ГРУПА STEAM
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Усі обговорення > Off Topic > Подробиці теми
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Показані коментарі 115 із 38
It is about time someone started to publicly talk about G2A.. they are dodgy as fuck. I have had a similar experience, they basically told us to go fuck ourselves as there is nothing we could do about it... and the truth is ... they were right. It is times like that you can appreciate what the film and comic book industry is going though.

The thing is I think a lot of people who use G2A just do not realise that it is basically a warez site. They just think it is a legit place for steam keys. They have just worked out a way to bypass the steam DRM system is all so the warez they sell dose not need a crack.
Автор останньої редакції: Tragic; 21 черв. 2016 о 5:32
G2A might be dodgy as fuck - But this article is not one of the reasons. If you actually read the article, you'll see that if anything it is themselves (publisher, due to Humble policies) who are at fault for what has happened here.

If you sell a bundle of gamekeys that can (even though you're not allowed to legally) be passed on (even sold), then of course some people are going to do so. The fact that G2A happens to be the largest "ebay" of cdkeys is purely coincidental.

Note: At the end of the day, Humble allowed you to potentially re-sell your keys you bought - A policy which they have since changed so that keys are activated straight into your account when bought. Incidentally this change has also caused a bit of a schism and loss of sales, because why buy a bundle where you only need one game, if you can't give the rest to friends?

- - - - - - -

Do you honestly expect a website like eBay or G2A to authenticate every single sale made there? And how would you expect them to do just that when most companies don't even have a "CDKEY Legitimacy" checker system in place in the first place? Just outright ban sales of that product?

G2A is nothing more than a deal facilitator. They hold money in escrow while a transaction between two private parties take place, nothing more. They don't sell 99% of the keys sold on their site from own stock.

G2A is not a warez site... what the hell kind of asinine argument is that? Warez are pirate copies for free - G2A lets you sell your unused cdkeys to other people - what part of that is considered piracy? low prices? By that logic, you'd condemn brick and mortar stores for offering used copies of console games (and old PC games pre-online DRM)

Your silly rant aside, where G2A (and game publishers) fails is its insurance - or lack thereof. If you buy a game key and it turns out to be fake, or otherwise unsuable, G2A forces you to come to an agreement with the seller. Can't do that? Tough luck.

UNLESS - you pay a monthly/per purchase insurance fee where they will handle any ... disputes that aren't solved.

Now how can they guarantee that a private seller's key isn't unauthorized, or purchased with a stolen credit card? They can't - Because as I mentioned previously, game publishers don't offer an internal key checking database to see the status of keys.

Example: I was late to the Overwatch pre-order thing, so I bought a key on G2A which turned out to be incorrect. I contacted Blizzard's support to see if the key existed at all, whcih it did not. After waiting three days for a reply, I finally got a new key through the seller. G2A's support wouldn't help until I had tried every venue - even though they could have taken the potential loss and helped out a repeat customer in seconds.
Автор останньої редакції: Mansen; 21 черв. 2016 о 5:52
The article is just a outburst form a frustrated dev. It is more like a post than an article. The point is that it with luck it will get people to start to understand that G2A is a paid warez site, period. (basically)

It isn't an "asinine" point.. G2A uses an exploited loop hole in the system that is as damaging to game devs and publishers as the warez scene, even more so as people who are not very quick, do not think about thing properly or have agendas to protect (like say they enjoy the service) actually are fool hardy enough to not recognise the problem G2A and its like minded sites cause.
Автор останньої редакції: Tragic; 21 черв. 2016 о 6:00
Again... G2A is not a paid warez site... Stop making up silly buzzwords. If anything you can call it an ebay for cdkeys, which is exactly what it is - complete with benefits and potential risks thereof.

And again - You seem very biased against digital resales, yet haven't responded to the brick and mortar comparison. So do you also have a problem with chains like Gamestop who does the exact same thing with console discs?

G2A is a business like any other - they are filling a void that was there to be filled due to demand from customers who wanted to be able to sell and buy cdkeys they didn't use otherwise. It is entirely up to publishers to control how many of these "portable" keys they sell to the open market.
like a lot of people that argue for shady thing you are getting held up in pedantic points of language rather than understanding the meaning of what is being said. I did say "basically" like a warez site.. obviously it is not "a warez site" but it forms the same function and has the same effect on the developers.

It is a business yes, but it is one that only exists as legitimate practices have yet to work out how to stop the horrid loop hole that allows it to exist.

G2A is a site that thrives on buying keys for next to nothing from the occasional innocent but misguided user but mostly through credit card fraud and then makes massive cash reselling those keys. Like in Goodfella's when they ruin that restaurant by selling all the stuff out the back, it dosn't matter that they are selling the product so cheap as it is pure profit, the bill is getting passed to the publishers and developers in lost revenue.
Автор останньої редакції: Tragic; 21 черв. 2016 о 6:35
I'm not arguing for shady things - I'm pointing out that none of which you have accused them for is shady.

The loop holes are/were obvious ones - Ones that customers noticed immediately and that publishers have failed to address internally before making them possible. If anything G2A and similar grey market sites live off of publisher laziness. So who is the bad guy here...

And you still haven't bothered to comment on the brick and mortar thing - is it alright if they are physical discs, but not if they are text keys? I am genuinely curious. Because they're the exact same thing. Hell even ebay would be at fault for existing given your argument, because they allow you to sell off things you don't want to own anymore - Since when has that ever been a possibility on modern DRM?
Автор останньої редакції: Mansen; 21 черв. 2016 о 6:43
The difference is that physical disks are not created at the point of purchase. There is a limited manufacturing run that is put out into the world and then is recycled as a 2nd hard market. It is so not even remotely the same thing as digital keys that it is actually amazing to me that I need to explain it.

Steamkeys are created at each purchase. It is a infinite uncontrollable marketplace. You go to BundleStar and buy 20 copies of the "Shadows of Middle Earth Bundle[www.bundlestars.com]" for $12:50 and then sell of the keys individually for tons of cash. The way it makes the big money is not only in the splitting but in the fact that the fraud they use to buy the keys means that even if they sell the bundle split for less than the cost (which they often don't) it is pure profit no matter what the sell it for.

It is basically a licence to print money, and that cost is deferred to the publishers and developers.

I suspect many "legit" users just do not know what is going on here, like all those poor saps that use PopCorn Time but there are many that just do not care, and are just selfishly motivated who do know what is going on and they are just as much tainted in my mind as the sites founders.

Cost reduction is a powerful motivator, people will tie themselves in all kinds of logic knots rather than face the truth of their actions. G2A is basically a warez site.. end of story.

Цитата допису Mansen:
If anything G2A and similar grey market sites live off of publisher laziness. So who is the bad guy here...

Who? Easy... the "Gray Market" sites and the people that support them knowingly.


As I thought. You're a hypocrite.
Цитата допису Mansen:
As I thought. You're a hypocrite.

yeah.. .powerful words of logic there man... I get it though, there is no defending a site like this so what can you do?
The only place I buy steam keys besides steam is Green Man Gaming. I stay away from G2A. I stay away from E-Bay, cragislist and all of those kinds of sites.

I do love Amazon though.
Цитата допису aJynks:
obviously it is not "a warez site" but it forms the same function and has the same effect on the developers.

No. It doesn't fulfill the same function at all. That's like saying Ebay is the same thing as breaking into a shop.
The fact alone that you're excusing brick and mortar stores because of a "limited run" is all the proof I need of my claim, Jynks. The physical market is flooded with pre-owned copies to the point where large quantities are outright tossed because the prices would drop too low otherwise.

And even ignoring real world market situation right now, it's not like digital keys are any different. A publisher only spits out as many keys as they want to - and 3rd party resellers like GMG buy those keys in bulk.

So what happens when a seller that isn't 1st party (i.e. the people who create keys at will, and revoke them again should they feel the need to) burns in with too many keys? They sell them onward through bundles, giveaways or "mystery key" deals.

Anyway - I'm beyond tired of arguing the merits of what constitutes shady business with you, since we're obviously not in agreement here. That being said, G2A and similar sites are definitely "shady" for a reason.

At the end of the day, you're not buying from a legitimate reseller, but a private person - with little to zero insurance that what you actually pay for turns out to the the product advertised. This is however not an issue exclusive to digital re-sellers (See eBay scams for more on that)

With this information in hand, you should obviously use common sense when dealing on such websites. Is a brand new game half off on G2A? Yeah it's probably a key bought with a stolen credit card that will be removed in a few weeks.

Does the seller have almost zero sales, or a lot of unhappy buyers? Avoid them like the plague. If a seller has 80k successful sales, they're probably a stable and reliable seller - word of mouth spreads fast.

Would I buy a game from a shady seller with a shady sounding price (however good it might be - IF it turns out to be true?) No of course not - But that's not really at the fault of the website you use.

What I would like to see however is a cooling off period on your money - essentially real escrow. A month after a sale has been made, the seller receives the money if no issues has risen in the meantime - to prevent credit card scams and such. But also to serve as a deterrent for people looking to make a quick buck.

So far I have bough the following on G2A and only had problems once.

Civ: Beyond Earth
(Because it never reached a price on a sale that I was willing to pay for a game I had strong reservations against at the time - still do)

Windows 8.1 OEM
(Three of those to cover every machine in our house for the free Windows 10 upgrade)

Grand Ages: Medieval
(Which ultimately turned out to be a bad purchase for me, because in spite of it looking interesting based on streams and YT, it didn't really fit with me)

Bounty Train
(EA game on Steam. Bought as a small present for my brother who loves those games)

Elite: Dangerous
(Because it was significantly cheaper than anywhere else - and again a game I wasn't sure I'd like at all. Which I didn't)

Anno 2205
(I'm a glutton for punishment. After the disappointment of the last ANNO game, I decided to try this out anyway, but it didn't have a lot of longevity)

Kerbal Space Program
(Key as a present)

NewMOO
(Because @#$@ Steam prices for AAA priced Early Access games - Besides Wargaming has enough of my money tied up in tanks)

Dawn of War 2
(Because I lost my old account with it, and I needed my GW fix)

And finally Overwatch - Because I missed the pre-order deadline due to bank issues.

Definition of warez:
"software that has been illegally copied and made available."

Yeah um G2A scam merchants do not fall on that category as they are not illegally copying things. What's actually happening is credit card fraud and a broken chargeback system. If anything its steam's fault for not giving proper ways to regulate illegal steam key usage or credit card companies for not bothering to prevent fraudulent usage. How are these merchants getting so many credit cards anyway?
Цитата допису Mr.Kill:
. How are these merchants getting so many credit cards anyway?


20 minutes on Tor?
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Усі обговорення > Off Topic > Подробиці теми