Why T3 Exalted demons take 2 turns to recruit ?

[Afan]

Why do tier 5 Chosen units take only 1 turn to recruit, while tier 3 exalted demon units take 2 turns to recruit ? Chosen are more powerful than exalted demons in almost everyway. I never recruit exalted demons in campaign because the 2 turn recruitment kills all momentum.

[jonoliveira12]

Daemons are supposed to herd to summon and mass.

They also have different advantages. For example: Exalted Bloodletters have greater Charge bonus than Chosen, and get Spell Resistance, while also costing 25 less in upkeep and having a MUCH BIGGER Armour Piercing stat (31 vs 14), with a bonus vs Infantry, Flaming and Magical attacks.

Chosesn are very strong, but they are also very basic. Exalted Daemons are more specialized, and have a lot of abilities that make up for their lesser base stats, and require one more turn to recruit for balance.

Not for nothing was the unit that killed most models last year, by CA's published stats, teh Bloodletters.

[Afan]

I am speaking from a campaign point of view. If you take Skarbrand for example, a full stack of chosen will take 3-4 turns to recruit, while a full stack of exalted bloodletters will take 6-8 turns to recruit. Skarbrand sitting in one place for more than one turn starts loosing his bloodletting meter, which significantly affects his campaign.

And as for unit comparisons, a full stack of basic chosen is many times more useful, survivable and versatile in campaign than a full stack of exalted bloodletters.

Also a full stack of shielded chosen is an auto-resolve god. You basically never have to fight a manual battle with them. Not so the case with exalted bloodletters.

[jonoliveira12]

Chosen of Khorne cost even more upkeep than regular ones (350 to 325), but have Flaming attacks and some Spell Resistance.
Still, most of the other advantages that Ex Bloddletters get over regular Chose still apply, and they are even cheaper by comparison.

Playing Skarbrand you always want to me quickly, so you indeed get stuck with Chosen most of the times, but if you get a secondary army, to train and ferry units around, it is not difficult or cumbersome for Skarbrand to get some Exalted Bloods either.

The whole purpose of the Khorne campaign is that you manage armies and battles, instead of settlements and expansion.

[Afan]

I think 2 turn recruitment is a vestige from ROC campaign when mortal units were not in the Demon rosters yet. With 1 turn chaos warriors and chosen now available, the 2 turn recruitment of exalted demons should be reduced to 1 turn.

[IonizedMercury]

Because daemons were designed by the main team which actually tries to have a strategy game be about strategy while everything else was pooped on by the DLC team that only cares about catering to scrubs who want their brainless power fantasy.

[Afan]

Originally posted by jonoliveira12:

Chosen of Khorne cost even more upkeep than regular ones (350 to 325), but have Flaming attacks and some Spell Resistance.
Still, most of the other advantages that Ex Bloddletters get over regular Chose still apply, and they are even cheaper by comparison.

Playing Skarbrand you always want to me quickly, so you indeed get stuck with Chosen most of the times, but if you get a secondary army, to train and ferry units around, it is not difficult or cumbersome for Skarbrand to get some Exalted Bloods either.

The whole purpose of the Khorne campaign is that you manage armies and battles, instead of settlements and expansion.

Why would you want Ex bloodletters in Skarbrand's army if you already have chosen ? Chosen stack will outperform bloodletter stack in every campaign situation, be it sieges, against HE ranged armies, dwarves, skaven chaff, wood elf kite armies, empire artillery, etc etc.

[Dagy47]

Originally posted by Afan:

I am speaking from a campaign point of view. If you take Skarbrand for example, a full stack of chosen will take 3-4 turns to recruit, while a full stack of exalted bloodletters will take 6-8 turns to recruit. Skarbrand sitting in one place for more than one turn starts loosing his bloodletting meter, which significantly affects his campaign.

And as for unit comparisons, a full stack of basic chosen is many times more useful, survivable and versatile in campaign than a full stack of exalted bloodletters.

Also a full stack of shielded chosen is an auto-resolve god. You basically never have to fight a manual battle with them. Not so the case with exalted bloodletters.

just 2 things:
1. get someone else to recruit then transfer units, dont use your main army/ lord to just sit somewhere and recruit (unless its 1 turn recruitment and u doing it on the go), its a massive waste of time
2. u should never make full stacks of anything, especialy infantry, mix units up

that being said, i also prefer mortals in khorne army, some letters dont hurt but i usualy just summon them and use army slots for monsters/ heavy cav

[jonoliveira12]

Originally posted by Afan:

Originally posted by jonoliveira12:

Chosen of Khorne cost even more upkeep than regular ones (350 to 325), but have Flaming attacks and some Spell Resistance.
Still, most of the other advantages that Ex Bloddletters get over regular Chose still apply, and they are even cheaper by comparison.

Playing Skarbrand you always want to me quickly, so you indeed get stuck with Chosen most of the times, but if you get a secondary army, to train and ferry units around, it is not difficult or cumbersome for Skarbrand to get some Exalted Bloods either.

The whole purpose of the Khorne campaign is that you manage armies and battles, instead of settlements and expansion.

Why would you want Ex bloodletters in Skarbrand's army if you already have chosen ? Chosen stack will outperform bloodletter stack in every campaign situation, be it sieges, against HE ranged armies, dwarves, skaven chaff, wood elf kite armies, empire artillery, etc etc.

Because Exalted Bloodletters have MUCH better Charge, Armour Piercing, and are anti-Infantry, so they go through enemy Heavy Infantry much faster than Chosen do.

Chosen are generalists, Exalted Bloods are specialists. Khorne play a lot with Knights and Juggernaughts, so an anti-Infantry unit fits a lot more than a generalist unit, unless what you want is just an auto-resolve stack.

[Afan]

Similar situation with tzeentch. Front line of 1 turn chaos warriors and 1 turn pink horrors will achieve exactly the same result as a 1 turn CW and 2 turn exalted pinks army. So why bother with exalted pinks ever ?

I agree that WOC DLC made things a little too easy, but now that it is there and cannot be undone, atleast updating the recruitment time for exalted demons might bring them back to regular use instead of being neglected.

[IonizedMercury]

Originally posted by Afan:

Similar situation with tzeentch. Front line of 1 turn chaos warriors and 1 turn pink horrors will achieve exactly the same result as a 1 turn CW and 2 turn exalted pinks army. So why bother with exalted pinks ever ?

I agree that WOC DLC made things a little too easy, but now that it is there and cannot be undone, atleast updating the recruitment time for exalted demons might bring them back to regular use instead of being neglected.

What do you mean "can't be undone"? Of course they can. They just don't want to because the scrubs are the only people they care about.

[Afan]

Originally posted by jonoliveira12:

Originally posted by Afan:

Why would you want Ex bloodletters in Skarbrand's army if you already have chosen ? Chosen stack will outperform bloodletter stack in every campaign situation, be it sieges, against HE ranged armies, dwarves, skaven chaff, wood elf kite armies, empire artillery, etc etc.

Because Exalted Bloodletters have MUCH better Charge, Armour Piercing, and are anti-Infantry, so they go through enemy Heavy Infantry much faster than Chosen do.

Chosen are generalists, Exalted Bloods are specialists. Khorne play a lot with Knights and Juggernaughts, so an anti-Infantry unit fits a lot more than a generalist unit, unless what you want is just an auto-resolve stack.

one word, "Demonic crumbling". One tough battle and some micro mistakes, and you loose an entire unit of ranked Ex bloodletters, maybe more. Now again wait for 2 turns to recruit rank 1 units. In the same situation a Chosen/CW unit will rout and never we wiped out. So no loosing rank and no waiting 2 turns for fresh recruitment.

All im saying is that in the current state of the game, 2 turn recruitment for exalted demons makes them redundant and not worth the time and money. Is the current state of the game a good thing ? i dont know. Just that i desperately want to use exalted demons in my campaigns but cant due to aforementioned downsides. I myself am bored of basic bloodletter/CW spam. But using exalted demons is just handicapping myself for no good reason. Atleast in the current state of the game.

[MrSoul]

I rem my first time worshipping the dark gods.
Cos cultists need set up a portal twice as large, and sacrifice twice as many victims to bring it through.

But ya, chosen should be 2 turns too.