Against the Storm

Against the Storm

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Mr_Zayder Jan 7, 2024 @ 10:04am
How do you set-up a run ?
Hey there;

I'm currently addicted to the game (it's cheaper than crack) and so far I play on Pioneer.
I'd like to ask your expertise for setting up a run.

Before a run, in the conditions of the map, there are natural resources which limits the nodes that will be on the map (like no roots/herbs/clay etc).

So when you see this, what is your through process for choosing the direction your run goes to in terms of resources ?

When I see meat, mushrooms, copper and grain on the Marshlands, i'd typically go for tools/barrels, smoked jerky/ale and try to get cloth + bricks through vendors.

If my crew is Harpi/human/beaver, i'd try a biscuit run with herbs and herb garden.

Is that thinking leading me to bad habits that could prevent me on playing higher difficulties ?
So far it's working but you never know :-)

Thanks in Advance <3
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Showing 1-15 of 43 comments
mostly willing Jan 7, 2024 @ 10:36am 
knowing which resources a map has is great and helps make informed decisions, but don't go in thinking you will be able to go in a particular direction. AtS is all about adapting to the hand you are given. pick stuff you can make use of right away and avoid speculative picks. baked foods are particularly bad with this, bc they depend entirely on you drawing a flour bp in addition to securing a steady flow of resources for it.
Mack Jan 7, 2024 @ 11:17am 
I've got as far as the winning of second seal (I'm about level 9 iirc) and generally embark bonuses I pick more initial pops + stone and any leftover is wood or coal depending on points.

Picking orders I base upon if the are giving Tools or Parts. Only if I think that the task will be completely impossible will I choose something else.

Food strat will be:

* Get the Small Farm or Plantation
* Ranch
From there you have two major options:
1) Jerky (Kiln or Cellar) and can progress to Skewers with a Cookhouse
2) Flour (Provisioner or Rain Mill) + Brick Oven or Bakery + Herbs/Meat/Eggs = Pie

or

* Small Farm
* Flour (Provisioner or Rain Mill)
* Biscuits (Bakery/Cookhouse or Smelter)
* Biscuits also require Herbs & Berries so the Herb Garden or Plantation makes the whole chain self sustaining if you can get another patch of fields (or when you're industry gets going, trading for the ingredients)

The key requirements to complete maps are getting a tool production facility up and running, and hopefully getting a Kiln to make Coal. In the initial runs in the lower Seal levels your main win condition will be using Tools to get reputation level up by clearing caches.

I usually consider the key industry buildings to be:
* Woodcutters
* Planks
* Copper Bars
* Tools

This makes the following buildings very important:
* Mines
* Carpenter (Tools + Planks!)
* Smelter (Copper Bars)
* Kiln (Bricks + Jerky + Coal)

There is one other building worth mentioning, the Forester's Hut so keep and eye out for it. It lets you completely bypass Copper, as long as you have enough fields. It can transform a "hmm I don't know" run into a certain victory by ensuring you have both sources of inputs for Tools, Pipes & Training Gear.

And secondarily important are Fabric, Bricks and Pipes. They aren't quite as critical to the chain of winning at the initial stages of play-throughs. Once I get a few rain collectors up and running, there's the need for the blight fighters & hydrants, get the pipes into my production buildings and whack them up to the highest level to product quickly.

Expand as rapidly as you can to find more farm fields to feed your people and wood to cut down, keep adding new warehouses, you might want a second hearth when you're in the late game of a map, and start cutting through to glades. Certain other products can be used for glade events, and they seem to be pipes, training gear and incense. So if I have a lot of amber I'll buy them in trading if they come up.

Eventually I will reach a point where I don't really need much more production, if the tool factory is producing, I will just stick a unit into every cache, set them to the loyalty option and leave it.

Eventually the tools will be made and they'll clear it, and give me the rep bonus. At that point I'm just clearing through glades and making sure I'm not going to run out of wood or food and will get surprised at some point when the final cache gets cleared and it pops the win.

One major thing you'll need to do is limit your production quantities and what inputs are being used (eg: don't waste crystalied dew on making tea, or using all your resources on Packs for Trading) and when you've got your food production chains going, limit consumption so your people don't eat what you need to make the complex food.

Note, I'm not very advanced so this isn't some expert guide, just what I've been doing so far for 95% success and no seal failures in about 60 runs.
Last edited by Mack; Jan 7, 2024 @ 11:25am
Matthew Jan 7, 2024 @ 1:06pm 
For set up I mostly just grab the villager embark and pick whichever species option gives me the most villagers.

For the first 3 bp's, I try to pick things which are useful no matter what. Lumber production is good. Tool production is okay to pull out in case of a plan B and need to send crates for points. Provisioner typically won't go to waste.

From there, I adjust to what the map is giving me. Service buildings are a good goal to work towards, though. The combination of high resolve and the bonus that building gives is typically far better than keeping complex foods going. 3 humans in a tavern serving ale will go farther than trying to turn the wheat into biscuits.

Also, fuel sources seem to be more useful as you increase difficulties. Cutting wood causes a lot of hostility and I find myself turning them off more often during storms. Marrow and coal help smooth out those periods without chopping.

I tend to ignore the smaller glades for the same reason, except maybe the first one or two. They just add hostility and chopping time. The larger glades give victory points and building space.
mostly willing Jan 7, 2024 @ 1:13pm 
2
Originally posted by Mack:
I've got as far as the winning of second seal (I'm about level 9 iirc) and generally embark bonuses I pick more initial pops + stone and any leftover is wood or coal depending on points.

Food strat will be:

* Get the Small Farm or Plantation
* Ranch
From there you have two major options:
1) Jerky (Kiln or Cellar) and can progress to Skewers with a Cookhouse
2) Flour (Provisioner or Rain Mill) + Brick Oven or Bakery + Herbs/Meat/Eggs = Pie

or

* Small Farm
* Flour (Provisioner or Rain Mill)
* Biscuits (Bakery/Cookhouse or Smelter)
* Biscuits also require Herbs & Berries so the Herb Garden or Plantation makes the whole chain self sustaining if you can get another patch of fields (or when you're industry gets going, trading for the ingredients)

The key requirements to complete maps are getting a tool production facility up and running, and hopefully getting a Kiln to make Coal. In the initial runs in the lower Seal levels your main win condition will be using Tools to get reputation level up by clearing caches.

I usually consider the key industry buildings to be:
* Woodcutters
* Planks
* Copper Bars
* Tools

This makes the following buildings very important:
* Mines
* Carpenter (Tools + Planks!)
* Smelter (Copper Bars)
* Kiln (Bricks + Jerky + Coal)

There is one other building worth mentioning, the Forester's Hut so keep and eye out for it. It lets you completely bypass Copper, as long as you have enough fields. It can transform a "hmm I don't know" run into a certain victory by ensuring you have both sources of inputs for Tools, Pipes & Training Gear.

And secondarily important are Fabric, Bricks and Pipes. They aren't quite as critical to the chain of winning at the initial stages of play-throughs. Once I get a few rain collectors up and running, there's the need for the blight fighters & hydrants, get the pipes into my production buildings and whack them up to the highest level to product quickly.

Expand as rapidly as you can to find more farm fields to feed your people and wood to cut down, keep adding new warehouses, you might want a second hearth when you're in the late game of a map, and start cutting through to glades. Certain other products can be used for glade events, and they seem to be pipes, training gear and incense. So if I have a lot of amber I'll buy them in trading if they come up.

Eventually I will reach a point where I don't really need much more production, if the tool factory is producing, I will just stick a unit into every cache, set them to the loyalty option and leave it.

Eventually the tools will be made and they'll clear it, and give me the rep bonus. At that point I'm just clearing through glades and making sure I'm not going to run out of wood or food and will get surprised at some point when the final cache gets cleared and it pops the win.

One major thing you'll need to do is limit your production quantities and what inputs are being used (eg: don't waste crystalied dew on making tea, or using all your resources on Packs for Trading) and when you've got your food production chains going, limit consumption so your people don't eat what you need to make the complex food.

Note, I'm not very advanced so this isn't some expert guide, just what I've been doing so far for 95% success and no seal failures in about 60 runs.
most of what this person describes is bad habits. ranch is literally the worst bp in the game. avoid forester hut, don't rely on getting a small farm or plantation (don't ever pick 3 different fertile soil buildings, 2 is already bad), don't instapick kiln. tool production is in no way a key requirement for winning. regular rain collectors are pretty bad. a second hearth is a priority, not just a late game thing. expanding as rapidly as you can is a good way to rack up a lot of hostility.
Rubyeyed Jan 7, 2024 @ 1:51pm 
Why is second hearth a priority? I feel like I might have missed something crucial. So far I have always played with the starting one to save on fuel.
el Darkness Jan 7, 2024 @ 2:41pm 
Small Hearth reduces Hostility by 35 and if you manage to upgrade it (not a hard task) it gives you +2 Resolve. These effects are quite strong, while I like to upgrade my main Hearth to lvl 3, it is much easier to build 2 small Hearths and upgrade them to lvl 1.
Last edited by el Darkness; Jan 7, 2024 @ 2:41pm
Mr_Zayder Jan 7, 2024 @ 2:41pm 
Originally posted by Rubyeyed:
Why is second hearth a priority? I feel like I might have missed something crucial. So far I have always played with the starting one to save on fuel.
2nd Hearth gives the same boost of the 1st. So an extra +2 on global resolve and an extra +10% global production too.

You should level the first one fairly fast (all it takes for lvl 1 is 8 woods, lvl 2 takes another 8 woods and 4 planks, for 10% prod speed, it's golden) and build the 2nd around year 4-5 i'd say.
Last edited by Mr_Zayder; Jan 7, 2024 @ 3:13pm
Mr_Zayder Jan 7, 2024 @ 2:46pm 
Originally posted by a mostly willing son:
most of what this person describes is bad habits. ranch is literally the worst bp in the game. avoid forester hut, don't rely on getting a small farm or plantation (don't ever pick 3 different fertile soil buildings, 2 is already bad), don't instapick kiln. tool production is in no way a key requirement for winning. regular rain collectors are pretty bad. a second hearth is a priority, not just a late game thing. expanding as rapidly as you can is a good way to rack up a lot of hostility.

How is ranch the worst when it creates unlimited supply of meat ? I just unlocked it and didn't play it yet.

I really try to avoid the fertile soil BP but then you have to explore more aggressively to keep up with the food no ?

I take a farming BP if I find fertile soil in the first or 2nd dangerous glave (I do the 1st one year 2 and the 2nd dangerous glave year 3).

I just did the 2nd seal and i'm level 6 (and play on pioneer atm), and so far the fertile soil has been a solid support. Maybe not a game changer, but it helps so much for the food that you can just focus on other things.

Regardless, thanks to everyone that is participating in this thread !
mostly willing Jan 7, 2024 @ 3:23pm 
Originally posted by Mr_Zayder:
How is ranch the worst when it creates unlimited supply of meat ? I just unlocked it and didn't play it yet.
ranch is the only bp in the game that turns raw resources into other raw resources. that makes it the least efficient way you could spend your labor. not to say that you can't play around it - it has its fans, but you'd be better off doing literally anything else the vast majority of time. it is a noob trap precisely because it looks like "unlimited supply of meat/leather/eggs".
Originally posted by Mr_Zayder:
I really try to avoid the fertile soil BP but then you have to explore more aggressively to keep up with the food no ?

I take a farming BP if I find fertile soil in the first or 2nd dangerous glave (I do the 1st one year 2 and the 2nd dangerous glave year 3).
you don't need that much food to win. what you should do is focus on multiplying your food. setting up production for any complex food is a significant boost to your food reserves. porridge is extremely easy to get going, as long as you find a Drizzle/Clearance geyser. jerky is pretty easy, too. pickles are a great option if you find some containers in a cache or get some from a glade event. buying them from a trader is super viable
once you have production going, go to Consumption Control and ban your villagers from eating raw foods
farms aren't bad. they have their place
mostly willing Jan 7, 2024 @ 3:37pm 
Originally posted by Rubyeyed:
Why is second hearth a priority? I feel like I might have missed something crucial. So far I have always played with the starting one to save on fuel.
you should always build a second hearth, as long as you have the pop to get it to level 1 and fuel for it. one hearth is 50-60 wood/year before modifiers. that's about one woodcutter worth of fuel, give or take. the fuel burn duration perk is very good if fuel is a concern, especially when paired up with a beaver fire keeper. full citadel + beaver fire keeper + secrets of the fire keepers puts you at a little below 20 wood/year/hearth. if you have a coal mine, that's below 6 coal/year/hearth. even in the worst case scenario you are not going to have to dedicate more than 2 workers to fuel in these conditions.
silkforcalde Jan 7, 2024 @ 6:57pm 
I typically base things around the biome, but I always start the same way in year 1. Build three woodcutter camps, park at least one next to the first dangerous glade I'm going to unlock (based on proximity to things like my hearth and warehouse, if it gets me lined up for a forbidden glade, etc.) and fully staff them for the entire first year. Second year I'll read the situation, I might see it as best to staff them fully again, often I don't and I destroy the third woodcutter camp, I generally always destroy the third camp by year 3 (unless I'm on veteran or lower and then I'll never destroy the third camp). Obviously this isn't going to be the case if I have the modifier where I don't get resources back for destroying buildings.

I also build paths at this time. A path around the warehouse, a path around the hearth, paths connecting them, and paths to my camps. Next up, depending on how many villagers I have, I build camps next to the small nodes in my base, I'll probably start harvesting these during the storm. Prioritize food over things like stone / clay. Once that's set then I'll build my makeshift post and crude workstation so I can get started on that stuff immediately. If my resolve is a bit low I'll build three shelters and a park to get a level 1 hearth immediately. If I have harpies I'll build a harpy house (this is dependent on unlocks, if I don't have fabric from the start this will not be an option without making some quickly in the crude workstation).

During the storm, right before I unlock my first glade, I build a trader so I can buy stuff if I need to in order to finish the event. I also build a rain collector and a field kitchen to immediately start on complex food but this is not going to be something to think about at all for you because you're so low in progression, field kitchen is unlocked pretty deep in the tree and rainwater will be mostly useless for you at this stage of the game.

When the storm hits I remove my woodcutters, put them into the camps and industry buildings I've built, look at my orders / blueprints and decide what I want to push for, and crack into the glade right before year 2 starts so I can get started on it immediately. What's in that glade largely determines my path.
Rubyeyed Jan 7, 2024 @ 7:21pm 
I just played with 2 hearths and indeed it should be a priority. Gains are massive. Thanks for the tips.
Beowulf Jan 7, 2024 @ 9:08pm 
Perhaps it would be helpful if we mentioned what difficulty we played on along with the tips cause the stratagy someone uses on much higher diffuclty is going be radically diffrenet than on lower ones.

For example, i'm currently up to prestige 10 and still working my way up and my recommendation would be to try and get a building to produce some kind of trade good weather it's luxury, crops, building, or trade goods.

Simple fact of how this game is set up is that you can't produce everything. Weather it's complex food or resources because you didn't get the blueprint for it, you got the blueprint for it but your missing one for something lower in the chain, or you have everything but you didn't get the resources nodes in the glades you need, sooner or later you are going need to make a compromise.

This is where trade goods come in since the one thing you can for sure depend on are the traders coming through and their going have things you can't make, things that you could use more, and things that you need for glade events to get them under control as long as you can buy it from them.

Even considering on prestige 10 that everything you sell is going to be at half price, it still makes it more than worth it to have some kind of production up since you can use a wide veriaty of goods in them meaning that you are probably going have something that you could use esspcially if production has stalled somewhere on your chain for whatever reason.

On top of this the buildings that make those goods always make two other products that you can also use such as the Press which gives you oil, flour, and luxery goods.

Beyond that though there's not really any single stratagy I could suggest since by the very nature of the game means that you might not get the buildings for it, the situation your will mean that you need to do something to survive, or you get a cornerstone that makes you want to pivot to something else. Just keep in mind not to settle on any single idea, focus on what you can use now instead of hopefully sometime in the future, and figure out what you can do with what you have.
Last edited by Beowulf; Jan 7, 2024 @ 9:10pm
lethminite Jan 7, 2024 @ 9:44pm 
Originally posted by a mostly willing son:
Originally posted by Mr_Zayder:
How is ranch the worst when it creates unlimited supply of meat ? I just unlocked it and didn't play it yet.
ranch is the only bp in the game that turns raw resources into other raw resources. that makes it the least efficient way you could spend your labor. not to say that you can't play around it - it has its fans, but you'd be better off doing literally anything else the vast majority of time. it is a noob trap precisely because it looks like "unlimited supply of meat/leather/eggs".

I don't understand this logic.
The ranch is going to be good/bad based on recipe time and efficiency, not because it produces raw resources.
If say, you have 3 villagers, 1 on fiber, and 2 on meat, conceptually, with the ranch, you could have 2 of fiber, and 1 on ranch, and get the same amount of resources, for the same labour, but using less nodes.

If anything, I'd have assumed the ability to go from basic to basic makes it something that can add another set of multipliers into your production chain.

To me it's strength is just that it lets you convert resources into what you need, particularly in royal woodland, where meat is rare, but farmland is common, letting you turn that grain into meat/eggs to then make jerky/pie etc

I remember, it used to be 'the' building, but I think got nerfed pretty heavily a long time ago. I haven't actually done the numbers to work out if it's strong or not in isolation, but I'll pick it up any time it fixes a hole in my production chain.
arjensmit79 Jan 7, 2024 @ 9:44pm 
Honestly, it doesn't do much to direct the way the game goes.

The thing, what resources can be present doesn't mean they will be present. So you will have to do with what you find anyway.

The game is about adepting to the situation, not about planing what you are going to build. This will be more and more pronounced as you go up in difficulty.

Of course you can have general guidelines as to where you want to go, but those don't really depend on the biome. Like you know you want to secure food and fuel. You want to do your orders. And most effective strtategy is to produce trade value (packs of trade/lux) and trade for every advanced food and luxury resource you could ever wish for. Thats kind of the base plan. It may change depending on map modifiers (like no traders, no orders) or it can change a bit depending on what happens in your game and the cornerstones you find.

And i didnt read all the details of the other posts, but let me assure the new reader, a most willing son is one of the most knowledgable posters out here.
Last edited by arjensmit79; Jan 7, 2024 @ 9:52pm
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Date Posted: Jan 7, 2024 @ 10:04am
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