Making Wizards and Winds of magic interesting

[TK_421]

-Make dynamic winds of magic: in every battle you gain basic pool of WoM and the extra pool (as it is now) that once you start using from, it can only recover on campaign map and it's based on winds of magic capacity,
-the recovery depends on local region winds(+5/+7/+10/+15/+20), wizards skills(+2/4/6) and also on the percentage of current WoM to maximum(0-20% of max WoM you get +50% bonus, 20-40%- +25% bonus, 40- 60% no bonus, 60-80% -25% debuff, 80-100% -50% debuff),
-Lord-wizards grant basic 75 WoM capacity , legendary 100 and hero-mages 25(additional 25 if it's the first mage in the army or legendary hero),also after getting lvl 15 on any mage you get 3 lvls of skills increasing it (+2/+5/+10), now it is more viable to put multiple wizards in one army, remove basic WoM for each army,
-adding skills to wizards that increase enemy wizards miscast chance(in the row with additional WoM capacity) with range basic range 25m and +10% miscast chance then further increased range by skill(25m/50m//75m/100m), then further increased miscast by another skill by +5%/12%/20%,
-adding special really rare skill that allows to go over the capacity of WoM but decrease total WoM gain by 40% if above WoM capacity,
-another row that increases mage speed by +10% unlocked on lvl 20,then 1st skill: that decreases enemy WoM capacity in region by -2/-5/-8, 2nd skill: spell dmg amplifier: +3/8/15%,
-adding new modifier that increases spell duration percentage-wise and adding it in 3rd row +3/8/15%,
-adding modifier after both skill lines that reduces cooldowns on spells after casting(-20%) and -40% -1 WoM cost on overcasts, as most of the weaker overcasts need some buffs(fast dmg for WoM cost),
-demon armies now base their buffs/debuffs on percantage of max WoM and make it more interesting by adding upkeep reduction at high-end and melee defbuufs at low-end, every demonic army has additional +10 WoM capacity, so it works properly for Khorne.
The numbers are just the suggestion, but the concept of adding new wizard skills and WoM changes are necessity to make the game more interesting. Also it's kind of ridiculous that the mage recovers all of the WoM reserves after each battle and that one wizard can cast as many spells as many wizards in one army but can cast much more if they are in seperate armies. Image of suggested skill changes: https://ibb.co/NWTbwB5.

[TK_421]

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Originally posted by TK_421:

If you don't trust my estimations look up my eu4 mods, back in 2021 I made some really good changes that were eventually implemented into the game, but I didn't had to give them as suggestions as they were so essential that paradox devs actually draw the same conclusions. My suggestion sounds like it's something that can be added in a mod, but in reality it can't be fully implemented by mod.
I see an issue where one of the core and most overpowered mechanic is just watered-down to get your mage one good spell and then cast it every time it is not on cooldown. It's just makes the game boring and repetetive in longer games.

Doesn't make this idea a good one. You might have been right about eu4(I'll take you at your word I don't play it), doesn't make you always right about every game.

Yes, but i wanted to show you that I know what I'm saying with the changes. I play total war titles as much if not more than eu4 and I think therfore my estimations are credible.

[TK_421]

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Originally posted by TK_421:

I 100% agree with the red line. I' m trying to convince you that it's a good idea to make mages actually make a journey to be as good as they are or even stronger rather than making them from 0 to not hero but overpowered entity that kills entire armies.

I just don't agree with that assessment of the state of the game.

But do you agree with me that lvling up mages is boring? Like when you put all lvls in the spell you like to cast the other skills are just negligible.

[KeiranG19]

Originally posted by TK_421:

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Doesn't make this idea a good one. You might have been right about eu4(I'll take you at your word I don't play it), doesn't make you always right about every game.

Yes, but i wanted to show you that I know what I'm saying with the changes. I play total war titles as much if not more than eu4 and I think therfore my estimations are credible.

eu4 is irrelevant, bringing it up just makes you look silly.

I also play total war warhammer, the trilogy that actually matters, and I don't think your suggestions would improve the game.

[TK_421]

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Originally posted by TK_421:

Yes, but i wanted to show you that I know what I'm saying with the changes. I play total war titles as much if not more than eu4 and I think therfore my estimations are credible.

eu4 is irrelevant, bringing it up just makes you look silly.

I also play total war warhammer, the trilogy that actually matters, and I don't think your suggestions would improve the game.

Ok, let's agree to disagree.

[KeiranG19]

Originally posted by TK_421:

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

I just don't agree with that assessment of the state of the game.

But do you agree with me that lvling up mages is boring? Like when you put all lvls in the spell you like to cast the other skills are just negligible.

Not particularly, that's pretty much the same as every single character in the game, magic or no, you put points in the thing you want and not in the things you don't.

[TK_421]

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Originally posted by TK_421:

But do you agree with me that lvling up mages is boring? Like when you put all lvls in the spell you like to cast the other skills are just negligible.

Not particularly, that's pretty much the same as every single character in the game, magic or no, you put points in the thing you want and not in the things you don't.

But some mages even don't have 50 points to put them in not to mention that all of the non-mage characters gain their power as they lvl up, yeah some skills are better than others but mages just don't get better after you get the spell you actually want to cast and this makes them for me really boring and after i've put points into my favourite spell i never look back at the mage.

[KeiranG19]

Originally posted by TK_421:

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Not particularly, that's pretty much the same as every single character in the game, magic or no, you put points in the thing you want and not in the things you don't.

But some mages even don't have 50 points to put them in not to mention that all of the non-mage characters gain their power as they lvl up, yeah some skills are better than others but mages just don't get better after you get the spell you actually want to cast and this makes them for me really boring and after i've put points into my favourite spell i never look back at the mage.

That's not a problem specific to mages, plenty of non-mage heroes could do with more things to spend point on.

People complained about not enough points to unlock everything back in warhammer 2, so CA raised the level cap.

[TK_421]

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Originally posted by TK_421:

But some mages even don't have 50 points to put them in not to mention that all of the non-mage characters gain their power as they lvl up, yeah some skills are better than others but mages just don't get better after you get the spell you actually want to cast and this makes them for me really boring and after i've put points into my favourite spell i never look back at the mage.

That's not a problem specific to mages, plenty of non-mage heroes could do with more things to spend point on.

People complained about not enough points to unlock everything back in warhammer 2, so CA raised the level cap.

But that is a problem.

[KeiranG19]

Originally posted by TK_421:

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

That's not a problem specific to mages, plenty of non-mage heroes could do with more things to spend point on.

People complained about not enough points to unlock everything back in warhammer 2, so CA raised the level cap.

But that is a problem.

Your solution wouldn't fix it though, you'd mage mages tedious while not changing anything else.

[TK_421]

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Originally posted by TK_421:

But that is a problem.

Your solution wouldn't fix it though, you'd mage mages tedious while not changing anything else.

You just don't like to baysit your characters i get it and I respect that.

[KeiranG19]

Originally posted by TK_421:

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Your solution wouldn't fix it though, you'd mage mages tedious while not changing anything else.

You just don't like to baysit your characters i get it and I respect that.

That doesn't negate the fact that your plan wouldn't help non magical heroes though.

[TK_421]

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Originally posted by TK_421:

You just don't like to baysit your characters i get it and I respect that.

That doesn't negate the fact that your plan wouldn't help non magical heroes though.

Why not?

[KeiranG19]

Originally posted by TK_421:

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

That doesn't negate the fact that your plan wouldn't help non magical heroes though.

Why not?

Because it's only a change to how magic works? How would that fix non magic heroes lacking skill choices?

Maybe I'm not understanding because I'm not an enlightened EU4 player like yourself. Do explain oh game design genius, maybe make another graph of made up numbers as a visual aid.

[TK_421]

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Originally posted by TK_421:

Why not?

Because it's only a change to how magic works? How would that fix non magic heroes lacking skill choices?

Maybe I'm not understanding because I'm not an enlightened EU4 player like yourself. Do explain oh game design genius, maybe make another graph of made up numbers as a visual aid.

There are 2 types of changes direct ones and indirect ones. Yes it would not fix the issue that some non-magic characters don't have enought skills, but it would make the more viable as power creep in mages lvling up system would be flattened.
Also stop using arguments ad-persona it has nothing to do with the fact that the only thing that you proven so far is that it would make players spend a bit more time in the charatec screen lvling up mages. Other things are just based on personal preferences and I can't argue with that.
I play strategy games to strategize not to play the game excatly the same every single time because it is the only viable strategy and that is get the mage and give him 1 good spell that kills enitre enemy armies. That's why the game is so boring after turn 30, because there is nothing else to do you already have an economy and mage in every army and most likely can win with every opponent. That's why even if i really want to play this game i can't because i can't get engaged as the wizards solves all of my issue because of their riddiculles power creep in lvling them up.

[KeiranG19]

Originally posted by TK_421:

Originally posted by KeiranG19:

Because it's only a change to how magic works? How would that fix non magic heroes lacking skill choices?

Maybe I'm not understanding because I'm not an enlightened EU4 player like yourself. Do explain oh game design genius, maybe make another graph of made up numbers as a visual aid.

There are 2 types of changes direct ones and indirect ones. Yes it would not fix the issue that some non-magic characters don't have enought skills, but it would make the more viable as power creep in mages lvling up system would be flattened.
Also stop using arguments ad-persona it has nothing to do with the fact that the only thing that you proven so far is that it would make players spend a bit more time in the charatec screen lvling up mages. Other things are just based on personal preferences and I can't argue with that.
I play strategy games to strategize not to play the game excatly the same every single time because it is the only viable strategy and that is get the mage and give him 1 good spell that kills enitre enemy armies. That's why the game is so boring after turn 30, because there is nothing else to do you already have an economy and mage in every army and most likely can win with every opponent. That's why even if i really want to play this game i can't because i can't get engaged as the wizards solves all of my issue because of their riddiculles power creep in lvling them up.

I'm getting bored of this conversation, Idea's dumb, won't work the way you claim no matter how many times you say it will.

Good luck convincing CA to try it out though.