Why does magic have so much homing?

[Skull of a Crowned Athlete]

If I run away sideways from magic it still isn't enough to avoid getting hit. If I jump away from magic while running sideways it's still not enough to avoid getting hit. Especially in PvP

[Narm]

Originally posted by Dr.Falcon:

You can sprint to dodge, mostly, any spell in the game. Spells similar to Stars of Ruin, Glintstone Stars and Star Shower, linger around during their tracking long enough to catch through I-frames. Stars of Ruin, despite being way more balanced than at launch, still chips through rolling.

However, spells like Comet, Comet Shard, Glintstone Dart, and most other spells can be side stepped. If your opponent locks on to you while casting it's fairly easy to side step or run. A player would have to free aim really, really well in order to fire accurate spells at you that can still be dodged or quick-stepped.

Carian Slicer and Carian Piercer must be rolled through as their tracking is really, really good. Adula's Moonblade also requires a roll most of the time, unless if your far enough away to run away from the cast.

You may be starting to run too late. There is a specific timing you can get down to notice when your opponent is casting a spell to start sprinting perpendicular to their cast. On a good connection against "filthy wizards :praisesun:" in the arena, I personally don't find it challenging to dodge spells. There is a timing to get down and any amount of practice can help. :er_heart:

I generally agree, but you didn't mention how important positioning is. Whether or not you can sprint to avoid a spell, highly depends on how far away you are, and it varies between spells (because they have different velocity and turning radius). Like, you can't sprint to avoid stars of ruin unless your're fairly close, whereas swiftshard is the opposite. Then you have something like frost shard, where you can sprint to avoid it no matter the distance. You can straight up just run in a zigzag at them and weave inbetween all the frost shards.

Do note that stars of ruin has different tracking than glintstone stars and star shower. Those two are harder to avoid and you'll almost certainly get chipped. Pretty sure they function like the pre-nerf stars of ruin in terms of tracking.

Slicer and moonblade obviously have to be rolled, but an uncharged piercer can be avoided by sprinting sometimes. Fully charged has weirdly good tracking, so run away or roll.

But yeah, you can sprint to dodge almost any homing sorcery. Just gotta know the proper direction for your current distance, and be able to quickly recognize the spell from the cast animation and sound. Even then, sometimes, you will have to roll. There's now way to avoid that.

[Skull of a Crowned Athlete]

Originally posted by Narm:

Whether or not you can sprint to avoid a spell, highly depends on how far away you are, and it varies between spells (because they have different velocity and turning radius). Like, you can't sprint to avoid stars of ruin unless your're fairly close,

Do note that stars of ruin has different tracking than glintstone stars and star shower. Those two are harder to avoid and you'll almost certainly get chipped. Pretty sure they function like the pre-nerf stars of ruin in terms of tracking.

I looked up stars of ruin and that's the spell I was talking about. Even when rolling you'll likely get chipped. Magic infused fingerprint shield works at the very least.

[Narm]

Originally posted by QuackHead:

Originally posted by Narm:

Whether or not you can sprint to avoid a spell, highly depends on how far away you are, and it varies between spells (because they have different velocity and turning radius). Like, you can't sprint to avoid stars of ruin unless your're fairly close,

Do note that stars of ruin has different tracking than glintstone stars and star shower. Those two are harder to avoid and you'll almost certainly get chipped. Pretty sure they function like the pre-nerf stars of ruin in terms of tracking.

I looked up stars of ruin and that's the spell I was talking about. Even when rolling you'll likely get chipped. Magic infused fingerprint shield works at the very least.

Yeah, but that's kinda a lazy solution in my opinion. Makes me feel like I'm griefing them more than beating them. To each their own though. Certainly the easiest counter.

With melee builds, I'd usually sprint diagonally and roll it the best I can to try to close the gap ASAP, then stay on them so they can't cast without getting punished. You gotta be really careful about attack timing and trading though, because a good sorcerer still has a lot of heavy hitters at that distance, and moonveil will wreck you if you don't bait and punish.

I also like beast's roar for dealing with casters. It's a pretty speedy weapon art so you can punish casting at a distance while you close the gap. Works really well on low poise casters because you can cancel their casts. Sometimes you can even predict when they're gonna cast and preemptively punish faster casts.

And on faith builds, erdtree's protection or barrier of gold for magic resist will also make casters a lot easier to manage. And you can use lightning spear like beast's roar.

Casters are certainly tricky to figure out how to deal with for melee players. Takes a while to learn all the spells and how to avoid them. And some weapons just don't have attacks that are fast enough and with enough reach to hit a backpedaling caster. Always gotta have something for chasing and pressuring prepared.

[Legiondorf]

It must suck for melee but as the guy that fires off some casts it sucks when melee roll.

[Dr.Falcon]

I recommend heavy thrusting swords, the Nagakiba, spears, and halberds for dealing with casters. Always be prepared with a weapon using quickstep or BHS if casters decide to use those AoW's to back-pedal.

The reach of the weapons I listed do the best at closing gaps while still being fast enough to buffer roll out of spam if needed. AoW's like Thunderbolt, Beast's Roar, Storm Blade, and Sacred Blade allow melee builds to pressure at range. The Dragonking Cragblade AoW can be used to hyper armor trade with slow close range spells like piercer or moonblade. Piercing Fang and Sword Dance are good options as gap closer's as well. If a caster is overtly aggressive with slicer you can stack Roar Medallion, Highland Axe, and Braggart's Roar on a weapon to hyper armor trade...likely beating them in one hit. Slicer can also be parried with Carian Retaliation.

The objective of a duel is to survive. So while chip damage is annoying, at some point your opponent has to come in and face you. Swap it up and play passive so they have to play offensive, baiting them into a favorable spot. Playing against a magic user as a melee is a different dynamic. The matches will be slower, generally, and exploiting openings will become more important. FP is limited by flasks as well. Use any advantage you can get, be patient, and observe there play-style to see when they might need to sip for FP or go for a "Big Spell" that opens them up.

[Narm]

Originally posted by Dr.Falcon:

Slicer can also be parried with Carian Retaliation.

Actually, I'm pretty sure slicer can be parried with any parry. Pretty sure I've had it parried with just a basic buckler parry.

[WhiteMamba]

I guess you're talking about Star Shower. I dont like this spell, but otherwise it would be nearly impossible to hit anyone with it. Other spells that track so good are Loretta Mastery, Rancorcall and Spiral Shards. 1st is rarely used in pvp (ppl sleeping on it, my fav spell btw :D), 2nd and 3rd is slow and doesnt hit hard. Rest of the spells track just a little to hit someone sidestepping and that's it.

My tip for star shower: roll forward right, then forward left. If you can just close the distance - this is the safest. And if you dont want rolling - jump forward at the time the spell is casted and then run forward, the stars will go above your head.

[Martini]

Originally posted by QuackHead:

Originally posted by Sabaithal:

You have to move a certain way to avoid getting hit. I'm not sure how to explain this clearly...

If you're far away from a magic bolt when its fired, and you immediately start trying to sidestep it, its going to home in a lot earlier and track you better unless you suddenly reverse direction when it gets close.

Whereas if you only move to evade it when it gets closer it won't track you nearly as well, you can dodge it much easier.

On another note, your dodge grants you temporary invincibility at the start of the animation, to about the halfway point. You can use this to phase right through most oncoming attacks in general, including projectiles.

I know about roll i-frames of course. Rolling to avoid magic is easy and low skill though

Ah. So it's bait.

[Tetsuya_Kurogane]

95% off the spell I cast in PvP never hit. It is a tool for spacing and keeping pressure.

[Scheneighnay]

Originally posted by Tetsuya_Kurogane:

95% off the spell I cast in PvP never hit. It is a tool for spacing and keeping pressure.

All you need is Cannon of Haima to make your opponent ♥♥♥♥ their pants and panic roll away.
That and gravitas but that's a weapon art

[HEX]

Every souls game have homing in range attack, pyromancies (in most cases) have no homing, but pretty powerfull when you land a hit with them, that true for pretty good damage sorc. or they are slow enought to dodge it, i'm that kind of people who hate Sorcery in souls (some build are too cancerous but maybe it's only DS3 problem because i pvp a lot in it) can accept it

[Scheneighnay]

Originally posted by _Kreeg:

Every souls game have homing in range attack, pyromancies (in most cases) have no homing, but pretty powerfull when you land a hit with them, that true for pretty good damage sorc. or they are slow enought to dodge it, i'm that kind of people who hate Sorcery in souls (some build are too cancerous but maybe it's only DS3 problem because i pvp a lot in it) can accept it

Fact of the matter is that in DS3, sorcery was the only really practical spell class in PVP.
Sure there's a couple of exceptions like chaos bed vesteges, but everything else will either never hit, deal no damage, or both.

[HEX]

Don't think so, pyro usable, short range one's

[HEX]

Originally posted by Scheneighnay:

Originally posted by _Kreeg:

Every souls game have homing in range attack, pyromancies (in most cases) have no homing, but pretty powerfull when you land a hit with them, that true for pretty good damage sorc. or they are slow enought to dodge it, i'm that kind of people who hate Sorcery in souls (some build are too cancerous but maybe it's only DS3 problem because i pvp a lot in it) can accept it

Fact of the matter is that in DS3, sorcery was the only really practical spell class in PVP.
Sure there's a couple of exceptions like chaos bed vesteges, but everything else will either never hit, deal no damage, or both.

Almost useless is miracles, maybe force and Lightning Arrow, and one short range AoE with good poise, forget the name

[Jack]

...because, like in D&D, attack spells require a target.
Unless they have magical defense, IE - Armor, shield, or a skill that negates magic - it's going to hit them unless they can dodge it with their AC.

It's a force of will, my man.
If I am 'willing' this dart to move toward a target, it's going to home onto them.