Damage vs Attack Damage

[Princemousey]

Do they mean the same thing?

[Realm Archive]

No, we used them to separate Damage for everything (statuses, spells, attack, summons) vs Attack-only Damage.
The wording isn't very good so I've been renaming them (and changing the behavior) to Attack Damage and Spell Damage, where Spell Damage will be anything that's not your attacks. Still trying to find the best wording though. We might add tooltips that explain things further on hover at some point, I don't know.
~Ren

[Gargoyle]

Originally posted by Realm Archive:

No, we used them to separate Damage for everything (statuses, spells, attack, summons) vs Attack-only Damage.
The wording isn't very good so I've been renaming them (and changing the behavior) to Attack Damage and Spell Damage, where Spell Damage will be anything that's not your attacks. Still trying to find the best wording though. We might add tooltips that explain things further on hover at some point, I don't know.
~Ren

Perhaps "Player DMG" and "Ability/Spell DMG" tags?

[Mokona]

Ya I'd say attack damage and skill damage might be the best. Spell damage will make me think things like spin to win chain doesnt count.

[Princemousey]

What does "Attack Damage" apply to? If it's only damage of the basic attack then call it Basic Attack Damage?

[Realm Archive]

I think all routes can be misread somewhat, so we might have to settle for some ALT Hold text for those interested to know which things either affects precisely.
~Ren

[Princemousey]

Yes, that's true. But use consistent wording (at least to your mind), and further clarify with Alt text. To my mind there is all damage, or just damage. Basic attack damage, which is the class skill that each character has.

[Kaezeribato]

Originally posted by Realm Archive:

I think all routes can be misread somewhat, so we might have to settle for some ALT Hold text for those interested to know which things either affects precisely.
~Ren

The "attack" mean the basic attack right? Then wouldn't it be less work to just rename it "basic attack" than adding tooltip and all?
Most people will understand what the basic attack is so it'll be less work for you.

[Mixolydian]

Maybe the Halls of Torment devs wouldn't mind if you borrowed their idea. They call it "main weapon damage", which makes it pretty clear.

[luckz]

"Basic attack" or "Main weapon" would be clear, while "attack damage" would not.
And someone reading just "damage" would assume it includes basic attacks.

[Seraph]

I find "Attack Damage" clear enough, "Attacking" is what you are doing everything else is triggering or passive/autocast, perhaps "Auto-Attack Damage"? What I am unsure of is if "Damage" is ALL damage and also increases your attack, if not perhaps "Skill Damage"

[ Nate The Scot ]

Originally posted by Princemousey:

Do they mean the same thing?

Obviously attack damage means the damage of your attacks (sword swings for warrior, fireballs for mage).

Global damage = everything... curses, burning, fire trails, blades, chains, all the proccs you can get...

I don't see how you can be confused by this, it's pretty clear in its wording and also what it does.

[lazy oli]

Yeah, it confused me as well. Or more specifically it confused me when it came to the sorceress. I assumed it was all spell damage since it was a fireball.

[Nalarion]

Originally posted by Realm Archive:

No, we used them to separate Damage for everything (statuses, spells, attack, summons) vs Attack-only Damage.
The wording isn't very good so I've been renaming them (and changing the behavior) to Attack Damage and Spell Damage, where Spell Damage will be anything that's not your attacks. Still trying to find the best wording though. We might add tooltips that explain things further on hover at some point, I don't know.
~Ren

It would help a LOT if you just had any kinda tooltip or tutorial portion of the game that explained some of these things. Don't leave it up to the players to discover which interpretation is the correct one. You could simply even have a lookup index that goes into detail how spell damage worked. I myself was left guessing if it was Both attacks and melee ranged attacks that worked as attack damage or if it was everything besides auto attacks. Was the physical damage of Krom a physical attack or is it spell damage? Is the ice dash more magical so its magic or is it also physical, or are all dashes physical or all magical or some of each? Honestly, I didn't think everything besides auto attacks counted as spell damage until reading this.

Idk what else you got going on or how difficult it is to implement things, but some issues in this game seem like pretty simple fixes compared to the actual foundation of the game thats already set up. Consider that the wording is obvious to you is not as obvious what it means to someone else. This is one of my personal biggest pet peeves in video games is when there is a really unintuitive system to understand, like with all the numbers flying around in this game, and text that either doesn't exist or does not definitively describe the systems that the game uses. Though to be fair, there's even some really good games that have this kinda flaw. So it seems like a simple fix to me, but then id be assuming the same thing thats causing these problems in the first place.

Anyways yeah, some simple segment or tab somewhere in the game that players are at least made aware of if not nudged towards would help people figure out what they are doing in developing a build as they play. I think a game that really does this well is Hade's. Hades does an excellent job of describing all of its systems and does it in a way that doesn't shove the information in the players face or make you feel like its holding your hand.

P.S. im more critical in games I actually like some otherwise id just be describing all the ways in which its bad not what to change about it. Might be the best "survivors" type game ive played so far, but im not finished with it yet. And its still in beta right? The game itself still has a lot you might change?

[Yuki]

This thread was quite old before the recent post, so we're locking it to prevent confusion.