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Cities: Skylines >  Workshop > algernon's Workshop > Realistic Population 2 2.2.4 > Discussions
Realistic Population 2 2.2.4
Description Discussions44 Comments2440 Change Notes
dauh4 Jul 17, 2021 @ 7:55am
Passengers are no longer able to board
Hi there. i am experiencing a bug where a random amount of vehicles (buses/trains/trams) ranging from 30% to 100% cannot take on passengers. after letting the simulation run for 1 hour removing all vehicles with TM:PE not a single passenger will be able to board anymore.

it is somehow affecting my save file. unsubscribing to the mod didnt fix it
this bug does not seem happen with Realistic Population 2 PUBLIC BETA

any idea what the reason could be?

here is a list of the mods i use:
81 Tiles; Advanced Stop Selection; Advanced Vehicle Options; Auto Line Color; CSL SHow more Limits; Elevated Stops Enabler; Enhances Outside Connections View; Extended BUilding Info; Harmony 2.0.4.4; Infinite Goods; Extra Train Station Tracks; Klytes Fine Road ANarchy 2.0.4; Klytes Fine Road Tool 2.0.4; Move It 2.9.2; Network Extensions2; Optimise Outside Connections; RICO by AJ3D (original RICO); Quay Anarchy; Remove Need For Pipes; TM:PE 11.5.2 Stable; Zoom It!; FPS Display; Cloud & Fog Toggler
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Showing 1-12 of 12 comments
algernon  [developer] Jul 17, 2021 @ 6:55pm 
If unsubscribing to the mod doesn't fix it, then it's not related to the mod at all. Furthermore, there is no code in this mod that affects public transport at all (you can see for yourself at GitHub).

There are a number of mods in your list there that *do* affect public transport, so those would be the place to look (I don't have any idea which one specifically, sorry. That being said, your list does include a couple of outdated and buggy mods, so it's also possible there's a more fundamental issue there.
#1
dauh4 Jul 19, 2021 @ 3:14pm 
ok, so it isnt directly a problem with the mod. BUT!

the problem is that because of the high amount of living space given by this mod, the limit of citizen units can be reached very quickly.
Also there are now citizen units in my city that will keep existing even after i removed all buildings. meaning i now have a tangible amount of citizen instances (100000 or 20% of the maximum) that can no longer hold any citizens

And for some reason, when the citizen limit is reached, all further passenger vehicles (also including cars) get bugged out and can no longer take on passenger.

image: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2551980278
Last edited by dauh4; Jul 19, 2021 @ 4:04pm
#2
algernon  [developer] Jul 19, 2021 @ 5:12pm 
That would make sense - once the CitizenUnit limit is reached, then yes, that would affect transport.

Note that CitizenUnits (not to be confused with citizen instances, which is a different thing) aren't just used in buildings - as you've discovered, the game uses a decent chunk of them for transport, tourists, temporary citizen instances, etc.

For a given population you'll typically be using fewer CitizenUnits with this mod than without, as this mod's default settings mean more efficient allocation of CitizenUnits for workplaces; but as with any game limit, once you hit that limit, that's it.

It's a bit annoying that the game doesn't give explicit warning of hitting the CitizenUnit limit and instead just 'fails quietly' in the background, slowly stuffing up your city.... but then again, the game was never really properly designed to handle cities with populations above a few hundred thousand citizens anyway.
Last edited by algernon; Jul 19, 2021 @ 5:13pm
#3
dauh4 Jul 19, 2021 @ 7:31pm 
Could the changes that the mod makes somehow generate all those "ghost citizen units"?
Phantom lane remover (which now can also detect phantom citizen units) also cant detect them.

The ghost citizen units happen with both this mod and the "realistic population 2 BETA" i think
i have read through the 1.x version on github and havent found any obvious thing that could cause this situations (since nothing is addressed directly, and all objects that are created should be discardet safely at the end), but i have never created a mod for cities skylines.

unless there is some service/sub service that have problems
Last edited by dauh4; Jul 19, 2021 @ 7:41pm
#4
algernon  [developer] Jul 19, 2021 @ 8:01pm 
The mod doesn't do anything with the game's CitizenUnit allocations; all it does is report the workforce/homecount to create CitizenUnits for each building (the game then creates them exactly the same way as without the mod). So it seems very unlikely that the mod would be responsible for that.

To work out where the CitizenUnits are being used, you'd need to step through with ModTools to see what flags are being assinged. If you post your savegame, I could have a look myself.
#5
dauh4 Jul 20, 2021 @ 1:39pm 
ok. so it looks like there are a bunch of citizen units that dont have a building and dont have any citizens. still no clue where they came from.

here a picture and the map (where i already have removed all buildings, so only broken citizen units should be left over)

also it looks like some of the "next item" variables are not set in the broken citizen units

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2552763085
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2552758676

looks like i now will have to learn how to mod for cities skylines
Last edited by dauh4; Jul 20, 2021 @ 3:31pm
#6
algernon  [developer] Jul 20, 2021 @ 4:51pm 
Thanks for that - I'm definitely seeing valid 'in-use' flags there. What happens if you load the original city *without* the mod active, and then delete the buildings? Are those phantom units still there?

I wonder if this is another base-game bug similar to the one I had to fix with Lifecycle Rebalance Revisited.
#7
dauh4 Jul 20, 2021 @ 5:08pm 
when i load the game with only 81 tiles, load screen mod, and network extensions and then delete all buildings the number will be the same.

But even though it has a valid flag, dont all citizen units need a valid building, even when they are used for something else?

only question then is who owns the seagulls?

i couldn't even figure out how to access the CitizenManager from within the console so
Last edited by dauh4; Jul 20, 2021 @ 5:10pm
#8
algernon  [developer] Jul 20, 2021 @ 6:18pm 
Okay, that seems to confirm my suspicions that it's a base-game issue, then. CitizenUnits don't need a valid building if they're not attached to one (e.g. tourists, emergency worker instances, animals, etc.), so that's fine. Likewise, 'next unit' really only has validity within a building (it links to the next unit in that building - a linked list - with 0 being the list termination marker).

In this cse it looks as though units aren't being properly released when buildings are destroyed; I'll have to look through the game code later to try to work out what the circumstances might be that lead to that.
#9
dauh4 Jul 20, 2021 @ 7:05pm 
i have been probing the game for an hour now using the debug console to figure out if there are maybe some methods that can reveal if a citizenUnit is broken or not or if it is referenced from anywhere.
sadly no luck

something like trying to simply release all units doesnt work lol
if(true){
CitizenManager mngr = ((CitizenManager)GameObject.FindObjectsOfType(typeof(CitizenManager))[0]);
int arraySize = mngr.m_units.m_buffer.Length;
for (int i = 0; i < arraySize; i++)
{
mngr.ReleaseUnits(Convert.ToUInt32(i));
}
}
#10
algernon  [developer] Jul 20, 2021 @ 9:14pm 
Use the CS Singleton reference to access the CitizenManager, rather than the GameObject. That might be the issue there.
#11
dauh4 Jul 21, 2021 @ 6:28am 
that sadly didnt fix it, also both object both via gameObject and Singleton are the same

for some reason its throwing an index out of range before being at the end of the list

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2553305537

also second i will have to check if a vehicle or citizen simulation is currently using it, else it crashes the simulation
Last edited by dauh4; Jul 21, 2021 @ 6:36am
#12
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