Overpowered weapons, and how to counter them! (Outdated)

Too often do people complain about the minisentry and other weapons being blatantly overpowered, crutches, and generally poorly balanced weapons. They'll whine, and cry, and bastardize anyone who uses these weapons, and while I do it too, I found it astonishing how little people actually think about how to DEAL with said weapons. They simply complain to VALVe until the weapon is rebalanced. So here and now, I'm going to despense my best knowledge on how to actually deal with OP weapons instead of just pulling the plug every time you see a pomson.

Disclaimer

Yo, listen to me up in here if you'd be so kind. The weapons listed are what most of the people I encounter think are overpowered or crutch weapons. I'll drop a little bit of opinion in here, but if you vehemently disagree with the contents of this list, I'm sorry. :(

The Baby Face's Blaster

Ah yes, in my expirience, the only comonly complained about Scout weapon. In my oppinion, it's by no means a crutch. It takes everything difficult about scout, and makes it harder. Clip management, too much speed, and getting into the habbit of jumping to avoid damage. However, this weapon, I'll concede, is overpowered. In a prolonged scout vs scout battle, most scouts don't reload past four before shooting again anyway, so the clip doesn't matter. The speed give you a distinct advantage, and in an actual fight, you can weave in and out of the frey at will with little to no consequence, making the clip even more negligible.

But we're not here to complain about it, oh no. We're going to learn how to deal with it. First of all, if you're an explosive class, highground. Oh my god get above him. The speed will make him able to dodge so much that the "lack" of a second jump won't matter, but if you get above him with a nice rocket, or a sticky bomb, jumping will probably be his only salvation. If he doesn't do that, well he's dead anyway. Remember that making him jump isn't check mate. All he needs is a single pistol shot to be back up to full speed, and he can double jump three times before being back to roughly scout speed. Keeping the highground even as a non explosive class is still important. You don't want to be on even ground with that ♥♥♥♥♥♥. Most scouts keep their sensitivity very low, so running circles around him might help, or running straight past him and turning around. If you're a scout, take advantage of your double jump, and get over his head constantly to keep him turning around. Remember that because his speed is so assinine, you might have to aim a VERY SLIGHT bit behind his character model, because his hitbox gets desynchronized at that kind of speed. The only real downside to the BFB that's noticible is the clip. Against scouts and soldiers, it's important to keep track of their clip size, and it's VITAL with the BFB. If you think he's low on clip, you can ease up on your furious dodging to line up a good shot on him. One last thing: Stay with a group. The BFB is the ultimate deathmatch weapon (hyperbole), but when trying to attack a crowd, he'll have trouble with such limited clip.

The Black Box

Dear god I hate this thing. It's not so much overpowered. Oh no. In the hands of two equally skilled soldiers, a stock soldier would probably fare much better than a blackbox soldier. That last rocket that does 100 damge at most will outdamage the 45 healing that a whole clip from the blackbox will dispense, but the problem I and most other people have with it is that it's a crutch. In the hands of two equally unskilled soldiers, the black box will always win out. It creates bad habits and holds your hand, generally making poor soldiers.

So how do we ♥♥♥♥ up those scrubs? Well, we have to take advantage of it's weaknesses. For one thing, it has a reduced clip, meaning that it gives him much less mobility when rocket jumping. That, or once he does rocket jump up to you, he'll be out of rockets. If you can bait him to rocket jump at you, you'll be at a huge advantage. Also, much like the BFB, keep track of the clip. Most black box soldiers will shoot as soon as they get one rocket in the clip, not knowing or remembering that the first reload in a clip is always the slowest. This also puts you at a huge advantage. If you can dodge the first three, he's usually screwed. Try to get him out in the open, and don't try to swarm him. The black box will heal 15 health for every enemy hit, which means the more people you throw at a black box soldier, the more health he'll have. Most importantly of all though, take note of his secondary weapon. This is something even I usually fail to do, but it's so useful. Does he have a backpack, even a concheror? He's completely done for if you can get him to low clip. Does he have some sort of boots on? They're probably gunboats. Be prepared to chase him. He is fully prepared to book it with that extra mobility. No backpack and no boots? He has a shotgun. This is probably the most dangerous, but it's also a good thing. He'll be tempted to take it out as soon as he's out of clip, which can sometimes help, since the shotgun is easier to dodge at close ranges and doesn't heal him.

Axtinguisher, Degreaser, and Reserve Shooter

As a pyro main, I have nothing but disdain for people who use the reserve shooter with the degreaser. The two when seperated are iffy, but together it's just plain ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥; and I've always hated the axtinguisher, even before and even after the nerf. So here's what we do. Are they using an axtinguisher? They're obviously bad at pyro. Spam rockets. None of them are going to come back to you. Reserve shooter? Run. There is no god. Degreaser without the reserve shooter? Eh, every other pyro you've ever encountered has been using that thing, so you know, you're probably used to it.

No, but in all seriousness, guys, I don't know. :/ There's no really effective counter to these things. I would know, as previously stated, I main pyro. The only really helpful thing is sticking with your team. The pyro's main job was supposed to be crowd control, but that's not happening with the D-greaser, RS, and axting, so sticking with a small group helps mitigate the pyro's single target damage ability. Other than that, I don't really know, I'm sorry. :( I could tell you to keep your distance, maintain the lower ground, ect., but you probably know all of that.

It's becoming evident that not many people understand the low ground thing. Essentially, it makes it so you stay in the air way less time if you get airblasted, allowing you to land and dodge crit flares if you're lucky, or not get mini crit by the reserve shooter. If you're a soldier though, the high ground makes it harder for the pyro to reflect the rockets back at you.

The Phlog

Unlike most people, I actually don't have so much of a problem with this thing. I suppose the idea that it's OP comes from the idea that it takes very little skill and has a huge reward, but in my experiences, it takes a lot of subtlety, positioning, and strategy. At any rate, here's how to deal with it.

Okay, so you see this thing coming at you with crits, and he's probably fully healed. Do NOT panic. This is avoidable. Are you a scout? Book it. You run 33% faster than him. Unless he sneaks up on you, he's not touching you with that thing until the crits wear out. After that, just run circles around him so the flames don't touch you, or just stay barely outside his range. Soldier? Spam rockets at him to mock him for not having any airblast, but keep one in your clip just incase he gets too close, and you need to rocket jump away. Pyro? Backpedal while flaming. Your flames will stretch out while his flames curve back as he W+M1s you. Your flames will hit him first, and even when his do hit you, you'll do more damage than his...except for the crits. That or just run. You have the same speed. Unless he's aleady up to you by the time you turn to run, you should be fine. Demoman? Place stickies by his feet while he taunts, and blow them up AFTER HE'S DONE TAUNTING. He takes 90% less damage while activating the crits. If he's already coming after you, spam stickies on the floor and backpedal. Throw pipes too if he gets to close. If you have a shield just charge away. Heavy? No worries! Your minigun STILL outdamages his crit fire. That's right. If you've been firing for at least a second, and the enemy is right infront of you, you do about 500 dps. The phlog does 300 dps while crit charged. Hell, the NATASCHA does 300 dps and slows the pyro down. Engineer's buildings don't take crit damage, so just hop behind your sentry. Running minis? Throw them down as you run as cannon fodder. Medic? Get behind someone big and scary. Sniper? You should be far away anyway. Spy? You should be behind enemy lines anyway, but you can always cloak just incase.

Sticky Spamming

I've been wracking my brain on this one for so long. This is all I've got.

Are you in mid range? Yes? Fix that.
How do you fix it? Would it take longer to get up close, or longer to get far away? Do whichever you answered.
You can't, because you're a heavy, or an engineer or something? Take cover.
Take the highground, although it won't help that much. Either disengage and take him by surprise, or get close and engage in direct combat. That grey area is the demoman's kingdom, and you're not taking it from him.

The Pomson

I never had a huge problem with this thing either, to be honest, but here we go.

The Pomson 6000 does 60 damage on a point blank shot, which is 30 less than a shotgun. Since it has better ranged damage, but it becomes easier to dodge at longer range, your range to keep is up to your discretion. If I were you though, I'd base it off my class. Fast class but low health like scout? Stay away. Slow class but hard to kill like soldier and heavy? Get right up in his face and bully him about it. It also has a reduced clip, meaning that you can out DM the engineer if you have a normal shotgun. I think that people's main problem with it is it's cloak and uber draining powers. As a medic, stay behind your pocket. The Pomson, unlike the soldier's space shotgun, does NOT penetrate targets. Meaning that if your heavy gets hit with the beam, you can rest easy knowing that beam isn't going to hit you too. Take cover too. Unless you're runing quix or vacc, 10 uber is obnoxious. As for the spies, unless he's near his sentry, shoot him to death. You have a gun. Don't take that ♥♥♥♥ from him. Trickstab him. If he won't leave his sentry, just leave. He'll let his guard down eventually. He's an engie. Pretty much every engie I've ever met has terrible A.D.D. and will want to move something to a better spot, or will want to go build a teleporter to somewhere stupid after a while.

The Mini Sentry

Oh god, finally. The moment you've all been waiting for. Even I hate this thing, and I tend to be very sparing with my hatred of weapons compared to most people. Here's the thing though, it's not going away. It's just too important to the engineer's mechanics to be nerfed much beyond a slightly bigger hitbox or something, and they'd NEVER take it out. It has its reasons for existing, and it fills them well.

What do you do then? Well something I've noticed that lets a lot of engineers get away with this crap is complacency. The Engineer is a big pick in pubs, guys. ESPECIALLY if he's running minisentries. He's never taken as seriously as he should be, and that lets him stay alive spamming mini sentries all day. He's almost as important to kill as a medic. Do NOT let this guy see the light of day. You hunt him down. You hold tab and remember his ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ name to see if he's alive or not. You ruin this guy's day. As a scout, find a blindspot to sneak up on it, and then jump down and two shot it. Meatshots SHOULD kill it instantly, but they don't because of how small the hitbox is. If you have a pistol, more power to you. Pick it off from outside it's range. Engineer buildings don't take less damage over distance like players do, so you can pretty much fourshot this P.O.S with a pistol. As a soldier, you can two shot these things with ease. You as a powerclass have a JOB to always make sure that it's down. The same goes for demoman and heavy. Also as heavy, don't try to take it out from a distance unless you're out of its range. You do so little damage at a far range that it'll actually manage to kill you if you don't get close. As a pyro, it takes four shots with a flaregun to take it out. You're better off flaming it down and going for a health pack. They'll prove to be pretty annoying for you. Almost as much so as scout or rocket jumper soldier or demoknight. Snipers and spies are practically BUILD for taking these things down. You can easily oneshot minisentries with a huntsman, and you can oneshot them with a sniper rifle if you charge up a little. Always take out the engineer first though. His death is imperative. As a spy, you can use the red tape recorder to make it take longer to destroy, so the engie has to wait longer to build a new one, or just knock off the sapper. Really, your job as spy is to hunt the engineer like a wild animal. The mini sentries are second priority. One last thing...watch out for the engineer himself. For whatever reason, I've seen engineers with better shotgun skills than Platinum Level Scouts. It's terrifying.

Dead Ringer

Last one. Last "weapon". This thing is less overpowered and more crutched upon. It's basically a get out of jail free card that can be spammed. Well we're going to tear that card in half and shove it up the spy's skinny ass.

So how do we know if it was a dead ringer? Well, as a scout, if you hit someone with the unarmed combat or the holy mackerel, the killfeed will say how many times you've hit them. If you kill them with it, the killfeed will then say that you've killed them. If you kill a spy who doesn't REALLY die with the fish or the arm, it'll say in the killfeed how many times you've hit the spy instead of that you killed them with the fish or the arm. If you kill them with a powerjack and don't gain health, he's still alive, and if you kill him with a candy cane equipped and there's no healthpack, he's alive, and if you kill him with the demoman and soldier's Katana but you don't get the health, he's still alive, but you'll still be able to swtich weapons. Pick up his dropped weapon. If it doesn't give you ammo, then it's fake, and he's still out there with his real weapon! Also, the dead ringer doesn't get rid of mad milk or jarate. If you see a puff of smoke, that means that the spy disguised at the same time as he used his dead ringer, which means he's still out there. If you have hitsounds enabled, and you kill an undisguised spy, but no hitsound played, he's still alive. Fire helps track him down unless he also has a spycicle, and even then there's still a slight noise when you're burning him without doing damage. Don't bother spraying and praying. He'll take so little damage, and his cloak won't flicker. My advice would be listen carefully, and run to the nearest health and ammo pack. That's probably where he went anyway. If you hold tab, you'll see his name greyed out as if he was dead while he's cloaked, so you can use that to tell if he's uncloaked yet. If it's over six to roughly eleven seconds, it was probably a real death. Also, doing a partner taunt will sometimes tempt the spy to try and backstab you while you're in the taunting position. Be ready to stop doing the partner taunt and spin around. It's not much, but it will help.

Seeya

Alright, that's it. If you have any other weapons that you think are OP, or you can think of some tips that I missed, tell me, and I'll put them in. Until then, this is all I've got I hope it helped. I got a little lazy at some parts, but I still hope this guide will help you, and reinvigorate you to go give an engie an noogie and steal his lunch money. Good luck!

[AliveDocterdoc The Vintage Guy]

how do i get a mini sentry

[Your Medic]

As of the Gun Mettle update, all dead classes drop a weap and an ammo box, since the former doesn't work as the latter. DR Spy? No ammo box. He's even more f***ed now.

[crime (Tenj)]

Man, I forgot about this guide. Honestly, Deev, I'd say the Black Box got nerfed pretty rough. I don't play sufficient amounts of soldier, so I wouldn't know for sure, but it seems like it got hit pretty hard.

[MeteorNate]

Stickies have never been a problem for me, but then again, I next-to-never play heavy, and when I play engineer, I'm very aggressive with my shotgun. Otherwise, it's just spacing.

[Ragnarok]

Mini sentries are not OP, thanks for pointing it out. Sure, they're tiny, but people must have been reading this guide, cause the SECOND I drop one, there's rockets and bullets hitting it dead on.

[crime (Tenj)]

I used to main medic. He's still one of my top few classes, even after I reset my stats, which was after I stopped maining medic.

[OrangesstrokingNosferatu]

honestly the black box isn't really OP. People just use it when there is no medics around( be honest, when was the last time you played medic?)

[crime (Tenj)]

Thanks, Dynaspark. I'll add that!

Well, Darth, you see, the only thing the Loch N Load used to be able to oneshot was classes with 125 HP or less, and that was only if you shot really far towards their knee caps. Now that the buffed the Loch N Load, it actually cannot one shot any class at full health unless they're using a weapon that lowers their health, you you shoot a crit pipe. So that's the first thing wrong with what you said. Also, as any sixes or highlander demoman will tell you, rollers contribute significantly to spam, and can be your saving grace if used properly. Not to mention the smaller explosion radius, which is just another small hinderence to add to the list. That being said, it's still great as far as I can tell. I never play demoman though, so what do I know?

[SEAF Signaller]

No need to press Tab each time u kill a spy with Dead ringer... just try to pickup weapon he drops. If ur ammo increases - spy dead. If not - just find and kill him again ;)

[Xippi]

great guide!