The Changeling makes N'kari feel weak

[Justice]

Played a Changeling Campaign where I got N'kari as my first RNG form and it was a blast, might be one of his best possible forms. I was able to steamroll all the starting enemies using mostly just N'kari and the Changeling can get him even more physical resistance and stalk. Slaanesh is my favorite race in this game and despite the Changeling perhaps not being as strong as the real N'kari at high levels, I actually felt much more powerful using N'kari as the Changeling.

Having access to stalk for N'kari and the army, I was able to use the exact same strategy I would as Slaanesh with Tzeentch's fastest units and having stalk made them perform their role infinitely better. They get where they need to be easier and with less damage taken. Seeing what N'kari and a similiar army in a completely different faction can accomplish with stalk, I find myself wishing his faction had some units with that ability. Maybe the Changeling is just that OP but it still feels bad when he can actually be a better N'kari and do Slaanesh tactics better than Slaanesh can.

[MASTAXPLODER]

nkari can paint the map easier tho.

[Justice]

Originally posted by MASTAXPLODER:

nkari can paint the map easier tho.

With buildings that automatically conquer adjacent regions for you as Changeling, I'm not actually sure that's the case.

[OpalGotMyHeart]

ok, but lets be real, almost any lord can feel more powerful when the changeling gets his hands on them, like thats kind of the point, he literally gets to be a yoked up version of whoever he turns into. Also, slanessh as a faction doesnt use stealth, so yeah nkari doesnt either.

[IonizedMercury]

The currently most busted and overpowered scrub faction makes others look weak by comparison? Not much of a revelation.

[BiteSizeCenter]

It's basically impossible to lose as the Changeling, of course he's going to make other factions that have to deal with some semblance of a challenge feel weak.

[zefyris]

on the battlefield maybe, but nothing come close of how busted N'Kari is on the campaign map.

[BiteSizeCenter]

Originally posted by zefyris:

on the battlefield maybe, but nothing come close of how busted N'Kari is on the campaign map.

Skarbrand would like a word with you

[zefyris]

Originally posted by BiteSizeCenter:

Originally posted by zefyris:

on the battlefield maybe, but nothing come close of how busted N'Kari is on the campaign map.

Skarbrand would like a word with you

Skarbrand was nerfed. He used to be way stronger at launch than he now is. He probably isn't even in the top 10 of the strongest factions anymore, while N'Kari would rank first, and has been ranking first since the launch of wh3.

[Carog the Fat]

The changling is also the most boring to play, having just finished him. There is literally zero challenge in his game play and I will never bother replaying that.

[Garatgh Deloi]

Originally posted by zefyris:

Skarbrand was nerfed. He used to be way stronger at launch than he now is. He probably isn't even in the top 10 of the strongest factions anymore, while N'Kari would rank first, and has been ranking first since the launch of wh3.

Here is a youtube video demonstrating how broken Skarbrand's faction mechanics can be if you know how to make the best use of them (the play through in the video being a extreme case, but it still gives you a general idea): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuRLVpfraL0 (Spoiler, he achieves both the long victory and ultimate victory in 8 turns razing a decent chunk of the Immortal Empires map, including settlements on different continents. Its OG Taurox the brass bull, as he was at release, all over again).

[Hex]

This is such a pointless argument when the game is easy with every faction once you get going.

The AI is *designed* to lose. It doesn't matter what the "strongest" faction is, what's important is having fun. People who say the AI is passive should play Couronne, my goodness I've been holding on for dear life since turn 5 to like turn 50. Every Bretonnian faction gets rolled over by turn 10. By the time I secured Bretonnia and dealt with Ikit, the Empire was down to Reikland and Kislev had Jakova left. Been fighting Vlad for the last 40 turns, he had 12 stacks that I saw on map when I pushed out, been a bit iffy going. I also managed to save Kislev and gave them their main settlements back and been farming 6 different Chaos/Norsca and Thrott since then. Good times. At turn 112, finally getting the upper hand. Louen has been lvl50 for like the last 30 turns, that's how much fighting I've done.

[zefyris]

Originally posted by Garatgh Deloi:

Originally posted by zefyris:

Skarbrand was nerfed. He used to be way stronger at launch than he now is. He probably isn't even in the top 10 of the strongest factions anymore, while N'Kari would rank first, and has been ranking first since the launch of wh3.

Here is a youtube video demonstrating how broken Skarbrand's faction mechanics can be if you know how to make the best use of them (the play through in the video being a extreme case, but it still gives you a general idea): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuRLVpfraL0 (Spoiler, he achieves both the long victory and ultimate victory in 8 turns razing a decent chunk of the Immortal Empires map, including settlements on different continents. Its OG Taurox the brass bull, as he was at release, all over again).

Did we watch the same video ? It's just using the supplementary movement after battle from skarbrand and basically has it all.

- using backspace to avoid moving away as he should
- cheasing the AI during battles
- pixel perfect positioning to reach the correct distance and try and error to get that
- extremely lucky dumb ai behaviour stopping just where the player wanted it
- the above them rolling into a lucky retreat of an army ending exactly just pixel perfect in the correct direction to end in reinforcement range of the big local garrison to draw it out of the settlement
-50% chance to fail ambushes that did not fail or it would have not been possible
-stupid move AGAIN from the local AI ending in march stance right in front of Skarbrand offering themselves as a boost and as a mean to reach the important level 13 that turn
-ogre camp just being luckily placed in the correct direction
-lucky enough to never end in low magic areas during his travels to get higher movement bonuses again
- and then incredible repeated luck on turn 8 for everything's position (including a random freaking cathay caravan) to move accross several continents without running out of movement.

That was a fun challenge from him, but should hardly be considered a reason to put Skarbrand higher. He literally ended the campaign before the enemy could become a menace by being lucky enough with everything' for the first 8 turns and going pixel perfect.

What this video proves is that Skarbrand is probably the best choice for the specific choice of "no exploit(but cheese and save scuming is okay) speedrun challenges; which isn't surprising considering his supplementary movement.
BTW it's only a speedrun in terms of turns and not time spent playing. Having to play so many battles to cheese them isn't especially fast.

[BiteSizeCenter]

Even if you're not playing hyper optimized like in that youtube video it's still more than possible to end a Skarbrand campaign in under 20 turns. I did it in 18 and I'm hardly a Total War god. No other faction is as efficient at devastating the map and projecting their power than Exiles of Khrone right now. N'Kari is definitely up there though.

[AurumHawke]

Originally posted by Tunguska:

He's often not individually as powerful in battle as the lord he mimics. You're not getting their skills lines, which give many lords massively increased melee performance or much cheaper spells, and they often have campaign mechanics tied to their faction that make them even stronger. He also can't have mounts. His own skill line that boosts stats while transformed doesn't make up for that, in many cases.

So Changeling doesn't get access to Whisper of Glory?
Stalk is irrelevant when the entire enemy army is Rampaging as N'kari prances through their lines.

[Many-Named]

Originally posted by Tunguska:

Originally posted by MASTAXPLODER:

nkari can paint the map easier tho.

This is true only because the Changeling can't paint the map.
If you count cults as "painting the map", then the Changeling can do it automatically, and it's obviously easier.

Originally posted by NikiGotUrSpine:

ok, but lets be real, almost any lord can feel more powerful when the changeling gets his hands on them, like thats kind of the point, he literally gets to be a yoked up version of whoever he turns into. Also, slanessh as a faction doesnt use stealth, so yeah nkari doesnt either.

Your logic doesn't really hold up.

He's often not individually as powerful in battle as the lord he mimics. You're not getting their skills lines, which give many lords massively increased melee performance or much cheaper spells, and they often have campaign mechanics tied to their faction that make them even stronger. He also can't have mounts. His own skill line that boosts stats while transformed doesn't make up for that, in many cases.

It's his insane "stalk for you entire army" ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ and your faction mechanics that make him OP in campaign, especially having no territory to defend, being absurdly difficult to kill off, and spreading cults automatically.

Are you talking about the 2%?