Looks very interesting, but...

[Elegant Caveman]

I'm scared of getting hyped because there are too many anti-consumer things out there in the industry these days.

Third-party DRM (usually/especially Denuvo), anything having to do with Epic (Unreal engine, Epic Online Services, Easy Anti-Cheat), DX12 (practically forcing Windows 10).

I won't ask it to run on Windows 7 in 2022, but I'll at least hope it can run well on Linux through Proton (a native Linux build would be even better, of course, but Proton is better than nothing). I hear DX12 support for Proton is improving, though, so at least there's hope there... still better without it, though.

Third-party DRM and/or Epic's malware/spyware's a dealbreaker, though, so I really hope it won't have any of that, at least.

The game looks amazing, and I really hope I get to play it some day. Good luck to you.

[ffh_dzawor]

Hello Elegant Caveman - Thanks a lot for coming to our community group. As for the stuff you described - we are not planning to add DRM and I hope at least that will make you feel better about Forever Skies. Before the release, we will make Forever Skies available to test - maybe checking it out earlier will change your mind and raise your interest in it.

[Elegant Caveman]

Thanks, that's already some good news.

I'll definitely be keeping an eye on it! It looks like it could be a really amazing game.

Wishlisted and Followed for now.

Just gonna hope you'll stay away from Epic's stuff. *crosses fingers*

[ffh_dzawor]

Thank you for the wishlist and following us - we hope you will like the game!

[Elegant Caveman]

Originally posted by tes3isme:

How would there be no DRM when it's offered through Steam? Will it be sold/made available through a site without DRM (such as GOG) ... and I may be wrong but read that Steam and Epic (as well as others) are two that DO incorporate DRM's with the use of the site and games ... is this incorrect?. Am new to PC gaming so would like to be set correct about this subject reading this discussion thread on Forever Skies (which am following/awaiting release). Maybe I should link with Discord and start reading up :) THANKS IN ADVANCE and your're appreciated!

I asked specifically about third-party DRM.

I'm not a fan of any DRM, even Steam's, but it won't stop me from making a purchase. Adding some other kind likely would, though.

Steam does offer DRM through Steamworks, but it's up to developers (or publishers) whether they want to use it or not.

Games on Steam can be DRM-free.

https://steam.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_DRM-free_games

https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_big_list_of_DRM-free_games_on_Steam

[tes3isme]

Hey can DRM's be used to make sure that no tampering happens to the digital gaming code??? ... or all/most DRM's not used for that purpose (also)??? I usually hear negative things when DRM topic is brought up but is there another side to it ... ??? Would like to better understand the DRM/No-DRM controversy better.

[Elegant Caveman]

Originally posted by tes3isme:

Hey can DRM's be used to make sure that no tampering happens to the digital gaming code??? ... or all/most DRM's not used for that purpose (also)??? I usually hear negative things when DRM topic is brought up but is there another side to it ... ??? Would like to better understand the DRM/No-DRM controversy better.

What do you mean by "tampering to the digital gaming code"?

"Anti-tamper", in a general sense, is what DRM does, yes... depending on what you mean by that exactly, I guess?

By its very nature, the exact workings of DRM have to be obfuscated (if it was obvious, it would be even more useless than it already is), but the general idea is to stop people from altering things.

As for understanding the "controversy", it can be a tricky topic of discussion, as "Discussion of piracy" is against the Steam forum rules, and some of the more gung-ho and censorious mods (I mean in general; other communities) find the topic of DRM too closely related to all that.

I've seen threads locked or deleted, and people warned or banned, just for discussing the broader issue.

I don't know how the mods of this community feels about all that, but I guess the fact that this thread is still open is a good sign.

In a nutshell, it comes down to one side believing that DRM is necessary to protect the hard work of innocent devs, and the other side believing that this is (at least mostly) a corporate lie and that DRM does more to harm legitimate customers than to curtail the dastardly deeds of ne'er-do-wells.

If you'd like to read more about the topic, might I suggest what CDPR[www.giantbomb.com] (makers of the Witcher series) have to say about it, and Lars Doucet's[www.fortressofdoors.com] take (an indie dev).

Obviously, my stance on the issue is rather clear, considering I made this thread, so it should come as no surprise that both of those links reflect my personal bias.

They do a good job of encapsulating how I feel about the issue, though, and from developers themselves.

[Eressëa]

Using the cracked game for drm excuse or other anti cheat spyware, the video game industry's best lie.
Steam works well as a platform for teenagers but If i have the choice, i choose the gog platform and not just because it's drm-free.

[Elegant Caveman]

Originally posted by Eressëa:

Steam works well as a platform for teenagers but If i have the choice, i choose the gog platform and not just because it's drm-free.

I used to be a big fan of CDPR (owners of GOG), but I found out they recently signed a 15-year deal with Epic, so Steam remains my number one choice, especially since they're also more pro-linux.

[b1adam]

I would like to see GOG version

[Elegant Caveman]

Very disappointing to see it uses EOS after all.

Three years of hoping for nothing.

[Redeemer]

Originally posted by Elegant Caveman:

Very disappointing to see it uses EOS after all.

Three years of hoping for nothing.

Play it on a Virtual Machine if you're that invested

[Tigerhawk71]

Originally posted by Elegant Caveman:

Very disappointing to see it uses EOS after all.

Three years of hoping for nothing.

Both Valve and Epic are partially Chinese owned, so i don't really see the issue. It's just another launcher.

[Elegant Caveman]

Originally posted by Redeemer:

Play it on a Virtual Machine if you're that invested

I'm not. Still disappointing.

Guess I should have expected it, when the dev explicitly said they wouldn't use DRM, but never commented on my repeated mentions of Epic.

Originally posted by Tigerhawk71:

Both Valve and Epic are partially Chinese owned, so i don't really see the issue. It's just another launcher.

This isn't about China, nor is it about a launcher.

I've chosen to do business with Valve, and engage with their ecosystem. I've chosen to stay as far away from Epic's ecosystem as possible, so I hate how they try to force their way into everything with EOS and EAC.

Curious to hear more about how much of Valve is owned by China, though. I'm aware Tencent owns 35% of Epic.

[Redeemer]

/shrug I suppose

[Asmosis]

At this point i think Tencent owns part of every major game studio.