Black flame blade

[SirSmokeALot "Raptor" [505th]]

So i found this cool spell, even skilled faith for it and farmed runes to level up enough and buy it (i was meele skilled with str and dex but cos of that spell i decided to put something into faith aswell) but it only lastts 5 seconds like wtf? all the other weapon buff spells hold much longer according to the internet and friends. I mean 5 seconds is like 2 swings and then its gone again.

[Oku]

Black Flame spells apply a dot that increases in duration and intensity based on your Faith. The exact formula is still being determined. They are very much late game scaling spells, and in the later levels, Black Flame Blade getting quick cast on your primary as you move in for an attack window on a boss can give you about the same amount of damage as a fully stacked bleed build would.

The 5 seconds is all you really need, if you need more than that, then you’re bad at timing the spell, and if your damage is so pitiful that it can’t kill things, then you need to invest more levels in to faith an upgrade your catalyst.

[Passier Reis]

Just use a different weapon buff like lightning
Too much time,FP and effort wasted actually hitting the bosses

[Ashtrails]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SirSmokeALotGER:

i have the bllod flame blade now and it does fire dmg+ bleed stack and it last 1 minute, so tell me how this is balanced compared to black flame

I was just stumped that you would basically argue 10 seconds and 5 seconds are identical in terms of opportunities, because it 'doesn't feel like 10'

I'm also not an advocate for black flame, I don't use it myself, because I play great curved sword and it doesn't synergize well with that (for me at least)
The only assumption I can make is that the idea is using fast weapons, windows of opportunity like a stagger (wailing away sometimes rewards more damage than taking the crit), and apply it very fast when you get the chance, since the damage bonus VS bosses is not insignificant, compared to the, what, 10% increase on other buffs depending on resistances?

Don't think it's meant to compare directly against the other weapons buffs, since its mechanic is very different.

I'm totally with you that it's comparatively weak, but not because of it's duration, is all I'm saying.

[Oku]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SirSmokeALotGER:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Ashtrails:

'because it doesn't feel like 10 seconds'
dude, what : D?

i have the bllod flame blade now and it does fire dmg+ bleed stack and it last 1 minute, so tell me how this is balanced compared to black flame

Bloodflame blade only gives .4x incant scaling as bonus fire damage and the the burn only applies bleed build up, it doesn’t do extra damage on top of the initial, and is really only good for a build that already is focused heavily on bleed status proc, as there is no way to increase the bleed application, it’s a fixed value.

Black Flame Blade on the other hand has the same cast time as grease, which lets you apply it in the middle of a combo as opposed to at the beginning of a fight and having to bail to re-apply it if it runs out, this alone gives it a ton of utility. It also has a .65x incant scaling bonus to fire damage, making it a higher base DPS enchant than bloodflame by an additional 15%, and it also applies an actual DOT after the fact that scales with faith, meaning that the more faith you put in to it, the more damage it’s going to deal.

Both are incredibly good spells, but Bloodflame’s usefulness is restricted mostly to bleed based faith/arcane builds, whereas black flame can be used as utility on any faith build and scales very well in to higher levels.

Black flame spells in general are considered some of the more broken ones due to the scaling dot they provide.

[Elazul]

It works well on a weapon like Uchigatana. Buff the sword then use unsheathe. It does a crap load of damage. That said you do have to pick your moments and if you misjudge you are basically wasting Magic.

[SirSmokeALot "Raptor" [505th]]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Keth:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SirSmokeALotGER:

i have the bllod flame blade now and it does fire dmg+ bleed stack and it last 1 minute, so tell me how this is balanced compared to black flame

Bloodflame blade only gives .4x incant scaling as bonus fire damage and the the burn only applies bleed build up, it doesn’t do extra damage on top of the initial, and is really only good for a build that already is focused heavily on bleed status proc, as there is no way to increase the bleed application, it’s a fixed value.

Black Flame Blade on the other hand has the same cast time as grease, which lets you apply it in the middle of a combo as opposed to at the beginning of a fight and having to bail to re-apply it if it runs out, this alone gives it a ton of utility. It also has a .65x incant scaling bonus to fire damage, making it a higher base DPS enchant than bloodflame by an additional 15%, and it also applies an actual DOT after the fact that scales with faith, meaning that the more faith you put in to it, the more damage it’s going to deal.

Both are incredibly good spells, but Bloodflame’s usefulness is restricted mostly to bleed based faith/arcane builds, whereas black flame can be used as utility on any faith build and scales very well in to higher levels.

Black flame spells in general are considered some of the more broken ones due to the scaling dot they provide.

i have never heared people tlak about black flame being good, 10 seconds is nothing in a boss fight u wont be able to hit certain bosses overall bc they move way to fast and hit way to fast, also if anything its only good with daggers that hit fast but on every other wep its useless

[Oku]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SirSmokeALotGER:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Keth:

Bloodflame blade only gives .4x incant scaling as bonus fire damage and the the burn only applies bleed build up, it doesn’t do extra damage on top of the initial, and is really only good for a build that already is focused heavily on bleed status proc, as there is no way to increase the bleed application, it’s a fixed value.

Black Flame Blade on the other hand has the same cast time as grease, which lets you apply it in the middle of a combo as opposed to at the beginning of a fight and having to bail to re-apply it if it runs out, this alone gives it a ton of utility. It also has a .65x incant scaling bonus to fire damage, making it a higher base DPS enchant than bloodflame by an additional 15%, and it also applies an actual DOT after the fact that scales with faith, meaning that the more faith you put in to it, the more damage it’s going to deal.

Both are incredibly good spells, but Bloodflame’s usefulness is restricted mostly to bleed based faith/arcane builds, whereas black flame can be used as utility on any faith build and scales very well in to higher levels.

Black flame spells in general are considered some of the more broken ones due to the scaling dot they provide.

i have never heared people tlak about black flame being good, 10 seconds is nothing in a boss fight u wont be able to hit certain bosses overall bc they move way to fast and hit way to fast, also if anything its only good with daggers that hit fast but on every other wep its useless

It doesnt matter what you heared people tlak about. What matters is reality. You're barely 18 hours in to the game and have only just downed Godrick, you don't have enough points in Faith to buff black flame's dot to the point where it's absurd.

On top of that, I highly doubt you're actually using it on bosses and are instead just using it on trash mobs, because the dot for every black flame spell is based loosely on the enemy's max HP on top of that percentage scaling harder with your faith stat.

You don't cast BFB at the start of the fight, you cast it as you approach for an attack window, and 10 seconds is more than enough for most bosses.

In the early game, yes, Black Flame Blade isn't as good as Bloodflame Blade.
In the late game however? Black Flame Blade scales much harder.

[SirSmokeALot "Raptor" [505th]]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Keth:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SirSmokeALotGER:

i have never heared people tlak about black flame being good, 10 seconds is nothing in a boss fight u wont be able to hit certain bosses overall bc they move way to fast and hit way to fast, also if anything its only good with daggers that hit fast but on every other wep its useless

It doesnt matter what you heared people tlak about. What matters is reality. You're barely 18 hours in to the game and have only just downed Godrick, you don't have enough points in Faith to buff black flame's dot to the point where it's absurd.

On top of that, I highly doubt you're actually using it on bosses and are instead just using it on trash mobs, because the dot for every black flame spell is based loosely on the enemy's max HP on top of that percentage scaling harder with your faith stat.

You don't cast BFB at the start of the fight, you cast it as you approach for an attack window, and 10 seconds is more than enough for most bosses.

In the early game, yes, Black Flame Blade isn't as good as Bloodflame Blade.
In the late game however? Black Flame Blade scales much harder.

cool how u just make assumptions, no im not wasting my FP to kill mobs with black fire. i one or 2 hit most mobs anyways with my sword, i treid using it on bosses but its impossible for most of them, sure the dead giants who carry the chariot might be slow enough to hit them, but all other bosses move way too fast and dont leave enough time for a window, in the time i cast it and try to swing i already got my face smashed in by the boss. also bloodflame goes super well if u have already bleed on your wep, jsut a couple hits and boom massive dmg from bleed+ it adds like 50 fire dmg to my blade aswell and it lasts a whole minute giving u enough time to get some hits without having to panick/rush bc most bosses punish u severly for being to greedy with the hits

[Oku]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SirSmokeALotGER:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Keth:

It doesnt matter what you heared people tlak about. What matters is reality. You're barely 18 hours in to the game and have only just downed Godrick, you don't have enough points in Faith to buff black flame's dot to the point where it's absurd.

On top of that, I highly doubt you're actually using it on bosses and are instead just using it on trash mobs, because the dot for every black flame spell is based loosely on the enemy's max HP on top of that percentage scaling harder with your faith stat.

You don't cast BFB at the start of the fight, you cast it as you approach for an attack window, and 10 seconds is more than enough for most bosses.

In the early game, yes, Black Flame Blade isn't as good as Bloodflame Blade.
In the late game however? Black Flame Blade scales much harder.

cool how u just make assumptions, no im not wasting my FP to kill mobs with black fire. i one or 2 hit most mobs anyways with my sword, i treid using it on bosses but its impossible for most of them, sure the dead giants who carry the chariot might be slow enough to hit them, but all other bosses move way too fast and dont leave enough time for a window, in the time i cast it and try to swing i already got my face smashed in by the boss. also bloodflame goes super well if u have already bleed on your wep, jsut a couple hits and boom massive dmg from bleed+ it adds like 50 fire dmg to my blade aswell and it lasts a whole minute giving u enough time to get some hits without having to panick/rush bc most bosses punish u severly for being to greedy with the hits

Will you goofballs just stop arguing with people who have played more, experimented more, and know more about the game than you do and take the opportunity to actually learn something so you're more knowledgeable instead of just getting angry when people that know better than you tell you you're wrong about something?

Like I said, at your stage of the game, yes, Bloodflame Blade is the better option because you do not have the levels invested in to Faith to make Black Flame spells the nuclear bombs they become later on in the game. Bleed builds are hybrid focused, you want to invest in Arcane and Faith primarily unless you're avoiding casts in which case Dex/Arcane is the go-to. Black Flame spells benefit more from being on a dedicated Faith build, as their DoT deals significantly more damage the higher faith you have. At later levels, the dot from black flame can outscale blood proc, and is a safer router altogether because you don't have to worry about trying to make it proc before the window hits, one swing is all it takes and you get to watch a boss' hp bar melt.

Just accept the fact that Bloodflame is better for your build instead of trying to argue that something else that's better on a build you aren't running is universally useless, especially when you do not have the experience in the game to even begin to start saying what is and isn't good lol

[SirSmokeALot "Raptor" [505th]]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Keth:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SirSmokeALotGER:

cool how u just make assumptions, no im not wasting my FP to kill mobs with black fire. i one or 2 hit most mobs anyways with my sword, i treid using it on bosses but its impossible for most of them, sure the dead giants who carry the chariot might be slow enough to hit them, but all other bosses move way too fast and dont leave enough time for a window, in the time i cast it and try to swing i already got my face smashed in by the boss. also bloodflame goes super well if u have already bleed on your wep, jsut a couple hits and boom massive dmg from bleed+ it adds like 50 fire dmg to my blade aswell and it lasts a whole minute giving u enough time to get some hits without having to panick/rush bc most bosses punish u severly for being to greedy with the hits

Will you goofballs just stop arguing with people who have played more, experimented more, and know more about the game than you do and take the opportunity to actually learn something so you're more knowledgeable instead of just getting angry when people that know better than you tell you you're wrong about something?

Like I said, at your stage of the game, yes, Bloodflame Blade is the better option because you do not have the levels invested in to Faith to make Black Flame spells the nuclear bombs they become later on in the game. Bleed builds are hybrid focused, you want to invest in Arcane and Faith primarily unless you're avoiding casts in which case Dex/Arcane is the go-to. Black Flame spells benefit more from being on a dedicated Faith build, as their DoT deals significantly more damage the higher faith you have. At later levels, the dot from black flame can outscale blood proc, and is a safer router altogether because you don't have to worry about trying to make it proc before the window hits, one swing is all it takes and you get to watch a boss' hp bar melt.

Just accept the fact that Bloodflame is better for your build instead of trying to argue that something else that's better on a build you aren't running is universally useless, especially when you do not have the experience in the game to even begin to start saying what is and isn't good lol

no one forces u to reply to me, and nowhere i was angry, its funny how fast u jump to conclusions, jsut like when u said i use black flame for mobs, now im angry too? did i insult u? did i say any bad words? no. i was jsut sharing my opinion and how i felt, which i can do as much as i want to.

[SirSmokeALot "Raptor" [505th]]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Keth:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SirSmokeALotGER:

cool how u just make assumptions, no im not wasting my FP to kill mobs with black fire. i one or 2 hit most mobs anyways with my sword, i treid using it on bosses but its impossible for most of them, sure the dead giants who carry the chariot might be slow enough to hit them, but all other bosses move way too fast and dont leave enough time for a window, in the time i cast it and try to swing i already got my face smashed in by the boss. also bloodflame goes super well if u have already bleed on your wep, jsut a couple hits and boom massive dmg from bleed+ it adds like 50 fire dmg to my blade aswell and it lasts a whole minute giving u enough time to get some hits without having to panick/rush bc most bosses punish u severly for being to greedy with the hits

Will you goofballs just stop arguing with people who have played more, experimented more, and know more about the game than you do and take the opportunity to actually learn something so you're more knowledgeable instead of just getting angry when people that know better than you tell you you're wrong about something?

Like I said, at your stage of the game, yes, Bloodflame Blade is the better option because you do not have the levels invested in to Faith to make Black Flame spells the nuclear bombs they become later on in the game. Bleed builds are hybrid focused, you want to invest in Arcane and Faith primarily unless you're avoiding casts in which case Dex/Arcane is the go-to. Black Flame spells benefit more from being on a dedicated Faith build, as their DoT deals significantly more damage the higher faith you have. At later levels, the dot from black flame can outscale blood proc, and is a safer router altogether because you don't have to worry about trying to make it proc before the window hits, one swing is all it takes and you get to watch a boss' hp bar melt.

Just accept the fact that Bloodflame is better for your build instead of trying to argue that something else that's better on a build you aren't running is universally useless, especially when you do not have the experience in the game to even begin to start saying what is and isn't good lol

differnt topic since u claim to be an expert, what seal is good to use when i have bloodflame blade and fire grant me str( u know that buff thing)

[Jucrispy]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Oku:

Black Flame spells apply a dot that increases in duration and intensity based on your Faith. The exact formula is still being determined. They are very much late game scaling spells, and in the later levels, Black Flame Blade getting quick cast on your primary as you move in for an attack window on a boss can give you about the same amount of damage as a fully stacked bleed build would.

The 5 seconds is all you really need, if you need more than that, then you’re bad at timing the spell, and if your damage is so pitiful that it can’t kill things, then you need to invest more levels in to faith an upgrade your catalyst.

why u sound like nerd emoji

[Lord Bob]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Jucrispy:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Oku:

Black Flame spells apply a dot that increases in duration and intensity based on your Faith. The exact formula is still being determined. They are very much late game scaling spells, and in the later levels, Black Flame Blade getting quick cast on your primary as you move in for an attack window on a boss can give you about the same amount of damage as a fully stacked bleed build would.

The 5 seconds is all you really need, if you need more than that, then you’re bad at timing the spell, and if your damage is so pitiful that it can’t kill things, then you need to invest more levels in to faith an upgrade your catalyst.

why u sound like nerd emoji

Why you necro threads?