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Ranked? I tried to play and literally could not find a game.
Have you tried playing at peak time?
As for your others complaints (like not changing roles between ranked seasons), i believe i already explained most of it in another post to you. Here is a reminder for you (no need to thank me for doing the search for you):
https://steamcommunity.com/app/2140510/discussions/1/3949154699975411287/
And in case you are a little blind: serious ranked players DO care about ranked seasons stats and consistency. Do some research about ranked mode (and how it work in details) in any other famous game (overwatch, LoL, ...)
its been know from day 1 that all any is the only mode people play. always find it funny when someone like op says the games dead caz there playing one of the different modes, even if its ranked
if you wanna play ranked then go back to tos1
I couldn't find a single match queuing 15 mins straight 2 days ago.
as said 100's of times in posts like this if you want a active mode that you can get into all the time within a min then go play all any. ranked is a close 2nd but its also a hit or miss at times
also, 2 days ago was new years. people were prob hanging outwith friends and family then. one again it just shows you know nothing of timing, lol
Best response I've read in a while on here. Glad there's still the occasional glimmer of intelligence in the Steam Community forum. Speaking for myself and a few others though, we left because of the terrible roles being left to rot and clog up the game; but, I do agree with your impression as well. It's solely on the devs to fix.
it dose suck when the leading roles get taken by people whos iq is the same as a wet rock, but thats also half the fun. trying to win even with stupid team mates (and yes, if you get alot in one game or in back to back games then it can get very annoying)
if you dont like that type of game, maybe play some solo stuff, lol
Balancing is an issue in most games nowadays, because they are hastily released without significant balance testing, if any at all. This is a major issue that occurred due to shift in game development, and is one of the downsides of technological advancement. Anyways, to not delve too deep into that, while balancing is an important factor in enjoyment, it is not essential for a game's success.
i could name different games where roles were not properly balanced, but still lived for a long time. Overwatch had tanks being the better DPS. Dota 2 had midlaners being the most influential role for a very long time. For League of Legends, it was junglers. Super Smash Bros Melee has over half the cast completely unuseable, and the top 4 being significantly better than the rest in the other top half. The list goes on.
In Town of Salem, its no different. Jailor is giga broken. He/She can kill, roleblock, protect (i.e heal), and/or forcibly gain information off the detainee, essentially being a Town Killing, Support, Protective and Investigating, all at the same time, What if all other Town had such abilities? The other factions would have no chance of winning. Relying on a Jailor to carry is part of teamplay, and a fundamental interaction of the game.
Mafia roles that usually suck include Framer, Disguiser and Mafioso. Especially Mafioso, You just have no power over the game. The Godfather sends You into Veteran and there is nothing You can do about that.
But as Framer, since You have little to offer, You can often and much earlier than other roles do more aggressive plays, pushes, spread of misinformation, and/or create chaos. The team would not mind it as much if a Framer gets hanged vs Godfather. Because having only 1 Mafia Killing makes You too susceptible to Jailor/Escort. Other powerful roles such as Witch (that usually sides Mafia) also cannot be too aggressive since survival for him/her is the most important.
What i am trying to say is, less powerful roles in Town of Salem can be as fun - if not more - than powerful roles since You can rely more on general game mechanics, and aggressive playstyle, to ultimately achieve more than what powerful roles could do by virtue of their powers alone. i also met so many people that did not like Jailor because the role is too stressful, as You will get bombarded with whispers, information, responsibility and thus pressure.
There are ways to enjoy lesser powerful roles. But there is no way around incompetent moderators. If You are blackmailed, people expect You to spam votes to inform them that You are not able to talk. When a moderator tells You spamming votes when blackmailed is still spamming and bannable, what will You do? Not spam votes and get hanged? Or spam votes and get banned? Either way, You lose. Either the game or Your account.
Well, most of those Mafia issues we don't have to worry about anymore. 'Blackmailer' is replaced by Voodoo Master who actually straight stops you from voting people on stand at all, and all Coven Killing roles are independent (whoever's the highest ranking alive gains killing abilities). I've got no idea what the balance is like now though.
I don't know which one is the worse here tbh. Saana for the baseless accusations against the devs about moderation, or Pooh for being sheeped by a random player (or believe similar things with neither research or proof). Let me remind that if there was no report system, the game would be MUCH worse. Like gamethrows, spam, harassement everytime. Well, we haven't reached that point, so that mean the report system is at least contributing. This is also ironic comming from Sanna who got a small ban at least one time in TOS1 (which proves mods are active) (forum link:
https://www.blankmediagames.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=123497
Apparently, it was for being a bit too frustrated about town's inactivity, and decided to be loud by whispering a lot. To your defence, i understand that feeling of frustration when town isn't coordinated). Regardless, i don't think he is a "glimmer of intelligence in the Steam Community forum" (not necessarly very dumb, but not very smart either). Reminder to not blindly trust everyting in discussion. Do some research and figure out if someone is stating facts or spouting baseless nonsense. You are all free to attempt to break my arguments with actual facts though, but this might be impossible, since i'm already using known facts (that i searched).
TOS2 is a social deduction game for 15 players. The devs already do those tasks for the game currently:
- inventing new gimmicks for roles (ex: proscutor, admirer, conjurer, ...) (this will include future new roles)
- thinking of all the roles interactions (ex: what retri can or can't do? Interactions with enchanter / illusionist with the TI roles, ...)
- figuring out rolelists that feels fair for everyone on average (both for town or for coven, assuming a decent skill level of players)
- fixing bugs (both from specific roles or from the game in general)
- moderate the player base (despite the few claiming the opposite with 0 proof)
As for balancing the game, the devs are similar to school teachers. They both prepare a content (devs: rolelist, specific roles mechanics. teachers: lessons, exercises) for a public (devs: for players. teachers: for school kids). This content is usualy made with a goal in mind (for TOS2 ranked: the goal is to use strategies, not to be very lucky. So balancing in ranked IS important, otherwise a faction will be penalised), and an initial educated guess from the devs / teacher's perspective, WITHOUT knowing for sure how the public will react. However, it is up to that public (and NOT to the devs / teachers) to determine if the content is enjoyable / helpful (assuming the PUBLIC is being serious). The public share their opinion, and only after, it is up to devs / teacher to react by adapting for the next time (and not in the middle of the act. Teachers doesnt change their content in the middle of class. It's the same with game devs: they don't change gamestates in the middle of a ranked season)
Obligatory disclaimer: i am NOT knowledgable about the "metas" (or even the basic content for some games) in big multiplayer games. All i know is what a "ranked" mode is supposed to be (compared to other less serious gamemodes). Anyway, i don't think it's fair to compare action-based FPS/MOBA/fighting game's ranked modes (which rely on lot of movement, planned team composition, damage / abilities maths, physical position, real time strategy) with a static social deduction game's ranked modes (which rely on information + abilities analysis, "turn" based (as in game's phases: discussion, voting, defence on trial, vote results, night), random team composition (town don't always have jailor, coven don't always have conjurer), deception, lies). While the purpose of ranked modes are the same (being competitive with serious players), the means availible are different, requiring different mindsets, skills, and type of balances.
- for jailor: while he *can* kill, it is not riskfree. One mistake, and it's the entire role that become useless (literally worse than roles like spy or coroner). Jailor's strength is determined by how the player plays it, and this is the same for any role (town or evil). Also, jailor isn't a "flawless" town investigative role. It's like a day claim, except the claim is private to only the jailor (and being in a serious situation: a real townie shouldn't doubt about his claim to jailor.). However, the jailor have no direct way to determine whether the jailed person is telling the truth or not (unless checking with other evidence, or using gut feelings). The jailor's role is also not perfect, some roles can screw him: ritualist / doomsayer / conjurer (if he doesnt hide his identity), witch (who can force an exec), poisoner (who can prevent an execution. Keep in mind jailor can't jail same player twice in a row). The jailor is also dependant on information provided by the rest of the town. A near unstoppable roleblock + kill isn't much usefull if the jailor can't find a valid target without risking his execs. Jailor may be strong, but he is still part of town TEAM, and will rely on the rest of his team (even if at first, he don't know who is town or not). While the jailor can do several tasks availible to him, he won't be able to do all of them everynight, and it's also up to him to determine his strategy and to quickly adapt to the situation (should he gather more info? Protect a possible vulnerable Tpow? Try to reduce evils numbers?). Jailor is a strong role, but it also bring lot of responsabilities, and usually get more possible info than other roles (which means more sorting, analysing, ...) Jailor's effectiveness will depend of the player's playstyle (is he good at multi tasking? finding the important info?)
- about TOS1 mafia roles: let's just ignore you are bringing TOS1 exemple in a TOS2 discussion. Your exemple of "mafioso" is very ironic comming from you. You start with:
"Especially Mafioso, You just have no power over the game. The Godfather sends You into Veteran and there is nothing You can do about that."
Then end with:
"Because having only 1 Mafia Killing makes You too susceptible to Jailor/Escort".
I wonder why we have both godfather and mafioso in TOS1 (as a reminder, in TOS1, jailor / escort can perma rb someone)
Anyway, it's true that both town and mafia / coven have both strong roles and weak roles. Like in chess, teams can't be all queens. It's about how you use all the pieces (for TOS2: how all the roles can coordinate). While it's true that chess's pawns and TOS2's coroner *can* be usefull, it is usually very hard to reach that result (compared to stronger roles). Some might like the challenge, the more luck reliant plays. But some would rather want more usefullness.
Maybe you didnt read what the devs answered you about this TOS1 situation, so i will copy/paste from the same page you used your own argument (same link as above. ironically because i was curious if it was actually reportable or not. And while searching, i found the very forum post YOU made about the ban appeal i mentioned above)
Dev: "Spamming votes is different from that (usual toxic spamming) for now. Votes are not visible in reports, thus you can still vote 4 times that to signal you being blackmailed."
Again, disrespecting moderators is neither nice or allowed. They are just doing their job at making sure players follow the rules. If you break the rules first, don't go blaming the mods for doing their jobs. It's like telling your teacher he gave you an unfair grade, while your paper is full of mistakes and wrong answers.
Hopefully, you have learned a few things from all of this. At the very least, do some actual research before going into a discussion you actually don't know much in details.
There is so much things wrong in this post. You say i got a "small ban" on my account and by small You mean permanent. Honestly, the first time i ever heard permanent ban being a small ban. Foolishness has no limits, i guess.
This is not the place to ban appeal nor am i intending to talk to a wall or two. You are welcome to read my review, and replies in that ban appeal. The judge was utterly beaten in the argument across several lanes, and ran away to 2nd moderator who did not even bother giving an explanation and just copy-pasted her usual automatic bot replies and finalized the ban. Even a former administrator commented on my review, agreed with me that at least some of the bans were unjust, plus vouched for my unban. But as i stated, i could not bother talking to a wall.
You say its not fair that i compare TOS to games like OW, LOL, etc. i was comparing the role power disparity among those games which is a fair comparison.
Normally, philosophers, scientists, etc would point at a difference, and then argue why that difference is crucial for the comparison to not be valid.
So for example, if i said it was fine to lock skins behind paywall in Counter-Strike, and argue that they do it too in other games such Town of Salem, then You can argue that this comparison is not right. Because skins in CS may blend differently with the environment, some better than others, making them P2W. Vice-versa, its long been claimed that taunts were P2W in TOS because of the interactions the dead could do with the players still alive, while they're usually pay-to-lose in other games. Since those interactions have been fixed, taunts are no longer P2W in TOS.
You say TOS is different from the other games named because its turn-based, which is straight up wrong. Like during the day, we can both talk simultaneously, unless some very specific things prevent us from doing so. If we both have day abilities, we can do them at the same time irrelevant of the other. If we have night abilities, the same thing holds.
i argue TOS also requires skill, albeit sometimes different from the skills required in FPS like CS. A Jailor gets a lot of information, and managing that information requires skill too. Reading and filtering out useless information is something only advanced players such as myself can do. Learning how to communicate is universal, in CS, Dota 2, TOS, etc.
And most importantly, i don't see how any of the differences You named matter when it concerns power disparity among roles. As i said, other games survived easily even with roles not being equally impactful. TOS can live long even if Jailor is giga broken and other Town roles are more situational.
Please try to not grasp at straws like 99% of the other people.
The rest shows Your lack of the game's very basics. For example, if the Jailor misexecutes someone, he/she only loses his/her Town Killing abilities. He/She can still 'protect', 'roleblock', and get information. You think that is useless? We must have played different games. Another Town Killing like Vigilante straight up dies if he/she shoots the wrong target.