Panzer IV H OP German Bias

[Pacipoodillie]

Just played a match in the M24 in RB and ran into a rather strange situation. The turret crew of the Panzer IV H appear to be protected by some impenetrable barrier on the interior of the turret.

Using the American M61 shot and firing into the upper ~75% of both turret cheeks either very little damage is done to the turret crew or only the commander takes damage. Using solid shot seems to work somewhat appropriately if you hit the crew directly but shrapnel damage seems random. Using German APCBC produces the same effect in the protection analysis as does the 150g explosive mass BR-350A Soviet round.

Only shots into the face of the turret by explosive filled rounds seem to be affected, at least on my client.

Is this something anybody else can reproduce?

Edit: Title changed in hopes of being more clickbaity

[Pacipoodillie]

Also I checked the other Panzer IV variants which all take substantial interior damage from the 3 rounds I listed, the Panzer IV H seems to be alone in its ability to soak damage for some reason.

[Halogen]

This sounds like a tank knowledge problem
The Pz IV. Asuf H has roughly 60mm of armor on the turret cheeks with the added tracks of about 20mm-ish
The M24's round gets BEARLY 110mm of pen meaning if you are any farther than 500m away itll be very hard to pen, much less damage things

[Pacipoodillie]

Originally posted by {442} Halogen:

This sounds like a tank knowlage problem
The Pz IV. Asuf H has roughly 60mm of armor on the turret cheeks with the added tracks of about 20mm-ish
The M24's round gets BEARLY 110mm of pen meaning if you are any farther than 500m away itll be very hard to pen, much less damage things

Not at all a tank knowledge problem, as I said I minimally tested it with the IV F2/G/J and they take a normal amount of damage from a shot to the turret face. I also stated, maybe unclearly, that I used the Pz IV H's own gun against its turret face to the same effect.

I'm asking if this is a problem anyone else can reproduce in-game as I couldn't imagine that this only affects me.

[Mods]

Originally posted by Pacificatore:

Originally posted by {442} Halogen:

This sounds like a tank knowlage problem
The Pz IV. Asuf H has roughly 60mm of armor on the turret cheeks with the added tracks of about 20mm-ish
The M24's round gets BEARLY 110mm of pen meaning if you are any farther than 500m away itll be very hard to pen, much less damage things

Not at all a tank knowledge problem, as I said I minimally tested it with the IV F2/G/J and they take a normal amount of damage from a shot to the turret face. I also stated, maybe unclearly, that I used the Pz IV H's own gun against its turret face to the same effect.

I'm asking if this is a problem anyone else can reproduce in-game as I couldn't imagine that this only affects me.

is of balance comrade ))))))))))))))))))))))))

[Pacipoodillie]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBKhkjpY3q0&feature=youtu.be

This is a video showcasing what I'm talking about.

Protection Analysis could be bugged but during the match exactly what is shown in PA is what happened, shots to the upper portions of the turret face would either do slight damage to the commander and the turret drives or nothing at all. I swap to the F2/G/J to show that PA correctly displays the post-penetration damage for those models and I remove the add-on track armor of the IV H and set the round fired to the M61 shot of an M4A1 Sherman all to no effect.

[kiro the avenger!]

The armour model is bugged.
The sides of the turret currently extend inside the vehicle, effectively giving it a 30mm spall liner behind the turret front.

[Ouroboros]

They've trolled me a few times and driving it, I notice I don't get penned as much as I think I would in such a vehicle. Especially in a downtier, you'll bounce a lot, Soviet vehicles in particular can have difficulty penning you. Just came out of a game in mine, didn't die in it and killed 6 enemy tanks, it was arcade but still nobody managed to pen me.

Plus it can't face the Jumbo at it's own BR anymore (except in uptiers ofc) so the German 4.7 lineup with that, Hetzer, Jagdpanzer and Brummbar is a lot more fun.

[Pacipoodillie]

Originally posted by kiro the avenger!:

The armour model is bugged.
The sides of the turret currently extend inside the vehicle, effectively giving it a 30mm spall liner behind the turret front.

The strange thing is that a shot anywhere else to the tank acts normally. Shooting the turret sides or the hull will kill the crew and modules, it's just shots to the turret face.

I made the discussion in hopes that it could be reproduced by a bunch of people and confirmed if it's a bug as I haven't seen any mention of this anywhere. Maybe I should have made the title super clickbaity.

[kiro the avenger!]

As I said, it's a bug with the damage model. The side armour currently wraps around to the gun mantlet as well.
It's already been passed the devs. Since it's nerfing a German tank, you might actually get away with holding your breath waiting for this fix.
https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/446074-fwd-03142019-panzer-iv-h-turret-damage-model-bug/

[Ddinosaur]

could be another layer of armour that just got pushed back or something *probs onot tho* although a wehraboo i do think tanks should be more accurate and i agree with this post

[Pacipoodillie]

Originally posted by kiro the avenger!:

...

Alright, I had searched around to see if it had been noticed before but I didn't come across an actual bug report. I predominately play Germany so I never noticed the problem until I played US the other day. I don't see how they screwed that one tank up when there are ~5 others with the same/similar turret.

[un.Casual]

There's a beautiful thing called aiming at its sides which can't even stop a 50.cal in most versions.

[Pacipoodillie]

Originally posted by un.Casual:

There's a beautiful thing called aiming at its sides which can't even stop a 50.cal in most versions.

Devs screwed up the turret after last patch apparently. Marked kiro the avenger!'s post containing the URL to the bug report page as the answer. Just need to wait until Gaijin fixes it.

[Rommell8]

Seriously??? you shoot the panzer IV in the only spot the armor is sloped???? wtf

I can think of 6 spots i'd shoot before the turret cheek..time to bury this thread

[Pacipoodillie]

Originally posted by Rommell8:

Seriously??? you shoot the panzer IV in the only spot the armor is sloped???? wtf

I can think of 6 spots i'd shoot before the turret cheek..time to bury this thread

Not only was it never said the turret was shot anywhere in the trap, or on any slope, it was clearly shown in the video 5 posts in. I also marked the post with URL to a bug report thread as the answer to the OP so that anyone could see the tank is indeed bugged and in need of fixing by Gaijin.