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being "open world" contributes nothing to the game flow, and the terrible empty mess that is NGS map design just detracts from it in a big way.
I like open world games, but PSO2 NGS is garbage tier. Kinda sad that NES and GameBoy games managed to do open world settings better.
I haven't seen this excuse for a few months. I wonder if the same excuse will be used in another 12 months.
I have always said that it's not even the lack of content I have much of an issue with, it's the content we do have that is the problem, it's rubbish.
Also, what is with NGS players constantly telling others to wait for the game to get good all of the time? If you're genuinely enjoying the game, then good for you, but constantly pushing this "things will get better" excuse just comes across like you're trying to convince yourself more than anybody else. Gaming is more accessible than ever before, why would anybody wait for a company to take years to catch up to modern video game standards when they can just go and play something they will enjoy? Who has the time and patience for that?
The only reason I stuck with the game as long as I did is because I have been a fan of the series for so long and had fun with PSO2, but players without that kind of attachment to the series aren't just going to stick with the game because some random person on the internet is telling them things will get better.
Not so easy now, is it?
You answered yourself below:
I've said this time and again, base PSO2 was dumpster until 2017, a whole half-decade later. If you don't like the game, just play something else like you said.
Any goober can bark up a tree, saying that "THE CONTENT IS RUBBISH!" and "THERE'S NOTHING UNIQUE ABOUT THE GAME!", but does anyone really realize just how hard it is to reinvent the wheel?
Like I said, if you can suggest new, innovative things that have truly never been done before, by all means, do so. We're just the consumers, not the developers. Begging for more than what we already get is nothing short of pettiness, and while it's nice that you're such a die-hard "fan" with PSO2, maybe show SEGA a little more support instead of being so negative.
As valid as some of your points are, when will this vicious cycle end? When is enough truly enough?
Why is it the consumer's problem to deal with the company's shortcomings? Sgea should be the ones to figure out how to "maket large amounts of content that would be fast and cheap to develop and implement, will be unique, and will please a large audience.", you are right that it isn't easy but that is Sega's problem, if they can't deal with it then it is on them.
I wasn't there for PSO2 when it was around but I really doubt that it was such as big of a dumpster fire if they were able to chug along for so long and even have collabs with so many others and apparently was such a big phenomenon that has even affected meatspace in a way as well. One thing that people seem to forget when using "But PSO2 was just as barren then" is that PSO2 was released in 2012 and NGS was released in 2021 and times change what people want and expect. Even games that are made as a sort of retro renaissance are still expected to have some form of quality of life that modern gaming provides.
And you know it is funny, when NGS was being announced in my mind what I wanted was to be like Xenoblade Chronicles X except with PSO2's action combat. Like a smaller company was able to nail that and not Sega. Of course I don't want them to just copy XCX but I was hoping for something like it. How is it that a game from 2015 was able to succeed where a game from 2021 failed? It is not even reinventing the wheel, it is failing to live up to past wheels and other wheels that came before it, Sega made a pyramid for a wheel and we should just accept it?
Also it is up to Sega to impress me, not the other way around, Sega is not entitled to my love or compassion, Sega is just a corporation whose main goal is to get money. I was a fan of PSO2 until I couldn't anymore and then I stopped. I would want to be able to play NGS like I played PSO2 but I am unsure if those times will come back but also that is Sega's problem, I have other games and other activities to do and I was able to live without PSO2 before and I will hope to continue to do so in the future.
It is really disturbing how people are willing to defend a corporation only cares for your wallet and nothing else.
mooooooooooooooooooooooooo
With how easy it is for games to get completely overshadowed in this day and age, putting out an incomplete product with live updates generally garners more attention than having people forget about your game(s) as a whole, unless the game is developed by Nintendo.
If NGS didn't release as early as it did, even with little content, and waited another 3+ years, people would probably be like "Oh yeah, that's a thing isn't it?", still plow through all the content in a week, and leave, because "Enough" is never enough. This is the fate of most MMOs.
Blocks were just as empty in PSO2JP back in 2012~2016(arguably moreso during Episode 5) as they are now. How did PSO2 survive? Because plenty of people were scratching, and NGS will survive the same way.
Just because NGS released almost a decade later doesn't exactly mean that it'd be starting off with everything PSO2 had and more. NGS was marketed as a new game after all, and development had only begun in Episode 6, meaning it only had a little over a year to bake in the oven, so to speak.
If you actually give it some thought, the only thing that Xenoblade Chronicles X really has over NGS are SKELLS, NPC affinity, and the node system. The game is still almost entirely comprised of a bunch of the same enemies sprinkled throughout numerous areas in the world.
The same systems are generally in ploy, such as day-night and weather cycles affecting enemy spawns, one-time NPC quests, the same half-baked story. So really, where is the argument? This is coming from someone who enjoyed the heck out of XBCX, and killed every tyrant and did every quest, heck, buying a Wii U solely for MH3U and XBCX?
Let's not lie to ourselves and say that XBCX did anything revolutionary, it was just the high production value that made it stand head and shoulders above its(lack of)peers. There wasn't really a basis for comparison, actually, since there are very few open world Sci-Fi games to begin with.
Having admitted to the fact that you weren't around for PSO2JP's early years, it's easy to understand why you and many others don't find joy in NGS. I can guarantee if you and those same people weren't force-fed all 6 episodes worth of content in a year, and actually played PSO2JP as early as I and many others have, you'd also quit, because PSO2 was just as trash as NGS was during its first year.
You can only take series veteran's words for it, because nothing short of a time machine will ever let you experience that mess. As I said earlier in the post, the game survived because of people whaling on scratches, and that will not change in NGS. You wouldn't even be able to say "No, I wouldn't quit!", because again, you did not experience that wasteland of a release.
What did you do everyday on Base PSO2 for the first several years? Chroto's Time Attack Client Orders on Very Hard and Hard, and eventually 5 extreme quests every single day, for years in a row. Nothing else. Maybe a couple emergency quests here and there.
If you can let go of PSO2/NGS the way you did, and stay off of it, congratulations, you're smarter than idiots like me that continue to chip away at the game slowly, every single day, for years.
Your landlord doesn't care for your opinion, only your money.
Your electric, gas, and water companies don't care for your complaints, only your money.
Way to state the obvious, Sega is a corporation, of course they mostly just care for the consumer's money.
I can agree with some of your statements, but a lot of this is just clashing opinions from a series entrant, and a series veteran.
Why can't we demand more again? Either they give what the people want or we don't give them money, that is how it works, that is how capitalism works. Why are we supposed to give Sega a free pass and understanding when they are failing to live up to their end of the bargain?
Also it is funny that you say that somehow NGS must be released now or otherwise it would be foreshadowed by everything else when history shows that the opposite is what would have happened, people loved PSO2 when it was released in 2020 you can argue the whole being force fed so much stuff but we weren't given everything in one go either. I feel that the most powerful thing is the first impression and I feel that had NGS would be better off had Sega held off until they had more stuff to show than try to claim ground as it were while being so incomplete. NGS had a starting population of 60K and lost the great majority over several months and out of those that they lost they will probably never come back because they already had a bad first impression. You can argue that Sega only had so much time to figure it out but I feel that they had years to figure it out but they were complacent, you seem to think that Sega must somehow develop Game Theory from scratch with every game like if they somehow had to figure out Sonic 2 without even looking at Sonic 1.
Again if PSO2 was this big dumpster fire I really doubt that it would have had this much impact in Japanese culture or at the very least they wouldn't have so many collaborations with other companies especially considering that Sega has been known to kill games quite quick when under performing (not as fast or as blatant as Squeenix or EA but still there). Also it kinda feels that you have a "back in my day" attitude which is off putting and it feels that you might be operating under some form of sunk cost fallacy where you are so invested that you are willing to forgive anything because you are so deep in it, I think we might call that Stockholm Syndrome.
And yes of course that companies are in it to make money, that isn't the point. The point is that you seem to want us to put up or shut up and to give Sega infinite chances and our wallets because it is hard to make a video game guys and while that is true that is what Sega are in the business to do. Again my point with XBCX is that you seem to think that we want the next best thing that will blow our minds when I am saying that Sega can't even get over the bar that was set by others and even themselves years ago. I did not want NGS to be XBCX2 but I was hoping that I could look at NGS and see it as a better XBCX and while XBCX wasn't the biggest thing ever to blow our minds it was still a good game and sometimes that is all you need, even at the beginning parts of the game XBCX was better than NGS and that isn't a good thing for Sega.
Again maybe this was fine and dandy in 2012 but it will not muster in 2021 and you can write me off as a malcontent but the numbers and complaints don't lie and there must be something going on because Sega are reacting to something.
In essence, I am not in it to love Sega and neither should you.
Clearly you are missing the point.
First of all Developing "fast and cheap" content is what they do the whole time and you see where this is going. And the 6 month updates are also pretty "cheap" despite not being fast. I am not even going into the fact that the regions are mostly done since release they just add fluff for 6 months and add in content based on data they collected te past 6 months thats all.
The point is we want "Quality" which this game desperately needs in any shape or form possible.
Also we can demand thing all we want we " ARE THE CONSUMER ". Also its not like we demand extremely ridiculous things. We demand the basic stuff and people like you make it seem like we demand world peace from Sega. Whats wrong with you people ?
You ever realize that "more content" is a very vague thing? "More content" can mean a variety of things, which, technically, SEGA DOES successfully meet.
When people say "WE WANT MORE CONTENT", they really mean "WE WANT THE ENTIRE GAME'S DEVELOPMENT, AND THEN SOME". There is no satisfying irate people.
Let me give you an example: Elden Ring is a highly successful game, completed from day 1(albeit some minor bugs), and yet, plenty of Elden Ring players demand more content. You see what i'm getting at here? People won't be satisfied no matter what you do.
Because that's how every MMO is.
- A good example being New World. 1 million players in the first week, and what is it at now? Roughly 15,000 or so a day.
- Cosmic Break Universal started with several thousands, and has now been reduced to 100-300 daily.
- Soul Worker started with around ten thousand and has been left with around three thousand a day.
- Lost Ark started with over 1 million players, and while it's still well above 500k players, a large chunk of them are just gold bot accounts.
This is how MMO populations work, it is not an issue unique to PSO2, and while all the games listed above have servers only on Steam, NGS does not account for Xbox, Microsoft Store, or JP players. What you see here is only a portion of the total population.
- Games that aren't doing well can still do collaborations(not that PSO2 was doing bad to begin with)
- Of course I have the "back in my day" attitude, because all of the global-only players are ridiculously hard to please.
- Sunk cost fallacy has never been an issue for me. I drop gacha games and MMOs i've spent thousands on, and spent hundreds of hours on like nothing.
Maybe it's Stockholm Syndrome, but NGS is nowhere near as bad as half the MMOs on the market right now. In fact, it's doing far better than most of them.
This part is all opinion, but I don't particularly disagree with you on this end.
The numbers and complaints are typical fare for any MMO, and has been prevalent in pso2 since its beginning, unfortunately. Shame SEGA doesn't really learn-- or rather, it's more Episode 5's director that's running NGS into the ground.
I don't love SEGA, I just love PSO2. If I didn't love PSO2, I wouldn't have stuck to it for a decade. PSO2 at its roots is a genuinely fun game, just marred by certain dodgy choices.
I figured you'd show up. You always do. I was going to call you out, but seems I didn't have to bwahahaha.
But that means SEGA is listening, no? They are listening to general player demands that are reasonably achievable. They put out some content, they listen to the players, and do stuff around the majority's voice.
Were you around to witness the terrible updates in base pso2? The fact that we got nothing but scratches and seasonals? It's the same thing, and I say this every time.
Define "Quality", and it can't be any broad reasons like "oh, leveling faster". Clear, concise reasons only.
The way half the people demand stuff? You'd be hard-pressed to believe they aren't demanding world peace.
What most people were hoping to see is a game made with love instead of the Monstrosity we have currently.
- Better Story is subjective, as not everyone plays for story, though NGS story definitely is lackluster.
- "Events" can be whatever. Be it log on for 30~300 minutes, kill a special boss, collecting a special item, etc. These events are as complete as any other MMO event quest.
- I don't get what you mean by hitching on your own. That's not clear, concise, or an explanation.
- The engine is working, there are very little bugs if you're playing the game normally and not actively trying to find any.
- What list? You aren't making anything clear.
Passion projects aren't really made when it comes to big game industries. You're far more likely to find passion projects in indie games with small teams.