I guess FS does care about PvP

[mpcgannon]

I can't see anyone getting salty...

[Elazul]

Originally posted by cheep crybabby hatter:

Originally posted by Elazul:

They should. People that are into PvP are their core audience that keeps playing the game after beating the PvE portion.

I'm not sure I see your point.

It's not hard to figure out. PvE people will finish the game and move onto the next game. PvP people will give the game staying power and keep playing long after they finish all the PvE encounters that are available.

[hemorrhage911]

Originally posted by Elazul:

Originally posted by cheep crybabby hatter:

I'm not sure I see your point.

It's not hard to figure out. PvE people will finish the game and move onto the next game. PvP people will give the game staying power and keep playing long after they finish all the PvE encounters that are available.

Hardcore PVP is a niche - there is a reason PVP is so stripped down in this game. Fromsoftware doesn't care about it staying active 6 months after release, they aren't making money off the online side of things.

[Narm]

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

Hardcore PVP is a niche - there is a reason PVP is so stripped down in this game. Fromsoftware doesn't care about it staying active 6 months after release, they aren't making money off the online side of things.

I think the point is more that the dedicated PvP'ers that keep playing will keep talking about it, which will lead to additional sales in the future. Rather than completely fizzling out and being forgotten. Keeping that dedicated group playing is basically free marketing.

[Koala 4peace]

Originally posted by Narm:

I think the point is more that the dedicated PvP'ers that keep playing will keep talking about it, which will lead to additional sales in the future. Rather than completely fizzling out and being forgotten. Keeping that dedicated group playing is basically free marketing.

Not sure this future free "marketing" justifies even the cost of the matchmaking server maintenance, and Elden Ring has proven that Elden Ring is the marketing. This game will keep selling for a looooong time, PvP or not.

[cheep crybabby hatter]

Originally posted by Elazul:

Originally posted by cheep crybabby hatter:

I'm not sure I see your point.

It's not hard to figure out. PvE people will finish the game and move onto the next game. PvP people will give the game staying power and keep playing long after they finish all the PvE encounters that are available.

Sure they'll stick around... not paying a cent more for continuously draining resources. Why should FromSoft want them sticking around, at least, moreso than PVE players? What makes them more worthy of catering to?

An analogy: you're running a cafe. Person A and person B order a coffee each morning. Person A orders hers to go, pays for it, then gets out as quickly as possible. On the other hand, Person B always sits, plugs in his laptop, and begins draining your power, using your wifi, and occupying a table all morning. Both people paid the same price for a single coffee, but person B is more of a fixture in your cafe. Who do you value more?

I guess I just don't see the inherent value of PVP. Like PVE players, PVP players will also eventually move on to the next thing. It'll take longer, and I'm not sure why taking longer is supposed to be a positive.

[BoxerDanc]

Originally posted by cheep crybabby hatter:

Originally posted by Elazul:

It's not hard to figure out. PvE people will finish the game and move onto the next game. PvP people will give the game staying power and keep playing long after they finish all the PvE encounters that are available.

Sure they'll stick around... not paying a cent more for continuously draining resources. Why should FromSoft want them sticking around, at least, moreso than PVE players? What makes them more worthy of catering to?

An analogy: you're running a cafe. Person A and person B order a coffee each morning. Person A orders hers to go, pays for it, then gets out as quickly as possible. On the other hand, Person B always sits, plugs in his laptop, and begins draining your power, using your wifi, and occupying a table all morning. Both people paid the same price for a single coffee, but person B is more of a fixture in your cafe. Who do you value more?

I guess I just don't see the inherent value of PVP. Like PVE players, PVP players will also eventually move on to the next thing. It'll take longer, and I'm not sure why taking longer is supposed to be a positive.

How about this simple reason: they keep promoting the game. Some just by talking in their friends and family into the game, some, like pvp oriented content creators, their audience made of tens or hundreds of thousands people. It's like an (almost) free huge channel of advertising for the creators. It baffles me seeing you arguing so stubbornly and failing to realize a simple fact. Unless of course you are a half successful troll.

[Misfit]

You have the people who suck at PvP. Then blame Elden Ring bc they suck

[GoreTiger]

Originally posted by Elazul:

They should. People that are into PvP are their core audience that keeps playing the game after beating the PvE portion.

Yeah this is probably not true. If you have statistics to back it up, by all means show it, But I doubt pvpers are the "core" of the game considering the pvp is so terrible. The core of the game are people who enjoy replaying the campaign to try out different builds and such.

Originally posted by Damiania626:

You have the people who suck at PvP. Then blame Elden Ring bc they suck

Elden Ring pvp is bad. If something is bad then it's bad. Why play this game's bad pvp when I can just go play for honor and get a better pvp experience?

Originally posted by mpcgannon:

I can't see anyone getting salty...

I don't think this update is really any surpise, Everyone was guessing that some form of pvp collosium update would come.
It does suck tho that after almost a year, The only major update we're getting is just basically letting people fight inside a closed off area. Something like this would of been better included WITH an expansion then stand alone.

[cheep crybabby hatter]

Originally posted by BoxerDanc:

Originally posted by cheep crybabby hatter:

Sure they'll stick around... not paying a cent more for continuously draining resources. Why should FromSoft want them sticking around, at least, moreso than PVE players? What makes them more worthy of catering to?

An analogy: you're running a cafe. Person A and person B order a coffee each morning. Person A orders hers to go, pays for it, then gets out as quickly as possible. On the other hand, Person B always sits, plugs in his laptop, and begins draining your power, using your wifi, and occupying a table all morning. Both people paid the same price for a single coffee, but person B is more of a fixture in your cafe. Who do you value more?

I guess I just don't see the inherent value of PVP. Like PVE players, PVP players will also eventually move on to the next thing. It'll take longer, and I'm not sure why taking longer is supposed to be a positive.

How about this simple reason: they keep promoting the game. Some just by talking in their friends and family into the game, some, like pvp oriented content creators, their audience made of tens or hundreds of thousands people. It's like an (almost) free huge channel of advertising for the creators.

Why can't PVE players talk their friends and family into the game? Why can't PVE players stream, to audiences of tens or hundreds of thousands of people? Exactly how long do you think most streamers stream a game anyway? The answer: one, maybe two play-throughs, roughly the same amount of time as an average PVE player.

Originally posted by BoxerDanc:

It baffles me seeing you arguing so stubbornly and failing to realize a simple fact. Unless of course you are a half successful troll.

"Everybody knows" and "I think you're a troll" are not reasons why anything is true. Even person B probably justifies his presence in the cafe by rationalising that he is making it seem successful and thus driving up business (and maybe it's true, to some small extent). But that doesn't make him more valuable as a customer than person A.

[Sabaithal]

Aaaaand here comes the flamewar

[Daviodraan]

I think some people just don't get it.
PvP needs constant balancing to be healthy, because it's a human on human interaction, and both sides should be enjoying it to some degree.

PvE on the other hand, is full of very easily accessible cheese strats that the community always share, and is balanced around ''learning through trial and error'' instead of ''grinding individual, very tight, mechanics, not completely intended for 90% of the playerbase, for days or weeks'', and you can choose to not interact with any other player, and go offline, so nobody makes anybody's experience worst. If you like the game or not, is 100% up to you, and that's perfect.
PvE is a whole experience since launch, and is entirely enjoyable and winnable.

PvP on the other hand, usually begins as an unfair mess of random encounters where the most outnumber-ing and/or cheesy team just obliterates the default losing side, with little to no counterplay, usually involving exploits (literally cheating through programming errors and griefing), or brain dead current-patch-god-tier-one-shot builds, and the current still standing issue of poorly downscaled max lvl summons that literally make trading close to pointless.

With looooads of feedback, time, and patience, the PvP community and From Soft begins fixing this, one step at the time.
It's never perfect, but always better.

Being here since Ds1, I really do not recall any souls patch being objectively worse than the last. Sure, sometimes you have to work around and change your build, but it's almost always for the better.

On kind of a different topic, most of the time, PvP patches can or will improve pve indirectly, cause you know, not everything (not even most of it) is a nerf.
Buffing previously unusable stuff or literally not-working aspects of certain weapons and spells/incantations, usually come from the feedback of the fandom of said playstyle or weapon

I think we can universally agree more variety, while not ignoring quality, is always a good thing.

[Dr. Rockso]

Imagine being concerned with salt in a souls game lmao

[mpcgannon]

Originally posted by hemorrhage911:

Originally posted by mpcgannon:

So, these colosseums aren't new. Ever since launch players have speculated when they would be opened. I feel like this was an intended feature from the start, it got put on the back burner for launch, and now that's it's done it's "free" like they're giving us some sort of gift.

Datamine has shown a lot of things they intended the game to have. Covenants were another and it's really stupid they abandoned that when Elden Ring seems like it would benefit greatly and is built for such a thing.

I'll second that.

[mpcgannon]

Originally posted by Sabaithal:

Arguably while PvP weapon balance separation and innate wex dust are a welcome addition, they should have been in the game to begin with. Instead they were added after the fact, way after the fact. Same with the arena DLC, it should have already been present to begin with. And both the innate connection issues, and random disconnects are still a thing.

So I'm still going with the "they don't care about PvP/coop" stance.

I'm gonna continue the "Michael Zaki hates PCs and they're players" narrative.

[mpcgannon]

Originally posted by Koala 4peace:

Originally posted by Narm:

I think the point is more that the dedicated PvP'ers that keep playing will keep talking about it, which will lead to additional sales in the future. Rather than completely fizzling out and being forgotten. Keeping that dedicated group playing is basically free marketing.

Not sure this future free "marketing" justifies even the cost of the matchmaking server maintenance, and Elden Ring has proven that Elden Ring is the marketing. This game will keep selling for a looooong time, PvP or not.

I think George R R Marketin did and does a great deal more than the Golden Order and their "ring".