Why Nurgle start is so bad?

[Plootia]

You start with a plague frog, a plaguebearer and a fly with ability to lob some balls. Basically their performance is comparable to tier 3-4 units, since it is nurgle, they dont have the ability to deal damage. So basically u start a 1 artillery, 1 tier 3 slow ass cav, 1 flying tier 4 cav( it has range atk compare to the other rot fly, but it literally dont deal any considerable damage) and a dwarf warriors without shield.

I just launched another new campaign with Khorne, he start with warshrine, 2 skullcrusher.
Skullcrusher are tier 5 units, have good damage and have bonus versus infantry. Warshrine is a tier 3-4 unit. So with khorne start u get 2 tier 5 unit??? Why nurgle dont get that? I believe Nurgle start should have 1 soul grinder/1 great unclean one, rot fly and plague toads are not the best unit to help your campagin.

Whats yall opinion on this?

[PewSquare]

I dunno, i played nurgle, and the early game of theirs is really strong. Their low tier units are absolute beasts in melee, and their spells are pretty insane as well. Where i started having issues was when i had to start fighting large range unit stacks. Since nurgle is slow. Oh so slow.

[Plootia]

Originally posted by PewSquare:

I dunno, i played nurgle, and the early game of theirs is really strong. Their low tier units are absolute beasts in melee, and their spells are pretty insane as well. Where i started having issues was when i had to start fighting large range unit stacks. Since nurgle is slow. Oh so slow.

Yea.... the problem is enemy melee is barely a issue, when enemy have ranged, u have 2 choice unit or spell, the nurgle cavalry (except flying) is too slow to outrun enemy melee and strike enemy backline lol, they need a lot of time too since they deal low dmg. Same for flying, even if it is faster they still need a lot of time.

[AkumulatoR]

Go mass nurglings. It's a no brainer. Also you get a follower with 20% hire and upkeep for them as soon as you win a battle. Once you get regeneration for them they become decent tar pit and they're not slow as ♥♥♥♥ like plaguebearers. Their real strength is the plagues. Get crumpling ague asap and you can even autoresolve most battles and don't care about casualties.

[SnarfYourSnarf]

Nurgle is actually great. Create a nurgling blob like mentioned above, focus on unlocking soul grinders, making an alliance with skaven for plaguemaws, and unlocking 20% physical resist plague. Also keep nurglings near kugath for his passive healing and get his AOE melee ability. That plus lots of nurglings is all you need till late game, I really only used Nurglings sprinkled with 3-4 beasts and 1 soul grinder in main army late game. VH/VH btw so should work on any difficulty.
Also, don't use Kugath's spell line, get a hero to do this for you and go full yellow rush to AOE, then red to get nurgling bonuses. The beast slug guys are great and get same bonuses as your Nurglings from talent tree.
I found the plaguemaws unnecessary for Kugath but great for 2nd armies. You can also skip his first two special skills if you want, the + growth and summons, nurgling summon was okay, I got it, but you can do without and if your playing Nurgle correctly growth will never be an issue so definitely skip that one.
By end game my nurglings had regen, 46% physical resist, 10 or 15% missile resist (can't remember), plus passive heal from Kugath and massive debuffing.

[Sin317]

Restarted Nurgle campaign a couple of times, to get mechanics down and as far as I can see, it's all about peppering the enemy pre-engagement. With plagues and heroes. The assault units alone is extremely powerful, add plague that gives them attrition and reduced movement and it's in the bag.

[Professor H. Farnsworth]

The only real problem for Nurgle is Tzeentch. Due to their missile units being magical and Nurgle starts in a horrible position in which there's 2 Tzeentch factions to the north, enemies to the south, Greenskins to the East so expansion is.. precarious at the best of times.
No matter what you do and I have tested a lot you will end up in a war with Ogres. If you don't take out Tzeentch factions they will swap your settlements on the other hand around turn 30-40 Kislev will be coming from the south.

Now, if you go straight for Kislev, Tzeentch will be a pain in the back, if you go for Tzeentch you always need someone south to defend against dwarves/kislev

Kislev and Cathay mostly use non-magic ranged and those are not a problem for Nurgle to deal with you can always ♥♥♥♥ block them by using -10% range and -20% accuracy, -20% ranged weapon damage on top of attrition. That stops them dead in their track and if your army is not about to capture a settlement have 20% physical resist.

Nurglings are very viable early on, but they get massacred later so easily. Spending 2 points in Ku'gaths skill tree is of course a possibility, but it is so expansive and there are more important things to have. Around turn 40 you should be at the point in which you are phasing out Nurglings in favor of Exalted Plaguebearers/Forsaken/Beasts of Nurgle/Great Unclean Ones/Soul Grinders (in fact you should have soul grinders around turn 30).

The most important recipe you can unlock ASAP is the 250% sacking bonus. That will set you up for steam rolling as you can now have extra armies and run a negative economy until your economy bounces back and balance itself with all the new territory you capture.

I honestly suggest taking out Tzeentch factions asap, then focus on taking out the ogres to the east in the mountains, then move up north and take out cathay, you now have an impenetrable corner - save for rifts of course.

[Enelith]

Originally posted by Plootia:

Yea.... the problem is enemy melee is barely a issue, when enemy have ranged, u have 2 choice unit or spell, the nurgle cavalry (except flying) is too slow to outrun enemy melee and strike enemy backline lol, they need a lot of time too since they deal low dmg. Same for flying, even if it is faster they still need a lot of time.

Specific deities are not balanced (which is great). They're suppose to embodies some extreme and as a result have a big flaw / advantage in one aspect.
Nurgle (just like its theme and background) embodies endurance (tanky units for most part), life and death (which can be seen in its buildings).
But they're slow as hell, and range armies can be tough. They thematically outlive their opponent (at least in melee), and it's great imo. There's a reason they can heavily plan on plagues and attritions.
In short, I think it's good they struggle against some kind of threat but not other.

[Plootia]

Originally posted by Enelith:

Originally posted by Plootia:

Yea.... the problem is enemy melee is barely a issue, when enemy have ranged, u have 2 choice unit or spell, the nurgle cavalry (except flying) is too slow to outrun enemy melee and strike enemy backline lol, they need a lot of time too since they deal low dmg. Same for flying, even if it is faster they still need a lot of time.

Specific deities are not balanced (which is great). They're suppose to embodies some extreme and as a result have a big flaw / advantage in one aspect.
Nurgle (just like its theme and background) embodies endurance (tanky units for most part), life and death (which can be seen in its buildings).
But they're slow as hell, and range armies can be tough. They thematically outlive their opponent (at least in melee), and it's great imo. There's a reason they can heavily plan on plagues and attritions.
In short, I think it's good they struggle against some kind of threat but not other.

Just when you make a blob with Kurgath, he is too big and tall.... Every ranged unit will target him, which is really pain in ass while playing him and i havent unlock any range reducing plague/damage spell yet, i think i just need a army ability/spell like beastmen which i can reduce enemy ammo amount.

[The Sand Witch]

Bloodcrushers**** are tier 4 not 5, but yeah Khorne starts with a ridiculously powerful army.
Still it doesn't mean you need to nerf buff Kugath's army, there is no issue early to stomp the ogres or dwarves. You can then get forsaken/spawns/soulgrinders and move forward.

Nurgle's only true bad item is Kugath himself.

[Raxo]

Bow units absolutely SHRED through Nurgle units

[Raxo]

Dwarfs came down and slaughtered my starter army in like turn 5 or something stupid like that since you start at war with them :/

[Diomedes]

Originally posted by Raxo:

Dwarfs came down and slaughtered my starter army in like turn 5 or something stupid like that since you start at war with them :/

Use ambush stance liberally... Nurgle is like a freight train, incredibly slow to start, but once you get going you become incredibly powerful.. With ridiculous replenishment rates, instantaneous replacements to units.. And incredibly powerful heroes and lords.. If you're facing a army with out any missle units, or very few.. The faction leader is one of the most powerful melee units in the game..
Don't bother making any kind of unit building structures, go all infrastructure in the beginning.. Nurglings, are actually incredibly powerful.

[Diomedes]

Originally posted by Plootia:

Originally posted by PewSquare:

I dunno, i played nurgle, and the early game of theirs is really strong. Their low tier units are absolute beasts in melee, and their spells are pretty insane as well. Where i started having issues was when i had to start fighting large range unit stacks. Since nurgle is slow. Oh so slow.

Yea.... the problem is enemy melee is barely a issue, when enemy have ranged, u have 2 choice unit or spell, the nurgle cavalry (except flying) is too slow to outrun enemy melee and strike enemy backline lol, they need a lot of time too since they deal low dmg. Same for flying, even if it is faster they still need a lot of time.

The only ranged units you';ll be dealing with are dwarfs, which are slow.. And you can consistently ambush them on the map.. Orges are a complete non issue, and can pretty easily take your first providence to build your economy.

[Humpbacked Angel]

I wanna see that incredible replenishment, grinder take 16 turns from recruitment to full hp.

[Aluminum Elite Master]

The Nurgle LL is super tanky... I just used him to tank enemy forces, then flanked with Nurglings.

Also, people talking about replenishment: there's a manifestation for 20% increased replenishment, plus you can spam the infrastructure building that I think buffs replenishment as well. Early on, I did merge a few units to make up losses, but you can insta-buy units so it's not too bad if you do. Just means you go through that initial pool of nurglings a bit fast, but they come back.