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So no one gets confused, there's definitely a soft cap and you just described it a weird way. In souls games, it would be when leveling the stat generally isn't worth what you spend to get it because the return has noticeably dropped.
The reason people say capacity doesn't have a soft cap is because your weight limit increases about the same amount at all levels. A stat like technique drops hard in how it affects your scaling around level 30-40. Past that, you'll get something like 0-1 damage increase per level even with an S scaling. It's not a hard cap since it does still affect your stats when leveled even if its low.
LoP has diminishing returns on all stats except capacity. LoP doesnt have any "soft caps".
Soft cap is a distinct and universal (same for all players) point where very sharp drop occurs. Its usually obvious when you make a chart. For example in ER vigor has soft cap at 40. Up to 40 you actually get gradually more HP from each point invested in vigor (so its the opposite of diminishing returns, increasing returns). Going from 39 to 40 gives you +38 HP. But then going from 40 to 41 gives you only +26. A sudden drop at specific point. This is what soft cap is.
This means that in most cases you should level vigor up to 40 and stop precisely there. And then only touch vigor again after reaching similar soft caps on all other stats you use.
LoP doesnt have any points like this. You just gradually get less and less each time, from 1 to 100. This is called "diminishing returns". This means that its entirely up to the player to decide where its not worth anymore. This system creates somewhat different scenario. You can decide to return to the stat in question and level it up again much sooner than with a system full of soft caps. And this is why different players will always give you different numbers for LoP stats when you ask them for "soft caps".
A soft cap doesn't exist without diminishing returns, otherwise it would be a hard cap. The level that would be considered a soft cap is where that diminishing return is too great to be worth the investment.
Soft cap is always a specific number where obvious and sudden drop occurs.
LoP doesnt have any soft caps. Its subjective and different for everyone where its no longer worth investing into a stat. And this also constantly moves. Your percieved "soft caps" at level 100 will be very different from what you think is worth at level 150.
While in a game that actually has soft caps they always stay the same.
To reiterate diminishing returns is a function. Soft cap is a point.
ER guide with some graphs explaining soft caps aka breakpoints
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2765060616
I haven't backpedaled, I'm saying the same thing as when I started.
I'm not gaslighting, I'm telling you why what you're saying is playing semantics. If I were to do the same, I'd start by saying how you don't understand what gaslighting or backpedaling means if you're using that here. You also make it clear the kind of things you focus on in your free time using those terms when they don't apply.
Can you explain how a soft cap can exist without diminishing returns since I made the statement that it can't exist otherwise? If the return begins to drop (diminishing return), it eventually gets to a point where that return is too low to spend on (soft cap). If the value never drops, there would be no diminishing return. If it stops completely, it would be a hard cap.
It also seems like you're trying to hide behind the idea of opinions can't be wrong if what's worth to one person might not be worth to someone else. The return on any expense has an objective worth in a game like this and where that begins to not be worth is the soft cap.
I've said my point twice in this post alone which is what I started with; very clearing not backpedaling and I stand by what I say without grasping for debate terms.
Soft cap cant exist without diminishing returns but that doesnt mean they are one and the same. Soft cap is a breakpoint where diminishing returns either start occuring or significantly change. No such points in LoP. Its smooth curve here.
That is specifically saying a soft cap and diminishing returns is the same thing because if a soft cap exists when returns are diminished, one can't exist without the other. I don't agree with that and I was never saying that, I'm just pointing out how you're making less sense now.
This is not at all what I said.
Soft cap cant exists without diminishing returns because its a breakpoint at which diminishing returns start or change. But diminishing returns can exist without soft caps. Unless you also consider 1 a soft cap. Then yea, LoP soft caps are 1 in all stats except capacity. This is where diminishing returns start. And then they never suddenly change.
This is NOT what soft cap/breakpoint is.
Soft cap is a speficic breakpoint where change on graph occurs. Not where its no longer worth spending. The former can significantly influence the latter but they are not the same thing at all.
How do you not realize you just used soft cap interchangeably with diminishing returns in that statement? It's like you aren't thinking about what you're saying because what you just said is when any change happens, you'd call it a soft cap.
Soft cap very specifically is associated with the worth of what you spend and what you get back. You're even agreeing with me in a lot of what you're saying but then don't want to admit that you're agreeing. You just explain it in a roundabout way then back off when you have to consider worth which is fundamental to a soft cap.
This is not what Im saying. And Im not using soft cap and dim returns interchangeably. This is what you do, not me.
You really arent getting the concept of soft caps aka breakpoints and desperately push your own wrong understanding on others. Even going so far as to claim that Im saying the same things as you but differently. The difference is clear as day to me, I dont understand why you are so confused.
Nope. I didnt say anything about "any change". "Any change" happens at every point.
Breakpoint is where you see significant, instantly noticable, difference in returns compared to the point just before it (not 20 points before, it has to be compared to the point right before it).
If you see a gradual decrease and then realize that now you get much less value than 20 points ago this is not a breakpoint, not a soft cap. This is just how any smooth curve of dim returns works.
But when in ER you actually get increasing returns up to 40 vigor and then 41th point gives you slightly more than half of what 40th point gave - this is breakpoint. This is soft cap.
What you call "soft cap" is probably best called "optimal value" which is subjective thing influenced by other factors (such as actual soft caps/breakpoints and where your other stats are at the moment).
"People" are using the term correctly. At least in linked guide and pretty much every other similar guide with graphs. So dont bring "people" into this.