Survival /Colony Management Games

[Melodic Death]

I find myself really engrossed with this game combination as of late. My favorite part in a 4x game has always been colony management aspect. Throwing in survival with it makes it so much better, especially if there is a REAL challenge and has permadeath options. I've been playing 'Don't Starve' and 'Rimworld' latley, which you actually construct and manage your base, and the survival aspects are a REAL challenge. They constantly throw enemies your way, plus trying to keep all your needs met can be a tough challenge. You could throw in Prison Architect too, but I never feel threatend by anything. I played the demo of 'Factorio' and it looks like it has all those elements except for personal needs.

Thea: The Awakening is a good 4x game that has these elements, but the "city building" aspect isn't there, but it has good colony management. 'Banished' is a great city builder with survival aspects, but there are no enemies to give it that extra challenge.

I'm curious to know how many of you guys like this combo, and what is your favorite game with these elements? I'm also looking for other game with those survival aspects as well, such as enemies and personal needs, plus a good city building/colony management element too.

[Tragic]

I'm not a big fan of this type of game. I think "survival" is a problematic game system, or at least how it has turned into in recent years. Those kind of games often feel like "work" to me rather than actual gaming. They are like the worst type of MMO Quests, but as a focus for the entire game... Chop 80 wood, Craft 10 Tent Spikes, kill 5 wolves for pelts.. etc etc.

That being said, I LOVE city builders. In fact I have often said similar things to you as in my fav part of the 4X game is exploration and empire building. My "perfect game" actually would be a galaxy wide "city skylines" type game...

As for games that you may enjoy.... well I think Stronghold is the best "city builder / wargame" that has come out which I know of. You have great "Caesar" style city building (basically what you see in Anno) and a strong "defend" sub game where you fend off attacks from neighbouring castles. In fact Caesar and Zeus and those old school games are still top of their class in many way. Settlers is a good "city builder" with combat elements, I even liked the much hated on Settlers 7 or w/e the latest version was.. it was just unfortunate to be the one of the 1st uPlay game so got unfair hate that had nothing to do with the game itself. Worth a try for sure imo.

That being said none of them really have that "survival" aspect.

[Mansen]

I'm a huge fan of tycoon/management/city sim style games.

I wanted to love Rimworld, but it keeps feeling like just endless waves of enemies that grow to an unfair point where you can't be expected to survive and lose.

[Melodic Death]

Originally posted by Tragic:

I'm not a big fan of this type of game. I think "survival" is a problematic game system, or at least how it has turned into in recent years. Those kind of games often feel like "work" to me rather than actual gaming. They are like the worst type of MMO Quests, but as a focus for the entire game... Chop 80 wood, Craft 10 Tent Spikes, kill 5 wolves for pelts.. etc etc.

That being said, I LOVE city builders. In fact I have often said similar things to you as in my fav part of the 4X game is exploration and empire building. My "perfect game" actually would be a galaxy wide "city skylines" type game...

As for games that you may enjoy.... well I think Stronghold is the best "city builder / wargame" that has come out which I know of. You have great "Caesar" style city building (basically what you see in Anno) and a strong "defend" sub game where you fend off attacks from neighbouring castles. In fact Caesar and Zeus and those old school games are still top of their class in many way. Settlers is a good "city builder" with combat elements, I even liked the much hated on Settlers 7 or w/e the latest version was.. it was just unfortunate to be the one of the 1st uPlay game so got unfair hate that had nothing to do with the game itself. Worth a try for sure imo.

That being said none of them really have that "survival" aspect.

I get what you mean about those survival games where you have to gather resources to craft items, so you can make other items to craft more items, lol. I don't like all those types of games, but I do enjoy a lot of them. It might seem like work to some, but the payoff is when you start off with nothing, only to make a thriving colony and economy out of it. The Anno series and Settler series are games I do enjoy. Sure you pretty much just build things to build more things, but there is always a sense of accomplishment when you get deep into the game. You ask anyone and I bet most will say they felt better when they had to work hard for something, rather then it just being handed to them. I've been playing World of Warcraft for a long time, and one of the main complaints over the years is how easy things became to obtain. One of the reasons why WoD and Pandaria were failures is because you didn't have to really work to earn anything, so there was no sense of accomplishment.

I actually have all those games you mentioned. I'm a big city builder fan too, and Stronghold is a great game since it includes war elements as well as city building and colony management. It's also a game where you have to gather resources to do anything. I guess it feels more rewarding to me when you actually have to work for resources to build things. Skylines and Simcity are great, but you dont really have to gather materials for buildings. When you have to chop that tree, mine ore, or gather food is where the challenge is at. All while making sure your people don't starve, go insane, or don't die from enemies.

[Melodic Death]

Originally posted by Mansen:

I'm a huge fan of tycoon/management/city sim style games.

I wanted to love Rimworld, but it keeps feeling like just endless waves of enemies that grow to an unfair point where you can't be expected to survive and lose.

There are differnet levels of difficulting you can play on. You don't have to keep having enemies attack you. If you wanted to just manage a colony with little to no resistance you can, but I do enjoy the challenge of having to defend off waves of enemies. I think the whole point is to see how far you can get withouth dying, which gives me motivation to keep trying.

I love the tycoon games as well. My favorite has to be Railroad Tycoon 2, followed by Roller Coaster Tycoon 3.

[Mansen]

I'm aware - But it ruins it for me that playing with the default ruleset, you're basically looking at a "how long can you survive" game, not a proper management sim. Which incidentally also seethes through the content updates.

[Melodic Death]

To each their own. I don't think the intention of the game is to just be a colony sim. I think there are loads of those games already out there. Their intention was to make it a combo of survival and colony sim.

[Mansen]

Indeed - And I know very well what Tyan set out to make. I was a very early adopter. I just don't like how the challenge level quickly reaches a level where silly exploits are required to stay alive, unless you gimp the AI severely.

Colony sim mechanics should never take the backseat in a colony sim game. It's similar to how certain missions in the Impressions series (Pharaoh, Caesar, Zeus & Emperor) were far too focused on military to make room for the city building aspect. They turned into RTS games.

[cadfan17]

I don't think Rimworld is a "how long can you survive" game per se. There's are two victory conditions, and you're expected to achieve one of them before the game gets too hard for you to continue. Failing to do so is just losing the game.

[Melodic Death]

Originally posted by cadfan17:

I don't think Rimworld is a "how long can you survive" game per se. There's are two victory conditions, and you're expected to achieve one of them before the game gets too hard for you to continue. Failing to do so is just losing the game.

That is true, but it's almost the same thing. To see if you can survive that long to accomplish that goal. Regardless it's a game thats still in "Alpha", so there can me many more additions to the game to make it better.

[Vuyek]

Robinson Crusoe and the cursed island.

Best survival game I've ever played.
Oh.... unless you want to limit this to computer games only.

[Gregorovitch]

Factorio is a fantastic game IMO, it's worth a lot more than the sum of it's parts, sustained interest and challenge. I'm going the get Rimworld sometime when I've got time to play it.

[Mansen]

Originally posted by cadfan17:

I don't think Rimworld is a "how long can you survive" game per se. There's are two victory conditions, and you're expected to achieve one of them before the game gets too hard for you to continue. Failing to do so is just losing the game.

Design and practice are two very different things however - Have you played it? Because the raids will absolutely start to overwhelm you fast, unless you take some really, really, really exploitative measures into effect.

[cadfan17]

I've had two successful colonies under the previous patch.

[jlc2]

Originally posted by Uncle Timo:

Robinson Crusoe and the cursed island.

Best survival game I've ever played.
Oh.... unless you want to limit this to computer games only.

First Martians comes out in June and I'm super excited... I find the theme a lot more interesting then Crusoe (good game though).

OT, Rimworld is the only game of this type I've played and I really enjoy it, though I haven't played since Alpha 14 so I should fire it up again soon. Normally I'd find the busywork as Tragic mentioned a little too much and wouldn't like this type of game, but I think Rimworld's emergent stories always end up pretty comical and it keeps me enjoying the game.

[Drexciyian]

You should check out Evil Genius quite old now but still looks great due the the art style