Thoughts on all of the weapons

[dacarpen]

I've reached the point I'm consistently beating the end bosses and have used each weapon enough to have a good feel for them.

The Staff: At feels awful at base. testing it on skelly, it takes several times longer to kill him than with sisters or axe. I've gotten its special to be really good with the right hammers and boons, as a rapid fire low damage effect can be a good basis for expansion, though I found it a bit less intuitive to understand how to pull that off compared to hades I.
Another effective strategy I've found with ti is using its omega speedup to enable a cast build. If you combine a strong Poseidon cast with fast omega casts, a boon to make your cast ranged, and stack everything else you can on it, it can be a very effective strategy independent of base weapon, but this weapon is one of the few that can synergize with it.
The attack feels underwhelming though. it doesn't have the range advantage of the special, and the dps sucks compared to the other melee weapons.

Sisters: Really solid weapon. They are fast, they can dish out pain, they can be nimble. The backstabbing stuff gives it some reward for higher level play. The special feels like a viable option as well.

Axe: I love its attack, hate its special. The high base damage makes it a good basis for a different set of boons than the fast attacking weapons, and I typically feel the slow attacks have a good payoff for when they land. Being able to dash mid combo really helps it and makes skillfull play feel more satisfying.
My only issue is the special feels awful. As a defense, I find it very unreliable, and liable to spontaneously end earlier than you need, leaving you vulnerable. There are just very few times standing and blocking with it feels like the right option.

Umbral Flames: I hate this weapon. My best runs with it have come from ignoring it and using casts instead. The base attack feels awful to use, its not really a rapid attack like the staff special, but the base damage is really low. I feel like you have to use its omega attack to be worth anything, but it takes a really long time for that to kick in, and to make matters worse attacking with it blocks lots of sources of mana gen.
Its just a lot of commitment to make a slow, low damage attack.
special spamming can fill the arena with fire, which is okay for crowd control, but still feels bad against bosses.

Skulls: Better than the flames, worse than the melee weapons. Its mainly just clunky to use. Its good at burst damage, but its hard to translate that into consistent damage. It does have a payoff, unlike the flames. I think the main thing that I dislike is how long it takes the skulls to drop, and how vulnerable the dash is. its similar to bull rushing with the shield, but far more risky. This is often fine, but some enemies have attack patterns that don't give you many openings to dash safely, but your skulls are also sitting on them so you are stuck until there is an opening to retrieve them.
All in all, it feels challenging to use, and the payoff doesn't feel proportional, compared to how simple some of the other weapons can be to get much more consistent damage output.

[-=MM=-Savage]

For the skulls, the aspect of Medea is your friend. Load up 3 skulls and then special into someone's face to make all 3 go off at once, for a very strong combo build. Pick the first half of a combo as your flourish boon (like Hera) and the second half as your strike boon (like Heph) and your weapon combo will set off your boon combo too (In this example, hitching everyone on your dash and then anvil smashing them for the shared/echoed damage)

Double Aphrodite works super brokenly with the base strike version of that combo too, since the hits can all be close unless you charge all the way to omega.

[-=MM=-Savage]

God I agree the torches are trash though.

I kinda want them to get a cast based aspect ... so I can ignore their actual weapon attacks, since I dont think there is a way to make a good version of them without gutting them.

[Neo NiGHTS ®]

My opinions:

Staff: its mechanics are basic, easy to understand, you have a melee and ranged attacks. It gives a good base of how to play the game.
However (and I agree with you) it's just too weak.
I mean, 10 (TEN!) base damage for the Y?
It should be at least 30.

The base attack could be upped at least 50%.

Perhaps that could make the first few runs a bit too easy when starting the game, but so what?

The Axe: the issue with the Y blocking ability is that it doesn't tell you WHAT you CAN and what you CAN'T block.
Aegis Shield could block literally anything.
With the Axe it isn't so clear, nor it's area of effectiveness.
That should be adjusted.

The Flames: I really like the flames hahahaha
But maybe I'm the only one 😅
The biggest problem is that it takes too long for the X special to charge up and then 5 mana each shot is just too much.
Spamming the Y works well against room filled with enemies, kinda poor man's shield.
It also needs some nice damage boost.
(there's an aspect where your shots keep on the screen until you dash, then they come back to you and damage enemies in the way. It's somewhat like retrieving the spear in the original Hades. That's the best aspect)


The Skulls: again stronger opponents (like bosses), what I usually do is spam all the skulls then immediately use the charged Y dash to damage some more and get the skulls back.
The downside is that it consumes quite a lot of mana, so you should either have a large pool or some boom that helps you replenish it quickly.
(also the upgraded aspect of Melinoe is surprisingly useful, making each skull more powerful)


All in all, the biggest problem with the weapons, all of them, is:
If you have a strong B cast build, the weapon you are using is virtually irrelevant....

The weapons are kinda secondary thing in this game. Literally anything goaa as long as your cast do the job.
And that's not how it should be.

[dacarpen]

Originally posted by -=MM=-Savage:

For the skulls, the aspect of Medea is your friend. Load up 3 skulls and then special into someone's face to make all 3 go off at once, for a very strong combo build. Pick the first half of a combo as your flourish boon (like Hera) and the second half as your strike boon (like Heph) and your weapon combo will set off your boon combo too (In this example, hitching everyone on your dash and then anvil smashing them for the shared/echoed damage)

Double Aphrodite works super brokenly with the base strike version of that combo too, since the hits can all be close unless you charge all the way to omega.

I wasn't talking about the other aspects since they change it up a lot, and I haven't explored all of them thoroughly yet. Medea is interesting, and there is definitely potential with it, but I still found re-gathering the skulls to be annoying.

[Demon Swords]

For Umbral Flame Spect of Eos: I like useing the on-hit boons (Chain-lighting, splash, etc) and its attack is the best range attack / special for spamming (most range, faster then dagger, lets you move, goes through enemies, Eos Aspect lets it go through walls). Special is garbage (probably the worst attack / special).

I've used it to beat 24 fear (soon will try for 32 fear)

Here's a long post I Made talking about the details of the goodness of Torch's attacks in general discussion (especially aspect of Eos. not gonna repost something that long here.)

Here's the name: "Umbral Flame's aspect of Eos is actually good (also a guide on it)".

(should be easy to find if you paste some of it into the search bar.)

[Mr. Midnight]

I find the block and special of the axe hard to use. As others have said it doesn't block everything and often when I use the special's power up power and it completes I dash away only to have it shoot in the completely wrong direction.

[The Sojourner]

I'll add in my thoughts to the mix. These are about the weapons as-is (no boons or Arcana cards):

Descura: alright weapon, no matter the aspect.

Lim and Oros: fun weapon to use (I almost thought it'd be the default one, given the cover/banner art of the game!). Omega attack is weak though, as is the Special (including the Omega Special) — the final attack in the combo does more damage than the Omega attack, which kinda feels wrong. I almost feel like I could do a casual speedrun with this weapon, particularly with the Aspect of Artemis.

Ygnium: takes some getting used to, which is not always a good thing. The problem is that it's hard to target enemies, and this is especially true with the Aspect of Moros, where the flames from your Attack go through foes — it'd be better if they stopped at a foe's location so that when the (Omega) Special is applied, it better attacks the foe you're targeting.

Zorephet: I love how heavy this weapon is to use! It hits so hard, which makes it satisfying. However animation locking is a bit of a problem, so I may get hit when in the middle of an animation when I should be impervious. It would also be nice if I were impervious when deploying my Omega Special — the Special has defense, and I don't like to lose that (I understand it's not the most plausible thing for the game, but in this case, I say screw such plausibility!).

Revaal: a fun little concept: explodey skulls. Pretty good no matter the aspect.

It'll be interesting to see what the last weapon will be....

Originally posted by Neo NiGHTS ®:

The Axe: the issue with the Y blocking ability is that it doesn't tell you WHAT you CAN and what you CAN'T block.
Aegis Shield could block literally anything.
With the Axe it isn't so clear, nor it's area of effectiveness.
That should be adjusted.

Having Unblockable stuff is kinda new to Hades 2, and I'm not sure I like it either.

[ArdentSlacker]

My perspective on the staff is that the basics are kind of crap but the omegas are solid (though aiming with the attack one can be a bit iffy on the controller). The charged special explodes for a base 80 aoe, for like... 10 mana? It feels good if you can burn the mana, and that probably requires dropping casts and moving to give it time to recharge.

And the Umbral Flames are... really easy to use? I don't get the hate. Spamming special floods the arena, and dropping a cast and moving slightly makes it very easy to keep the stream of specials slapping your enemies. Rather liked when I had the hammer making it only fire 1 omega blast for really good damage. Like, 800. Quite nice on larger targets... quite painful when you miss.

Skully... I found the special gives you some unique movement options between dashes... but charged, you're probably hitting the whole arena. Charged attack goes over obstacles... handy with the energetic ranged foes. Charged special, before it goes omega, it lengthens. Really nice if you're needing to scoot away from things. It's overall... usable, but like the staff, I'm not loving it.

I like using the axe, but, yeah, the blocking is just... :(

No notes on the knives, there's a good reason they're on the menu screen.

[Neo NiGHTS ®]

The more I play the more I realize that *ALL* weapons need a major buff. Or that the booms need to give them bigger bonuses.

I hate to compare to Hades 1 because this one clearly wants you to play in a less frantic way, rely more on magic since Melinoe is a witch etc., but I can't avoid it:

Even weapons that start off very strong, like the Axe (in raw damage) they don't scale very well throughout the game. The enemies get much more armor and HP and even the axe will have a hard time dealing with hordes of enemies, especially on Tartarus.

In Hades your Booms would improve your attacks or specials. In Hades 2 your booms pool is diluted between attack, special, omega attack, omega special and casting.

With Zagreus you would end a run feeling like a god yourself.
With Melinoe is more "I'm doing good enough to survive".

[Melvatron]

Originally posted by Neo NiGHTS ®:

My opinions:

The weapons are kinda secondary thing in this game. Literally anything goaa as long as your cast do the job.
And that's not how it should be.

Agreed. A good cast boon will completely trump nearly all weapon choice builds.
Have only come across 1 Sister blades build out of all the weapons/aspects where I used the weapon more than the cast ability for bulk damage.

[Neo NiGHTS ®]

Originally posted by Melvatron:

Originally posted by Neo NiGHTS ®:

My opinions:

The weapons are kinda secondary thing in this game. Literally anything goaa as long as your cast do the job.
And that's not how it should be.

Agreed. A good cast boon will completely trump nearly all weapon choice builds.
Have only come across 1 Sister blades build out of all the weapons/aspects where I used the weapon more than the cast ability for bulk damage.

Have you ever got the Dual Boon between Apollo and ZEUS? A cast boom, of course.

That thing is INSANE!

[Kazooer Than You]

Spamming Omega attack with Skulls can kind of sort of work well with something like an Apollo or Demeter attack, although it probably won't work on Chronos since you don't get the slowdown. It's kinda like a worse version of the Dio cast or the Rail special from Hades 1 though. Spamming Omega attack with Staff is okay too. I agree with what people are saying about Cast trumping all this stuff though, spamming Omega attack with Blades and the hammer that makes it do +400% damage is the only way I have found to get better damage using literally anything else.

[Joeboon]

Staff is kinda balanced around the fact the there are hammers that literally double your attacks and specials, making it feel super broken

[♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥]

Torches are indeed very lacklustre, when i use it i use special only never use the main attack.

[MaJong]

Originally posted by Joeboon:

Staff is kinda balanced around the fact the there are hammers that literally double your attacks and specials, making it feel super broken

Finally someone said it. Deskura is not just mid weapon. Get double attacks and scorch - it melts the enemies. Get double special and Poseidon blast - shreds everything that is moving. It is weaker than Sister Blades in terms of damage, but it provides good range with both standard attack and special. Omega attack is also pretty good for keeping enemies far and stripping armor from them up to Fields. And it can be pretty violent with heal on Omega attack if you build around it. Saves a lot of health up to Chronos and then you spam him with that Omega right to the death.
Sister Blades - probably the best, but requires some skill to survive through armored enemies.
Ygnium - pretty slow attack with little damage and range. But haven't tried other aspects. Special is much better but you need to be careful since it doesn't stan your enemies. With hitch special becomes the ultimate weapon of mass destruction.
Zorephet - big slow boom, worst special of all. Special needs to be reworked into Artemis blade omega attack to be normal.
Revaal - so so. Melinoe and Persephone aspect feel too dangerous with slow attack that deals not so big damage and necessity to pick skulls back. Medea makes it good but still risky.
Overall I prefer Deskura and Sister Blades.