What's the best thing to do to make Wizards not suck?

[👁]

I mean, they feel so underpowered next to a warlock or sorcerer, and barely up to snuff next to a druid or cleric once they high higher levels.

What's the main reason to play as a Wizard besides being able to learn a hundred spells you'll never use?

[Minnzy]

Not play them in a videogame? Well, at least one that's 5e as they're still just better in 3.5/Pathfinder.

The thing is, Wizards are planners. They're meant to use their knowledge to prepare themselves for encounters and sadly that isn't really something you can do in games where "Blasting" is really all you need and since Sorcerers were actually given something special and they're not just useless Wizards now they get a chance to shine.

As a huge wizard fan I knew going in to my first playthrough (Drow Wizard) I wouldn't be able to do what wizards are meant to. 5e just doesn't do them justice in a videogame setting and there really isn't anything to change that.

[sudokek]

I feel like you might be playing it wrong? My wizard main has always been extremely strong, at least after level 4 or so.

What skills are you taking op?

[GrandMajora]

Originally posted by 👁:

I mean, they feel so underpowered next to a warlock or sorcerer, and barely up to snuff next to a druid or cleric once they high higher levels.

What's the main reason to play as a Wizard besides being able to learn a hundred spells you'll never use?

The answer to that depends on what kind of specialty school you want to focus on. Most people seem to favor Abjuration for its constant shield, but I prefer to go with Transmutation, for its chance to craft 2 items with Alchemy. Just remember to take Proficiency in Medicine, or you'll fail the DC 15 check a lot.


Evocation wizards can also add their intelligence modifier to the damage of their spells later on. Which would be cool for upcasting Magic Missile for a +5 Damage output on each one.

-----------------------------------

Alternatively, you can try this.

Get the X4 Spell Slots + Feat every level mod.

Now you can go more than 1 or 2 battles without needing to take a Long Rest.

[👁]

Originally posted by sudokek:

I feel like you might be playing it wrong? My wizard main has always been extremely strong, at least after level 4 or so.

What skills are you taking op?

Stuff like Fireball and Flaming Hands, and I have maxed out int and evoker subclass, but the thing is Warlocks get multi-shot cantrips and some of the same spells that Wizard gets, and a Sorcerer gets all the best Wiz spells and can cast them with careful casting so that no one in the splash zone gets hurt, and cast two spells at once by using quick casting to burn a bonus action.

Meanwhile my wizard only gets the one spell per round, he just can't keep up with a Sorcerer for wiping out crowds of enemies, or hit a single target as hard as a warlock... except I guess with a maximally upcast magic missile at higher levels.

[Mike Garrison]

Some builds:

1) magic missile machine gun -- Get the amulet that adds an extra missile per cast. Use items that add damage per attack, because they add it to every missile. Be a 10th level evoker and add your INT modifier to every missile.

2) Elemental AOE specialist -- Focus on a single element (ice is good, so is lightning). Get gear that enhanced that element, like the ice staff from the underdark or (especially) Markoheshkir. Drop ice storms or chain lightning etc. Again be an evoker.

3) Damage Tank -- Abjuration. Cast spells to buff yourself and allies and build up a shield of damage reduction.

4) Multi-class with some other spellcaster type. One level of wizard means you can learn almost every spell in the game from scrolls. (But be aware they cast as INT if you learn them from a scroll.)

And of course you can get past those pesky DC30 locks with a single 2nd level spell slot. Use darkness to hide your party's misdeeds. Stuff like that.

D&D wizards have always been problematic because they are weak at low levels and OP at high levels. This game stops leveling just when some of the most gamebreaking wizard spells would start showing up, like Forcecage or Simulacrum.

[GrandMajora]

Originally posted by Mike Garrison:

2) Elemental AOE specialist -- Focus on a single element (ice is good, so is lightning). Get gear that enhanced that element, like the ice staff from the underdark or (especially) Markoheshkir. Drop ice storms or chain lightning etc. Again be an evoker.

Sadly, Acid builds peak at level 3, because there's only, like, 3 acid spells in the whole game. Acid Splash (Cantrip), Chromatic Orb (1st level), and Acid Arrow (2nd level).

There's nothing after that, so you have to upcast those spells if you want to get more benefit out of them.

[Draknalor]

The main thing is to never use can trips.

Magic missile can’t miss and do decent dmg even on low level, Pair it with the lightning staff from waukeen’s rest and you have amazing damage.

Never tried it without that staff tho.

When you get aoe spells like blizzard/Fire ball, Use those on big crowdes only

[Chaosolous]

Respec.

[アンジェル]

Originally posted by 👁:

What's the best thing to do to make Wizards not suck?
I mean, they feel so underpowered next to a warlock or sorcerer, and barely up to snuff next to a druid or cleric once they high higher levels.

What's the main reason to play as a Wizard besides being able to learn a hundred spells you'll never use?

Play a fighter until level 12, then respec them into Wizard.

Wizards are late bloomers.

[Midas]

Get the mod that adds the Bladesinger subclass. That's a whole bunch of fun.

[👁]

Originally posted by Mike Garrison:

Some builds:

1) magic missile machine gun -- Get the amulet that adds an extra missile per cast. Use items that add damage per attack, because they add it to every missile. Be a 10th level evoker and add your INT modifier to every missile.

So eventually Gale is going to be a guided chaingun that can out damage Wyll to shame about a dozen times per rest.

Sweet.

Originally posted by Mike Garrison:

2) Elemental AOE specialist -- Focus on a single element (ice is good, so is lightning). Get gear that enhanced that element, like the ice staff from the underdark or (especially) Markoheshkir. Drop ice storms or chain lightning etc. Again be an evoker.

That was kind of my plan for Gale by default but I'm currently having an Astarion Sorcerer run and at level 8 Astarion has two fireballs vs Gale's 1 fireball. Astarion can also carefully cast spells like flaming hands without hitting Gale but when Gale casts it he has to be super careful about allies being caught in the cone.

As a sorcerer Astarion is also able to maximize or extend his Magic Missiles so they hit harder or extend the range on them to hit enemies at longer distances, and Wyll just has insane damage and range on his Eldrich Lance at this point. So poor Gale kind feel a little weak at the moment, like Astarian and Wyll are just completely showing him up.

Originally posted by Mike Garrison:

3) Damage Tank -- Abjuration. Cast spells to buff yourself and allies and build up a shield of damage reduction.

That's a really cool idea that I would have never thought of, I'm really tempted to respec to try that but I don't want to lose my scribed spells.

Originally posted by Mike Garrison:

4) Multi-class with some other spellcaster type. One level of wizard means you can learn almost every spell in the game from scrolls. (But be aware they cast as INT if you learn them from a scroll.)

What's a good way to multiclass Gale? I was thinking of respeccing him and making him with a Intelligence/Dexterity or Strength build then leveling him up to level 4 for Evoker and the bonus feat then dual classing with a fighter or a rogue and going the Arcane Warrior or Trickster.

Gale sort of feels like he'd make a cool arcane warrior if he started with better stats for it, I can see him wearing Kelemvor's armor going around throwing fireballs and swinging his sword around. He'd still be completely outclassed by Astarion and Wyll but he'd be pretty bad ass.

[アンジェル]

Originally posted by 👁:

Originally posted by Mike Garrison:

Some builds:

1) magic missile machine gun -- Get the amulet that adds an extra missile per cast. Use items that add damage per attack, because they add it to every missile. Be a 10th level evoker and add your INT modifier to every missile.

So eventually Gale is going to be a guided chaingun that can out damage Wyll to shame about a dozen times per rest.

Sweet.

Originally posted by Mike Garrison:

2) Elemental AOE specialist -- Focus on a single element (ice is good, so is lightning). Get gear that enhanced that element, like the ice staff from the underdark or (especially) Markoheshkir. Drop ice storms or chain lightning etc. Again be an evoker.

That was kind of my plan for Gale by default but I'm currently having an Astarion Sorcerer run and at level 8 Astarion has two fireballs vs Gale's 1 fireball. Astarion can also carefully cast spells like flaming hands without hitting Gale but when Gale casts it he has to be super careful about allies being caught in the cone.

As a sorcerer Astarion is also able to maximize or extend his Magic Missiles so they hit harder or extend the range on them to hit enemies at longer distances, and Wyll just has insane damage and range on his Eldrich Lance at this point. So poor Gale kind feel a little weak at the moment, like Astarian and Wyll are just completely showing him up.

Originally posted by Mike Garrison:

3) Damage Tank -- Abjuration. Cast spells to buff yourself and allies and build up a shield of damage reduction.

That's a really cool idea that I would have never thought of, I'm really tempted to respec to try that but I don't want to lose my scribed spells.

Originally posted by Mike Garrison:

4) Multi-class with some other spellcaster type. One level of wizard means you can learn almost every spell in the game from scrolls. (But be aware they cast as INT if you learn them from a scroll.)

What's a good way to multiclass Gale? I was thinking of respeccing him and making him with a Intelligence/Dexterity or Strength build then leveling him up to level 4 for Evoker and the bonus feat then dual classing with a fighter or a rogue and going the Arcane Warrior or Trickster.

Gale sort of feels like he'd make a cool arcane warrior if he started with better stats for it, I can see him wearing Kelemvor's armor going around throwing fireballs and swinging his sword around. He'd still be completely outclassed by Astarion and Wyll but he'd be pretty bad ass.

You could go with Fighter 2 / Draconic Sorcerer Red Dragon Ancestry 10

that way you still have a strong magic user who is no longer squishy. And as sorcerer you can do the triple fireball on first round trick.

[👁]

Originally posted by アンジェル:

Originally posted by 👁:

So eventually Gale is going to be a guided chaingun that can out damage Wyll to shame about a dozen times per rest.

Sweet.



That was kind of my plan for Gale by default but I'm currently having an Astarion Sorcerer run and at level 8 Astarion has two fireballs vs Gale's 1 fireball. Astarion can also carefully cast spells like flaming hands without hitting Gale but when Gale casts it he has to be super careful about allies being caught in the cone.

As a sorcerer Astarion is also able to maximize or extend his Magic Missiles so they hit harder or extend the range on them to hit enemies at longer distances, and Wyll just has insane damage and range on his Eldrich Lance at this point. So poor Gale kind feel a little weak at the moment, like Astarian and Wyll are just completely showing him up.


That's a really cool idea that I would have never thought of, I'm really tempted to respec to try that but I don't want to lose my scribed spells.



What's a good way to multiclass Gale? I was thinking of respeccing him and making him with a Intelligence/Dexterity or Strength build then leveling him up to level 4 for Evoker and the bonus feat then dual classing with a fighter or a rogue and going the Arcane Warrior or Trickster.

Gale sort of feels like he'd make a cool arcane warrior if he started with better stats for it, I can see him wearing Kelemvor's armor going around throwing fireballs and swinging his sword around. He'd still be completely outclassed by Astarion and Wyll but he'd be pretty bad ass.

You could go with Fighter 2 / Draconic Sorcerer Red Dragon Ancestry 10

that way you still have a strong magic user who is no longer squishy. And as sorcerer you can do the triple fireball on first round trick.

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ that's insane I hadn't thought of that.

[Wet Water]

Wizards have easy access to utility spells at level one. Other than that they are pretty underwhelming. I'm sure they're power shines more at higher levels though.

[アンジェル]

Originally posted by 👁:

Originally posted by アンジェル:

You could go with Fighter 2 / Draconic Sorcerer Red Dragon Ancestry 10

that way you still have a strong magic user who is no longer squishy. And as sorcerer you can do the triple fireball on first round trick.

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ that's insane I hadn't thought of that.

See here section Artillery Tank for details
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3124459563
I was wondering if I had any problems with my Githyanki Wizard, but then it is a Githyanki who can wear armour thanks to her initial proficiencies.

Humans on the other hand... The best wizard is a pure level 12 wizard. That makes it so hard to see strong progress early on if you do not count scroll usages. And even if you do the question always remains: why should not someone else just use the scroll.

Equal popular builds as above

Storm Cleric 1 / Dragonic Sorcerer 11 - or Storm Cleric 2
That way you can fly each turn after casting a spell to reposition while also having heavy armour and shield proficiency making you like a tank caster

Fighter 2, Warlock 5, Paladin 5 - is weird but an alternative to an arcane fighter as the extra attacks from Warlock can stack with those from Paladin and Fighter while the Paladin has smite as extra damage which synergies greatly with Warlock's short rest spell slots. You can go all CHA/DEX too, as Pact of the Blade makes STR irrelevant for dealing damage close range - and due to the high CHA/DEX it is always a strong long range.