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However, this might be just me. I don't know how the others may see it.
Bite:
Similar to the Leper. Honestly, got no problems with it as far as balance. She basically occupies the same slot as one, too, so I'm fine with it.
Hammer:
A bit on the strong side, but without healing/mitigation, the downsides of it are pretty damning. At one point while spamming it, I ended up with 24 bleed/turn. But that's what items and companions are for, right? Dealing with this sort of thing.
Contagion:
I like the idea of it, but boy does that stress make me not want to use it.
Purify:
The self-damage stacks up quickly enough to make over-using it not worth risking a death, so I find it more or less fine.
Overall, the balance right now could use a bit of work, but I like where it's headed.
My biggest problem with it right now is that it doesn't have any sets of skills that work in tandem. Usually when you put together a skillset, you want four abilities that can be used either in slot 3/4 or 1/2. Maybe I'm just not understanding how you're meant to set her up, but the skills just don't seem to work well with each other. Maybe they could use some more self-movement or something, idk.
To follow what Proboscis proposed, maybe give another skill the possibility to move forward. Assault feels... unnecesary, as it is. She has no ways of pushing herself back to rank 3, so why would she need a skill to move forward? That being said, it all depends on what you pictured her to be. A frontline fighter and a assitant in the backline? A movile unit that switches around as it fights?
As of now, I see her as a backline marker with a finisher and utility, or as a frontilne heavy-hitter that buffs her final move. Assault is there probably as a bridge between the starting backline phase and the purify finisher phase.
On another note, I don't really see the sense in her penalty being a bleed. I mean, when does she cut herself? Since there's steam, maybe a burn (but such thing does not exists as a dot). Or just hp damage. I like how the steam reduces the allies' ACC, btw.
I get you, though. This mod looks so good it makes you believe it can't be a beta, so it's frustrating not finding a description of her. It'll get there, in time.
a)enemy front row damage/mark is way worse than back row, right? So for Exodia why not have it mark? (I'd take two entire turns ec. \two to four stress attacks\ to, IF the knockback hits, mark anthing you actually WANT to focus on(move works on almost no boss) and you don't want to kill something that is still stunned....
b) you know there are better solutions to killing the spider encounter(wo taking damage) then purify(which requires you not to use hammer in other encounters) and for most other strategies there are way better damage options for the third enemy position, it doesnt even reach the forth( I know it looks overtuned against some of the vanilla ones but most vanilla classes with aoe can reably damage the forth position in some way, sooooooooo...)
c)assault.... why is ok damage+knockback on a move skill ( that gets used, like, once per encounter) a problem, when all vanilla ones are decent to good as hell(lunge, dueslists advance, holy lance) i just don't get this one
d) contagion makes literally no sense, how does more stress help you take something this unviable? if you get desperate enough wo having used all your cures i don't understand how. This is properbly the one which needs a rework the direst.
I don't mean anything by it, im just bad at formulating myself ;)
I just wanted to ask before I give my two cents about the how, since this discussion seemed more or less headed by you
Though maybe lemme just put this one on,
Contagion:
why does it need to heal so much and do so much damage? maybe tiny heal for bad debuff( like damage+accuracy [or even max health on self till camp :P] ), heal all enemies and self or single target 'life steal' from teammate, since the drowners 'low' hp for frontline + self damage makes them the one most likely do hit deaths door in the first place (....or just make something different entirely like a back move something?)
p.s. maybe some of your ideas were already applied when I tested it?
I think I sound mean condecending and I'm sorry for that
About Exodia... it-it doesn't mark? It sais it does in the description. Maybe it was I who misunderstood (I haven't tested this skill much, tbh). I don't get what you mean with this one. Can you clarify?
Purify was a true aoe before, but since the damage could be excellent for an aoe, the forth position was put out of reach so its power made more sense. It was like if Leper got an aoe that could be buffed. The thing about aoe is that there's not aoe for damage. There's aoe for dots, debuffs or shuffles. And all of them were weak. This one was pure damage. Now it's similar to Hellion's breakthrough with hp loss and a risk if abused.
Assault was stronger before (just a bit). The only problem that comes to mind is that since there's no way the drowner can push herself back, it becomes harder to use this skill if you started in the front. The only utility I can make out of it is transitioning from backline marker to purify finisher. I'm not sure if this answered you.
Contagion is probably the most bugged one of the bunch. The first time I used it, I took 32 stress to everyone, 6 over 2 blight (no bleed yet, although it was meant to bleed) and crazy good healing. It's been softened since then (now it's only 8 stress), but the heals are still great for a relatively cheap party heal. Compare it with vestal's. At level one, it heals 1-2(-3?). This one heals 6 but pings 8. The initial ping is hard to avoid, so it's a party heal of 2. From them on, you want to cure with a plague doctor or a lamia to avoid further damage.
I guess I was fine with it because it was hyper-bugged before and I watch some crazy numbers on my screen (I'm talking about heals that reach 24!). I agree that it could be beneficial to rework this one, and since hammer started a new trend of debuffing companions, why not following your suggestion? Low party heal, no dots (or stress? maybe smaller stress), and instead, a debuff. That would open new doors. And now that we're talking about reworking it, maybe restrict its usage on position 3 and 4 instead of 3 and 2. That way there's a better use for her at the rear and more potential for assault to transition to an aggresion phase.
Idk. I didn't want to get wild with suggestions mostly because this isn't my mod, and I didn't want to get too pushy. The creator is the one who decides in the end, and it wouldn't be good to blindly do as some of us say. For example, we may theorycraft as we please about Contagion, but in the end, it's up to the creator.
And don't worry. I didn't feel you were mean. Besides, it's good that somebody questions what I say about balance. That way it is a contrasted opinion and the results obtained from this discussion become better. So fire as you please!
(About team comp, I mostly take a healer besides her, a stress healer and another frontline fighter. She's usually in pos 1 for hammer. I haven't invested much in strategy. More often than not, I have gone into a quest just to test contagion in order to see if it is still as bugged as ever. I even suspected it may be as bad as it is because of the location the stress and other icons appear at. Haven't checked though)
I didn't wanna be pushy either (if you can hear me, anaertailin) just throwing stuff out which I wagure would lend itself to her overall strategy wo hurting the conceptual Idea behind whats happening (overall i'm superstoked about the general design as frontline is the position which really needs extra love in my eyes)
I seem to use more stun and guard/riposte in the rest of my team with her, rather than damage (and spongeing stress more than direct healing it, tho i used the houndmaster for some mark team comps)
Also, i meant exodia doesnt mark back row effectively, and front row normally doesnt need mark, either because you want to kill back row first (and mark's for killing) or because for bosses you want the dodge/prot debuff from the vanilla ones + she'd be free to deal damage
and i get the cure by plague doctor for contagion, but for me drowner dies before anyone else unless i guard anyways so i just don't understand when you'd equip it instead of literally anything else beforehand
some of it just didn't make sense, because: 4 am
I don't quite get what I meant with assault either, though i think it's quite fine and essential for marking teams,
but thanks for being so understanding anyway :D
About Purify:
The skill is overpowered in the crimson court (maybe other places too, havent tested enough). I easily managed to climb all the way to 400% extra dmg, leading to a literal 100 dmg hit on an enemy without critting, which could be abused to 1shot the bosses. The penalty for using it needs to be more profound, or perhaps it could be changed to scale worse, or perhaps you could make it so the damage buffs lose a bit of potency every battle, or round, or something, so it doesnt stack infinitely.
Overall, I feel the drowner is a little too strong atm. Regardless, BEAUTIFUL class, and looking forward to see it develop. :)
You can also balance it like the jester and make it where you can get alot of damage but its some what hard caps at round seven i feel like its not as unique but in my opinion at least it will feel better to use also 2-3 use hammer would be an easy balance btw
Edit: i think shes very fun now that ive used her alot, also she almost one shot my team when the siren mind controlled her 10/10 would take 35 damage again (to all 3 heros btw)
Her base Damage is very high
Her Accuracy is decent
Her HP is average
Her Speed is nearly the highest in the game (Speed is one of the best stats)
Her Dodge is good
Bite skill has positive dmg modifier
Assault gives her an answer to shuffle
Exodia gives her a reliable stun
Bombard gives her mark synergy
Hammer has armor piercing aganist prot
Contagian is balanced (A lil on the weak end imo)
Purify is a massive AOE nuke that scales with dungeon length
The problem isnt really just one skill I think, she's too good at everything. If you nerfed her HP for example, purifys self harm dmg would be a lot scarier. If you nerfed her speed, then she wouldnt be able to open with purify for every hard fight, insta killing the enemies before they have a chance to retaliate. Even something as simple as nerfing her stun chance could go a long way in improving her balance. My advice at the moment: Choose what she should be good at (Big dmg dealer, tanky fronline stunner and supporter, or a hyper late game scaling threat, etc), and nerf everything else.
Picking up Chocolates idea, what if you made purify really strong, but gave it a 1 time use per Dungeon? :o I dont know if thats possible to code, but it sounds cool. Or yeah, you could put a hard cap on how strong purify can get, so it doesnt scale to infinity. Anyways, best of luck.
This is...awkward to try to explain, but another thing that could be done to reduce her jack of all trades-ness is that after using abilities that fill a certain role in her kit (such as moving/healing/stunning/etc, etc), she would debuff all other abilities that fill another role.
For example, whenever you'd use her stun, the healing she does would go down by a certain percentage for 3 rounds. Whenever you'd use her answer to shuffle, her healing done and stun chance would go down by a certain percentage for 2 rounds.
That would basically allow you to balance out her utility/stun/healing/etc abilities independently without worrying as much about the other ones, plus it would force the player to think ahead about what he will do. Will he stun now at the price of not being able to heal with her later if someone reaches death's door? Now that's just the wet dream of all game devs, Completely unrealistic. More seriously, it would just make her less good at filling multiple roles at the same time in a single battle. The main issue with that is that it sort of discourages bringing multiple of them along at the same time since the player will only use one per battle, or two for longer battles, thus reducing her complexity and reducing the synergy between her abilities.
I will be honest, I haven't even played the class and I've just had a really bad hazy day and it's really late so while I know it's stupid to post this without having even played the class I'll do it anyways. It was nice to think about it and try to find a solution though, I must admit. Even though it'll get nowhere. Anyways, have a golden day/night !