=1366&bih=619#imgrc=Wmu5xp_vlsXrhM:

see how the bomber was fired at but the shots didnt manage to damage the frame and just went through the canvas, if that was WT it wouldnt had its tail ripped off in 2 seconds.

[halolo39]

Originally posted by Faoiltiarna:

Gaijin cares about vocal minority.
Also better use word "casual" instead of arcade when you're talking about these sissies.

arcade players? no the complaints mostly come from german players

[Yansomi]

In reality, A WW2 heavy bomber avraged 20 so hits by enything 20mm+ before going down, but in reality it did not exist mouse laser aim, and rounds that actully concected was extremly low, so a FW190 for example, could often fire off all its rounds and not bring down the bomber it was shooting after

[Illusionyary]

Keep in mind when judging bomber "toughness" that historically speaking pilots missed most of their shots, while in War Thunder you have mouse aim which is laser accurate.

[A Toaster]

thats when the mk108 comes in

[A Toaster]

laughs in minegeshoss

[uɐɐılʎʇs]

Originally posted by halolo39:

Originally posted by Faoiltiarna:

Gaijin cares about vocal minority.
Also better use word "casual" instead of arcade when you're talking about these sissies.

arcade players? no the complaints mostly come from german players

Wrong, the complaints were from fighters of all nations.
All planes, not just bombers had durability. But due to how arcade maps are and how bombers also used to get a higher spawn youd end up with bombers far too high and ending games far too quick.

It would take much longer to climb to and by the time you got to them bases were already dead, this is mainly t3 and up when bombers get bigger payloads. You either had to attack at the first possible chance which was usually from behind and just below as you were chasing them which on most bombers was heavily defended(rear).
Now that is the legitimate complaint which still exists which is more based around map design, not the actual bombers.

But the majority of complaints were about how bombers were so OP, good durability and good gunners. Game after game you could take out a bomber and score a few kills from some fighter attacking from a bad angle even when flying lower. Enemy fghters rushed you just like they do now but the only difference was the fighter would die quite a lot of the time.
This is more a player issue, they didnt want to take the time and attack from a better angle even when they had the choice.

Now also add in the flavor of the month bombers, whichever bomber was overperforming. Now youd have 4 of them flying in a close formation and purposely going low in amongst the furball and gunners just tearing up multiple planes. Players would just abuse certain bombers at certain BRs.

This was also back before things like the Yak-1 etc, so low tier especially was a mess.. PBYs versus basically nothing but weak biplanes and flying around being basically unkilllable.

Instead of actually finding some smart way to fix it, we got what we always get. The easiest option to implement. Blanket nerfs etc.
Gunners are almost useless, durability is gone, cannons and 50cals have had huge buffs, bomber spawn is lowererd.

This is mainly just for arcade, RB had its own problems, although invincible bomber gunships were present there at quite a few BRs.

[Kay]

Originally posted by Ghojo:

Originally posted by Illusionyary:

Keep in mind when judging bomber "toughness" that historically speaking pilots missed most of their shots, while in War Thunder you have mouse aim which is laser accurate.

It doesn't matter, because "historically speaking", even if they hit, most of the time the shots would go right through the plane and only leave a hole in it.

Or tear off some small parts of the plane, but not take it down. There are countless photos of bombers from WW2 who had their whole tail shot off and they still made it back to base.

Nope.

20 confirmed hits with a 20mm were enough to take down a B-17 (from German gun cam research) the hit rates were about 2% from the tail, but much, much higher in head ons. To the point a Bf-109 of Fw-190 could almost guarantee a kill on a B-17 if it flew head on.

Bombers were not that durable, the "countless" pictures of planes with their tail blown off are insignificant when compared to the amount shot down. They're the exception, not the norm.

The thing that kept bombers alive was enough defensive fire to stop the enemy from accurately hitting them. That's all.

[The Wiggly Armed Man]

A fighter could easily even take down the B-17, their toughness is exaggerated and in reality many of them went down when their engines were torn up by a Bf 109, or their crew killed by an incoming flak round.

[MAKO]

Originally posted by The Wiggly Armed Man | F.P.C.:

A fighter could easily even take down the B-17, their toughness is exaggerated and in reality many of them went down when their engines were torn up by a Bf 109, or their crew killed by an incoming flak round.

Hmmm, This gives me an idea.
Maybe just like tanks when you shoot at a bomber it can give you an Xray of it so you can see inside and the crew you have killed.

Probably a really retarded idea but i just came up with it on the fly.

[-NODER-_Novastorm_]

Bombers in ww2 had escorts for some reason...
When the allies made 1st bombraids over germany they started to lose alot of bombers both to flak and enemy fighters.
Bombers armour are ok here, deal with it.

[kamikazi21358]

Tails since the last few updates have been way too weak, they should decrease the structural integrity of air vehicle tails. This should hopefully bring bombers to their historical strength?

[RookyPoo]

in my opinion flying my American B-17 is just giving people a plane kill it falls into peices at the first shot and is like im flying a piece of tin foil.