Orion is a pretty fun campaign at the moment, i guess they will nerf him

[Mouse]

The -% upkeep for every war you are in is pretty powerful. You can of course just declare war on lots of far away factions, pirates, etc and your armies will become very cheap.. and even free if you are in enough. At mid-late game i had about 15 armies most of which were about 2000 per turn and Orion's was free. What i like about it is you can have an army for every forest and really makes you feel like you are having a global battle in defence of the woods.

Another thing which is pretty powerful is the 50% movement range in worldroots. You can get away from anyone, and can hit and run very easily especially against factions which can't underway stance.

I can recommend trying it because they will probably nerf it soon. Might even do another and declare war on everyone except wood elves.

[Fendelphi]

Originally posted by Mouse:

The -% upkeep for every war you are in is pretty powerful. You can of course just declare war on lots of far away factions, pirates, etc and your armies will become very cheap.. and even free if you are in enough. At mid-late game i had about 15 armies most of which were about 2000 per turn and Orion's was free. What i like about it is you can have an army for every forest and really makes you feel like you are having a global battle in defence of the woods.

Another thing which is pretty powerful is the 50% movement range in worldroots. You can get away from anyone, and can hit and run very easily especially against factions which can't underway stance.

I can recommend trying it because they will probably nerf it soon. Might even do another and declare war on everyone except wood elves.

Why would it be nerfed? The AI never utilizes it to the same degree a player can, so Orion does not consistently dominate the map as AI. It does not break anything.

It simply allows for a few more armies if you have multiple wars going on. It does not make the armies stronger or allow for some unique abilities like the other Wood Elf factions, and you can still be overwhelmed if you have too many enemies attacking you, especially if you have very spread out territory.

[SBA77]

I smell another episode of is A Perfectly Balanced Game with No Exploits

[Abisha]

the bonus should only apply to a range of closest village/city

[Archaon The Never-Chosen]

Originally posted by Fendelphi:

Originally posted by Mouse:

The -% upkeep for every war you are in is pretty powerful. You can of course just declare war on lots of far away factions, pirates, etc and your armies will become very cheap.. and even free if you are in enough. At mid-late game i had about 15 armies most of which were about 2000 per turn and Orion's was free. What i like about it is you can have an army for every forest and really makes you feel like you are having a global battle in defence of the woods.

Another thing which is pretty powerful is the 50% movement range in worldroots. You can get away from anyone, and can hit and run very easily especially against factions which can't underway stance.

I can recommend trying it because they will probably nerf it soon. Might even do another and declare war on everyone except wood elves.

Why would it be nerfed? The AI never utilizes it to the same degree a player can, so Orion does not consistently dominate the map as AI. It does not break anything.

It simply allows for a few more armies if you have multiple wars going on. It does not make the armies stronger or allow for some unique abilities like the other Wood Elf factions, and you can still be overwhelmed if you have too many enemies attacking you, especially if you have very spread out territory.

WE can't have spread out territory they are literally the definition of tall and every settlement that is worth defending is practically a city

[leandrombraz]

It's on the known issues page, so it's 100% guaranteed it will be nerfed, quite likely on 3.0

"Orion's faction ability can make it easy to generate free armies."
https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/312842/total-war-warhammer-iii-known-issues-updated-17-02-2023/p1

Originally posted by Fendelphi:

Why would it be nerfed? The AI never utilizes it to the same degree a player can, so Orion does not consistently dominate the map as AI. It does not break anything.

It simply allows for a few more armies if you have multiple wars going on. It does not make the armies stronger or allow for some unique abilities like the other Wood Elf factions, and you can still be overwhelmed if you have too many enemies attacking you, especially if you have very spread out territory.

You can easily get free armies, which isn't the intended design for Wood Elves, or any race for that matter, and it breaks Orion's campaign for anyone that wants to play with a fun mechanic that is meaningful, but not broken and cheesy. It goes down to what is the experience the devs want to provide.

[Fendelphi]

Originally posted by Archaon The Never-Chosen:

Originally posted by Fendelphi:

Why would it be nerfed? The AI never utilizes it to the same degree a player can, so Orion does not consistently dominate the map as AI. It does not break anything.

It simply allows for a few more armies if you have multiple wars going on. It does not make the armies stronger or allow for some unique abilities like the other Wood Elf factions, and you can still be overwhelmed if you have too many enemies attacking you, especially if you have very spread out territory.

WE can't have spread out territory they are literally the definition of tall and every settlement that is worth defending is practically a city

Spread out in the sense that if you want all the tree settlements, you will have to own territory in various spots around the map. So it is impossible to consolidate your defenses.

[Fendelphi]

Originally posted by leandrombraz:

It's on the known issues page, so it's 100% guaranteed it will be nerfed, quite likely on 3.0

"Orion's faction ability can make it easy to generate free armies."
https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/312842/total-war-warhammer-iii-known-issues-updated-17-02-2023/p1

Originally posted by Fendelphi:

Why would it be nerfed? The AI never utilizes it to the same degree a player can, so Orion does not consistently dominate the map as AI. It does not break anything.

It simply allows for a few more armies if you have multiple wars going on. It does not make the armies stronger or allow for some unique abilities like the other Wood Elf factions, and you can still be overwhelmed if you have too many enemies attacking you, especially if you have very spread out territory.

You can easily get free armies, which isn't the intended design for Wood Elves, or any race for that matter, and it breaks Orion's campaign for anyone that wants to play with a fun mechanic that is meaningful, but not broken and cheesy. It goes down to what is the experience the devs want to provide.

It was made on purpose when they updated Orion 6 months ago. If you have a lot of enemies, you will get cheaper armies(in terms of upkeep), but if you then suddenly have no more wars, you might not be able to pay for all those armies and will have to disband them.

Several other factions can also wield cheap armies, without having to rely on ongoing wars, and it does not break them either.

[Xaphnir]

Originally posted by Fendelphi:

Why would it be nerfed? The AI never utilizes it to the same degree a player can, so Orion does not consistently dominate the map as AI. It does not break anything.

Because the theme of faction changes in WH3 seems to be nerfing any unique faction or race mechanics that are moderately powerful.

Also, if CA has listed it as an issue they're looking at, that gives insight into their thinking: i.e. that it's OP and should be nerfed.

[IonizedMercury]

Of course this needs to go, it makes no sense whatsoever. Wood Elves are not a faction that either revels in waging war or should be able to spam armies, that's Greenskins. Wood Elves are by far the smallest of the major races and their warfare is all about guerilla tactics and hit and run strikes.

A mechanic by which they get rewarded for losing as little troops as possible would be more fitting, like armies getting automatically cloaked and hidden if they win with less than 5% casualties.

[zefyris]

Honnestly, I don't think it's over the top enough to necessite a huge nerf. If they nerf it it'll probably be because it's way stronegr than the devs intended it to be, but that's it. Though near the top, Orion isn't even the strongest faction in the hand of a player, and it isn't close tbh. I'm kind of expecting another faction to get the nerf hammer, especially a certain tech that allows everything to go waaay too much out of control, but we'll see how long it'll last befopre being nerfed, it has endured several patches already, hillariously.

[IonizedMercury]

Originally posted by zefyris:

Honnestly, I don't think it's over the top enough to necessite a huge nerf. If they nerf it it'll probably be because it's way stronegr than the devs intended it to be, but that's it. Though near the top, Orion isn't even the strongest faction in the hand of a player, and it isn't close tbh. I'm kind of expecting another faction to get the nerf hammer, especially a certain tech that allows everything to go waaay too much out of control, but we'll see how long it'll last befopre being nerfed, it has endured several patches already, hillariously.

Infinite free armies for basically zero effort is as stupid as it gets.

This game needs less kindergarten factions, not more.

[Sarumoon]

"Because the theme of faction changes in WH3 seems to be nerfing any unique faction or race mechanics that are moderately powerful."


That's the definition of balance. Knocking down the high spots, building up the low spots.

Not always as great a thing as people think, more of a "careful what you wish for" situation.

[zefyris]

Originally posted by PMarricks:

Originally posted by zefyris:

Honnestly, I don't think it's over the top enough to necessite a huge nerf. If they nerf it it'll probably be because it's way stronegr than the devs intended it to be, but that's it. Though near the top, Orion isn't even the strongest faction in the hand of a player, and it isn't close tbh. I'm kind of expecting another faction to get the nerf hammer, especially a certain tech that allows everything to go waaay too much out of control, but we'll see how long it'll last befopre being nerfed, it has endured several patches already, hillariously.

Infinite free armies for basically zero effort is as stupid as it gets.

This game needs less kindergarten factions, not more.

That's BS, Orion is still under the supply line debuff in WH3, you need one more enemy to be at war with every time you recruit one more army, and the more time passes the less possible enemy are on the map. You definitely don't have infinite army; you can't. You'll need around 20-25 factions to be at war with just to reach 100% reduction earmy on, then you'll need to add 1 more faction at war for every army you recruit. Every time a faction you were at war with disappear (confeded, destroyed)

[FrozenVagabond]

I don't feel wood elves being fun tbh, they seem have nothing to do with the rest of the world for the whole game lol..

[leandrombraz]

Originally posted by Fendelphi:

It was made on purpose when they updated Orion 6 months ago. If you have a lot of enemies, you will get cheaper armies(in terms of upkeep), but if you then suddenly have no more wars, you might not be able to pay for all those armies and will have to disband them.

Several other factions can also wield cheap armies, without having to rely on ongoing wars, and it does not break them either.

They intended to give Orion cheaper armies, sure, but you can get them for free, and you can do it quite early, which definitely isn't what they were going for. CA needs to limit how cheap it can get, either with a hard limit, or by making the requirement to get a discount more restrictive (ex: only war with factions that you share a border with reduces the upkeep). Either way, you'll still get cheaper armies, you just won't be able to spam wars to get free armies. It can still be a powerful ability, it just shouldn't be exploitable.