Diplomacy (confederations specifically)

[BARH182]

Is anyone else finding diplomacy severely harder in immortal empires? Even on easy mode, factions that would previously love trading and signing non-aggression pacts are unwilling in immortal empires.

I also can’t seem to confederate for the life of me (except for throgg). Markus wolfhart wont confederate either franz, eltharion won’t confederate with Tyrion - what am I doing wrong?

[Rainnd]

Empire confederates through high fealty, but overall yes confederations are way harder to archieve. As for trading, it mostly depends on in you have trade goods available for trading.

[Yoinkyz]

you need to put a strong army on there home territory. you can easy confederate with 2 strong armys next to them. didnt work well for ogre kingdom doe i suspect you need a strong enough army to destroy all there armys for it to work

[RealDealBreaker]

Well in the patch notes they said they were making it slightly easier to confederate major factions and a bit harder to confederate minor factions. I can't say how much it's changed, but I do not feel as though I am having a substantially more difficult time than in ME.

[MrSoul]

Originally posted by Pookie101:

helps if you are A. very friendly with them and B. outnumber the number of settlements they have I've found when playing around with Cathay

As well try watch for any times their main lord is defeated or lose bunch armies in a battle, this seems to really tank their resistance to the idea lol how confed’d hellebron, Rakarth, Malus and morathi this campaign too tho kinda annoying as have pick up their losing wars all over world now lol

[BARH182]

Originally posted by Rainnd:

Empire confederates through high fealty, but overall yes confederations are way harder to archieve. As for trading, it mostly depends on in you have trade goods available for trading.

Wolfhart doesn’t have fealty he is not an elector count faction

[P U R P L E]

What i can recommend is use the "threaten" function when it comes to confederation and you are significantly stronger. It works about 90% of times for me even with major factions.

[Emrys of Ailliau]

as a high elf player, I can vouch for the relationship value between factions being unimpactful on diplomacy compared to other effects. playing yvresse adding 100 relations could not overcome distance and a too many trade routes penalty when trying to get a trade agreement with imrik. that's disgusting. it didn't change the AI's evaluation of the deal even a tiny .01 bit. if its truly going to be that hard to get them at least give us a respec for confederated characters, including their quest battles.

also too many trade agreements.... wtf ca.

[Emperor's Champion]

Originally posted by BARH182:

Is anyone else finding diplomacy severely harder in immortal empires? Even on easy mode, factions that would previously love trading and signing non-aggression pacts are unwilling in immortal empires.

I also can’t seem to confederate for the life of me (except for throgg). Markus wolfhart wont confederate either franz, eltharion won’t confederate with Tyrion - what am I doing wrong?

Confederation is still virtually impossible for factions who don't confederate through mechanics.

I played an Eltharion campaign and despite dwarfing Tyrion and Alarielle in faction strength I was not able to confederate them until turn 160+. Kind of pointless by that time.

CA's strange reasoning for this is not wanting players to paint the map? Not sure what they are trying to say there because players paint the map regardless.

Either way confederations are still in an unacceptable state and need to be fixed further.

[MrSoul]

Originally posted by Emperor's Champion:

Originally posted by BARH182:

Is anyone else finding diplomacy severely harder in immortal empires? Even on easy mode, factions that would previously love trading and signing non-aggression pacts are unwilling in immortal empires.

I also can’t seem to confederate for the life of me (except for throgg). Markus wolfhart wont confederate either franz, eltharion won’t confederate with Tyrion - what am I doing wrong?

Confederation is still virtually impossible for factions who don't confederate through mechanics.

I played an Eltharion campaign and despite dwarfing Tyrion and Alarielle in faction strength I was not able to confederate them until turn 160+. Kind of pointless by that time.

CA's strange reasoning for this is not wanting players to paint the map? Not sure what they are trying to say there because players paint the map regardless.

Either way confederations are still in an unacceptable state and need to be fixed further.

My guess? This all stems from their stats that people don’t actually use most map in a campaign, but the part they sorely missed was that it’s not you may use it, it’s that it’s there in first place, and easy confed is a means you can actually get F outta the scrum match on factions door step and go something YOU want to do…yup, I dunno what they’re doing anymore

[Prince_Tavi]

Playing as Alith Anar I was able to confed all the Ulthuan high elves (used the influence I was farming to make them like me...A LOT...took getting them to around 400 for some and took Tyrion to 600+ to get his, as well as randomly having them have a main threat that was someone I was fighting, should note they had all of Ulthuan, I had everything north of the wood elves all the way across to the wastes North of Norsca by the time I finished confederating them). Meanwhile, in my Morathi campaign the other Dark Elves are being way, way harder. Rakarth is at 673 relations (I have a lot of spare money), and is unwilling to confederate, he has 11 settlements I own all of Lustria, Naggarond, Ulthuan, the Southern Chaos Wastes and the Northern Chaos Wastes (across to the western edge of Norsca) minus the approximately 23 settlements that Malekith, Rakarth and Hellebron own between them. Hell, Hellebron's relation is at 278 and she won't confed and she has ONE settlement AND ONE army with FIVE units. System is completely ♥♥♥♥♥♥.

[Darthudd]

Originally posted by Emrys of Ailliau:

as a high elf player, I can vouch for the relationship value between factions being unimpactful on diplomacy compared to other effects. playing yvresse adding 100 relations could not overcome distance and a too many trade routes penalty when trying to get a trade agreement with imrik. that's disgusting. it didn't change the AI's evaluation of the deal even a tiny .01 bit. if its truly going to be that hard to get them at least give us a respec for confederated characters, including their quest battles.

also too many trade agreements.... wtf ca.

Playing as Teclis atm, trying to confederate Yvresse, even after I get their relationship up to 400+ and have 150k in the bank, they are stil minus 4.5 with no option to balance the deal.

[Leslian Lexter]

Try playing Nkari. Everyone loves Nkari.

[P U R P L E]

Originally posted by Darthudd:

Originally posted by Emrys of Ailliau:

as a high elf player, I can vouch for the relationship value between factions being unimpactful on diplomacy compared to other effects. playing yvresse adding 100 relations could not overcome distance and a too many trade routes penalty when trying to get a trade agreement with imrik. that's disgusting. it didn't change the AI's evaluation of the deal even a tiny .01 bit. if its truly going to be that hard to get them at least give us a respec for confederated characters, including their quest battles.

also too many trade agreements.... wtf ca.

Playing as Teclis atm, trying to confederate Yvresse, even after I get their relationship up to 400+ and have 150k in the bank, they are stil minus 4.5 with no option to balance the deal.

At this point threatening to confederate should be nearly guaranteed, try it ^^

[MT]

Try Bretonnia, especially Louen. Bretonnia has around 10 techs for confederation. But you only manage to get Lyonesse and Artois. It is mathematically impossible to confederete the others cause they are dead before round 20 hits. And Lyonesse is usually instant sieged by Mousillion if you confederate.

Maybe Alberic manages to survive. Fay and Repanse are nearly impossible and require a very big amount of luck to confederate.

I swear Louens campaign is just a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ at this moment. Absolutly unfun.

[GoldenRobot]

Originally posted by Prince_Tavi:

Playing as Alith Anar I was able to confed all the Ulthuan high elves (used the influence I was farming to make them like me...A LOT...took getting them to around 400 for some and took Tyrion to 600+ to get his, as well as randomly having them have a main threat that was someone I was fighting, should note they had all of Ulthuan, I had everything north of the wood elves all the way across to the wastes North of Norsca by the time I finished confederating them). Meanwhile, in my Morathi campaign the other Dark Elves are being way, way harder. Rakarth is at 673 relations (I have a lot of spare money), and is unwilling to confederate, he has 11 settlements I own all of Lustria, Naggarond, Ulthuan, the Southern Chaos Wastes and the Northern Chaos Wastes (across to the western edge of Norsca) minus the approximately 23 settlements that Malekith, Rakarth and Hellebron own between them. Hell, Hellebron's relation is at 278 and she won't confed and she has ONE settlement AND ONE army with FIVE units. System is completely ♥♥♥♥♥♥.

Playing as Tyrion with half the Island under control and ranked #1 in army strength not being able to Confederate High Elven leaders who have two towns and 400+ Diplomacy score is bewildering. What's the point of the "Influence" mechanic if it doesn't help any?