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Apexnexius 2022 年 5 月 15 日 下午 4:31
Why doesn't Japanese gamers buy the Xbox Consoles ?
Why ?

Xbox Series X/S - 0.19 millions sold
Xbox One - 0.12 millions sold
Xbox 360 - 1.66 million sold
Xbox - 0.53 millions sold

What are the reasons behind this ? :lunar2020thinkingtiger:
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crunchyfrog 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 6:14 
引用自 permanent name
Doesn't Akihabara's founding as an electronics sector have more to do with Sony being granted the exclusive patent for transistors?

A key technology which is the very foundation of Japan's current position.

Given to a company that didn't exist before WW2.

And which sometimes hires Yakuza to beat up housebound invalids who criticize them online, and then accidentally kills them instead, and then covers it up.

I don't suppose this is an entre into talking about the realtionship between MacArthur, the Yakuza, and the supposedly-defeated fascist government which rose to power after assassinating most of the Hokkien royal line.

Because I'm well aware that would be against the rules here. That's politics. Not historical facts.

But understanding Japan's relationship with foreigners kind of requires knowing about that, and also understanding the Boshin war, the Gempei War, and the reality of the Nara period. Which is when the Hokkien, or Ryukyuan, imperial line was established. Because they helped free Japan from Chinese colonization. And every other line was destroyed during the Genpei war, and the ruling powers pre-emptively colonized Okinawa in order to cripple the incoming emperor. Who was Okinawan, and thus Hokkien.

It turns out was he was kinda good at it, and was consolidating power while undermining the colonization, so the ruling powers faked an assassination and took advantage of their literati status to rewrite 600 years of history and invent 600 more. And did it in a way where it seems pretty legitimate, but necessarily has holes in the story which one can discover with enough scholarship. I believe they even have a document outlining exactly what those flaws are, hidden away where only the most trusted scholars are allowed to see it.

Meaning the past 800 years of Japan's history has been illegitimate on its face.

Otaku tend to discover all of this, as they are obsessives. And you can't have a culture of expertise without obsessives. So Sony, the defacto corporate rulers of modern japan, are in an awkward position where they simultaneously need to maintain Akihabara's mystery and power but also need to oppress and belittle it as much as possible. Much like the people who make the country work.

Which is why they started creating internet brigades to do this, following the censorship of the internet in 1997 when a military cult with ties to the one which assassinated the prime minister in the 60's somehow managed to bomb the Tokyo subway lines.

Then people started making their own brigades, which is what resulted in the yakuza incident. Sony cleaning up its own messes, arguably.

To be utterly blunt, this is why Japanese people don't buy foreign goods. It inches the general populace ever so slightly closer to realizing these simple facts.
Frankly I don't think that's relelvant too much to the point.

Simply because these little cottage industries that cropped up in Aki's back streets have sold ANYTHING. I won't deny that you always get some sort of input from somewhere to start the ball rolling. BUt once it gains traction, anyone joins in.

And that's certainly what I've seen from my times there. I've bought all sorts of electronic components. They're ideal to buy while I'm there as capacitors or resistors or some rare transistors don't take up much luggage space :)

The thing is though that the point here is that Japanese culture doesn't really like the American games that MS did. It's nothing to do with who seeded the businesses in the first place, or it wouldn't be as I said - with those games I watched being roundly ignored by people om the street.

That's the point.
Mr. Smiles 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 6:30 
I miss that old interview of the random Japanese guy who when asked if he would buy an Xbox 360 said "I would buy an Xbox 360 if it were a PlayStation 3".

Classic.
最後修改者:Mr. Smiles; 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 6:30
permanent name 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 6:32 
Eh people liked Metal Wolf and that cartoony arena shooter. The shooter was even held up as an example of ‘Western Innovation’ by people. People tired of Nintendo and Sony’s complacent and exploitative offerings.

Also many western series and styles of game were very popular there. Such as Wizardry, which inspired the original Elden Ring games on ps1. As well as King’s Field, and pretty much all other Fromsoft games.

But once the trade war got going neither MS nor Sony could come up with good games anymore. Too much invested in maintaining their margins, and too much selling at a loss.

So people defaulted to what was local, as that was ultimately what targeted the lowest common denominator the best.

People still call for remakes of that arena game.
Murassa [TR] 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 6:42 
They have the switch and PlayStation
Probably both are cheaper there than the xbox
Kamiyama 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 6:45 
Part of it could just be patriotism. They buy Sony and Nintendo because those are recognized brand names from their own country.

But I think a lot of it is the type of media.

A lot of Japan games never make it to the USA. They play a lot of visual novels and dating sims over there. Like... a lot.

Not sure but I think violent games like FPS are considered really offensive there. In the USA we tolerate violent media but are offended by sexual content. It's kind of the opposite over there.

Trying to sell them an xbox with halo probably didn't go over well. I can't think of many USA developers who made sexy games for the xbox, let alone translated them for sale in Japan.

Granted I'm not an expert. But I watch a lot of Abroad in Japan and Trash Taste on youtube. They've shown me the love motels and how they celebrate Christmas. Like we don't have "love motels" we have seedy cheap motels where seedy people go. No Japan has actual love motels. They do not hide the purpose of the love motel. Also Christmas in Japan is like valentine's day here in the USA.

Oh also they have vending machines that have the little capsules full of naked figurines instead of normal kids toys. Or vending machines full of panties. These things would never fly here, but they exist over there.

Point being: I think they like romance games. Not face-shooty games.
Murassa [TR] 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 6:57 
引用自 Kamiyama
Part of it could just be patriotism. They buy Sony and Nintendo because those are recognized brand names from their own country.

But I think a lot of it is the type of media.

A lot of Japan games never make it to the USA. They play a lot of visual novels and dating sims over there. Like... a lot.

Not sure but I think violent games like FPS are considered really offensive there. In the USA we tolerate violent media but are offended by sexual content. It's kind of the opposite over there.

Trying to sell them an xbox with halo probably didn't go over well. I can't think of many USA developers who made sexy games for the xbox, let alone translated them for sale in Japan.

Granted I'm not an expert. But I watch a lot of Abroad in Japan and Trash Taste on youtube. They've shown me the love motels and how they celebrate Christmas. Like we don't have "love motels" we have seedy cheap motels where seedy people go. No Japan has actual love motels. They do not hide the purpose of the love motel. Also Christmas in Japan is like valentine's day here in the USA.

Oh also they have vending machines that have the little capsules full of naked figurines instead of normal kids toys. Or vending machines full of panties. These things would never fly here, but they exist over there.

Point being: I think they like romance games. Not face-shooty games.

Japanese do play FPS but anime themed
Its not offensive there ,they dont even care what type of game you playing
Morkonan 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 7:44 
引用自 Devsman
...
the average Tokyo apartment is not actually that small.

Mrs. Devsman and I lived in less space than that until Little Devsman was almost a year old. With a kitchen and a guest room, even. And I had plenty of room for vidja consoles, lol. I even had a big-ass tube TV.

I do kind of question whether that article is accurate though.

The info I had there on apartment size was from an industry article, forget which, about Sony vs Microsoft I had posted for another thread that was very similar to this one.

The sort of single guy gamer kind of "apartment" they showed was slightly larger than a walk-in closet. The "family" apartment, and I presume these were in urban areas, was pretty darn tiny, too.

IIRC, that article focused this aspect on the initial introduction of the first Xbox, which had a pretty darn big footprtint, IIRC. (Never had one)

Here's an article that mentions it, but I don't think it's the same one I had linked in a previous thread: https://www.japan-zone.com/features/103_why_xbox_failed_in_japan.shtml

And, yeah, the controllers were a bit bigger than the market was used to. I like big controllers... But, well, smaller hands don't do so well with them and that's understandable. There were even complaints about their size in the US, too.

In looking for a link for you, I came across some current articles for XBox sales in Japen/region. This one is a bit more positive, showing some gains for the latest release compared to others:

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/japan-has-bought-2-3-million-xbox-consoles-in-the-last-20-years-new-report-reveals/

But, we can also see the most popular console also had the most popular games in that market for it. There's a good suggestion there that titles that target that audience might have a good role to play, as others have suggested.

So, something with bells and whistles that poofs up some sparkles and cute jumpy-spinny animations when a player successfully uses a "One-shot-no-scope-360" power-up on some clueless nub might be coming to "Super Billy-O: Call of Duty - Happy-Fun Panty-Shot edition?" Oh, and throw up one of those gang-signs those anime characters are always flashin'...
permanent name 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 8:00 
People complained about the playstation controller redesign too, which made it closer to a xbox one.

They both remind me of the Dreamcast controller, which was an evolution of the somewhat unique genesis/megadrive controller.

Apparently the Dreamcast was pretty successful, grossing a few billion usd over three years.

Apparently they went under because of their financial ties within the industry. The ones they’re legally obligated to have, to protect against foreign market manipulations. Connections who suddenly decided to collect all their debts at once even if it meant taking a loss.

Then Sega got bought by a holding company, named Sammy or some such, who up to that point was exclusively a pachinko license holding company for the yakuza. Now they publish the Yakuza series about a nice young gangster boy. One that punches the bad yakuza.

Just an interesting tangent.

Anyway the xbox was at most 15% longer than a ps2 fat, and its lower profile would have been easier to shelve. I have my doubts about that mattering much.
最後修改者:permanent name; 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 8:17
E3kHatena 2022 年 5 月 16 日 下午 11:56 
A handful of brief points, others have written more involved threads and we don't need more:

-Microsoft's in-house IP tend to skew more toward Western interests like FPSes, racing games, and RTSes. Even the likes of Rare, who had done games with Nintendo pre-buyout, didn't fare that well in Japan when it came to their original properties, with Banjo-Kazooie being considered an underrated cult classic in Japan like how we view Earthbound in North America.

-Poor marketing means that Sony and Nintendo have stronger market saturation

-PC gaming is shunned in Japan, with the stereotype being they're hentai-addicted nerds, so the association with XBox and Microsoft likely turned some people away

-Microsoft's more popular IP like Cuphead and Minecraft are on other platforms, too.

-Local pride versus buying a foreign console to play essentially the same titles.

The general consensus seems to be that the Switch is a family game console and the PS5 is for more hardcore players, which is pretty well reflected in the sales of past consoles. Microsoft makes a fortune from their other avenues, so I'm sure they can manage to deal with the historically low sales of the XBox by this point.
gugnihr 2022 年 5 月 17 日 上午 1:02 
引用自 E3kHatena
A handful of brief points, others have written more involved threads and we don't need more:

-Microsoft's in-house IP tend to skew more toward Western interests like FPSes, racing games, and RTSes. Even the likes of Rare, who had done games with Nintendo pre-buyout, didn't fare that well in Japan when it came to their original properties, with Banjo-Kazooie being considered an underrated cult classic in Japan like how we view Earthbound in North America.

I know it is an unpopular opinion, but I think that Rare games are obscenely overrated* (except the music, DKC and Banjo music is wonderful). I would like to know how succesful Donkey kong Country Returns is in Japan. Retro studios did an exceptional job with that one, it is fantastic. Sadly Tropical Freeze is less goodin my opinion, I would have wanted to be able to swim in DKCR, but overall even without that feature DKCR is still much better than Tropical Freeze...

Same goes for the first Metroid Prime as far as I'm concerned, it seems like Retro studios is excerptionally good but only with their first games... they should not make sequels... but the first ones are amazing masterpieces.

*PS: I'm not from Japan
最後修改者:gugnihr; 2022 年 5 月 17 日 上午 1:03
crunchyfrog 2022 年 5 月 17 日 下午 1:20 
引用自 permanent name
Eh people liked Metal Wolf and that cartoony arena shooter. The shooter was even held up as an example of ‘Western Innovation’ by people. People tired of Nintendo and Sony’s complacent and exploitative offerings.

Also many western series and styles of game were very popular there. Such as Wizardry, which inspired the original Elden Ring games on ps1. As well as King’s Field, and pretty much all other Fromsoft games.

But once the trade war got going neither MS nor Sony could come up with good games anymore. Too much invested in maintaining their margins, and too much selling at a loss.

So people defaulted to what was local, as that was ultimately what targeted the lowest common denominator the best.

People still call for remakes of that arena game.
Yeah but the thing is those games were few and far between. Wizardry and the ancient RPGs of that time are what started the JRPGs on their route anyway.

As w general rule though, wester games just don't tend to get traction there.
crunchyfrog 2022 年 5 月 17 日 下午 1:25 
引用自 gugnihr
引用自 E3kHatena
A handful of brief points, others have written more involved threads and we don't need more:

-Microsoft's in-house IP tend to skew more toward Western interests like FPSes, racing games, and RTSes. Even the likes of Rare, who had done games with Nintendo pre-buyout, didn't fare that well in Japan when it came to their original properties, with Banjo-Kazooie being considered an underrated cult classic in Japan like how we view Earthbound in North America.

I know it is an unpopular opinion, but I think that Rare games are obscenely overrated* (except the music, DKC and Banjo music is wonderful). I would like to know how succesful Donkey kong Country Returns is in Japan. Retro studios did an exceptional job with that one, it is fantastic. Sadly Tropical Freeze is less goodin my opinion, I would have wanted to be able to swim in DKCR, but overall even without that feature DKCR is still much better than Tropical Freeze...

Same goes for the first Metroid Prime as far as I'm concerned, it seems like Retro studios is excerptionally good but only with their first games... they should not make sequels... but the first ones are amazing masterpieces.

*PS: I'm not from Japan
I think you're right to a certain degree.

I LOVED Rare when they were "Ultimate Play the Game" and turned out regular quality titles on the ZX Spectrum. First one of theirs I tried was Jetpac and fell in love with it. It was my then most played game on the Spectrum. Then later Atic Atac, Sabre Wulf, Underwurlde, and so on. I had no qualms with buying any Ultimate game because then I knew I would like it.

When I got more off vide games for a few years I lost sight of them and didn't find out until much later they'd changed name to Rare. I picked up a few of their N64 games and felt some of them weren't that great. I think the large part of their popularity was symptomatic - that there was a deficit of good games on the N64 so they took up the strain, which may have tilted people's opinion of them.

I mean, Blast Corps was fun and all but a classic? Absolutely not. Banjo Kazooie and Tooie were servicable platformers, but when you look at the tons of similar platformers for the PS1 and PS2 later, they pale. I rate games like 40 Winks higher.

Nowdays I don't even consider them at all because obviously they're not the same company by any stretch.
Triforce Digital Marketing 2022 年 5 月 18 日 下午 2:14 
The Xbox wasn't popular because Sony and Nintendo already had a foothold in Japan with gamers preferring games made in Japan. The Xbox was this American console that didn't appeal to gamers due to the games offered, overly large controller, and the branding with Microsoft seen as a software developer for PCs and not a gaming company.
permanent name 2022 年 5 月 18 日 下午 3:17 
It also had a lot of VNs and niche publisher support, which is what people praised the most. As well as morrowind and several other cRPGs from that era.

Sort of a less grognardy platform to do what PCs usually did for gaming.

And also the only console genuinely trying to support smaller publishers, rather than wring them out and hang them up.

Or at least they were. They’re all the same platform now, so why bother.
最後修改者:permanent name; 2022 年 5 月 18 日 下午 3:21
McFlurry Butts 2022 年 5 月 18 日 下午 4:38 
I wasn't really a huge fan of the xbox series. Starters, I had a lot of technical issues with it, the Red ring of death was a thing; having to wrap a towel around an xbox360 is insane, and not to mention the cd tray would bust close or scratch your games. I sent my xbox360 in to have it fixed and it came back broken in other ways. I mean, Japan may simply not buy it because they don't like the reputation. I never went beyond the xbox360.

I am contemplating going into Linux right now, but so many of my games only work on windows systems; with the new nvidia opensource drivers, I may not return.
最後修改者:McFlurry Butts; 2022 年 5 月 18 日 下午 4:40
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