Do you believe souls exist in us all?

[Panazois λ]

I certainly do. If they did not then we wouldn't have words like: "psychologist" "psycho" and "psychotherapist". Psycho originates from the Greek word "ψυχή" which means soul in greek. Also when you are depressed you feel some sort of pain. But not in your stomach or your head or your genitals. But it just is. It's there but you can't really feel it like when you would get hurt. It's a different kind of pain. A psychological pain. Your soul is hurting. Your soul and body are one. One cannot exist with the other. Your body is a vessel for your soul.

[AdahnGorion]

Abisha の投稿を引用：

Darkie の投稿を引用：

We can never know anything for sure, but the most logical take on energy does argue that the universe tries to put a damper on energy, infact it can merge and remove it (hence destroy or alter it).
Scientifically, we are merely cells... and cells are merely is merely a piece of the dead universe that has seperated itself from the rest of it, so that it may try to do something by its self.. When it dies, it falls apart and joins the void again.

The universe is trying to stop this process, it actually wants to create an eternal empty void of nothingness. This is where entropy comes in.. We are actually "us, cells" trying to be active, change and so forth, to not "die" This requires energy... We are actually depended of energy, more so than anything else, because without it, we would be nothing.

Ofc it all depends on how we define energy as well ofc. Our universe pretty much just consist of a tiny bit of matter, a little dark matter and then alot of dark energy, We don't even have a clue about what dark matter is yet or dark energy for that sake.. (we can guess and there is good theories ofc) What I am trying to say, is that we humans, don't understand much, we do guess alot about everything...

Basically a good projection about what we "see" and "understand" is Plato´s cave.. We can have good ideas and theories, but we can't actually fathom anything anyway and we most likely can't grasp or comprehend what we are ourselves or even why we are able to talk and "think" all constructed things btw.. Because we construct our world to understand, we construct who we are, how we think, the entities in it.. IE this very forum... it is a social construct.

yea cells, that are made of neutrons and protons, that binds with Quark and Leptons which all work on electromagnetism force.

saying we are cells is bit like saying your building exist out of only one building block.
that's also the reason people are investigating if your thinking patron is multi dimensional.
each thought you create have to go somewhere it takes up "quantum" space.

a good brain teaser is the maxwell demon (if your thinking patron is one quantum unit "heat or cold" you have to store that information somewhere within your brain right.

We have to keep it simplified here, else we would have to post scientific papers and explain evertyhing in detail. It was merely a way to talk about energy and the fact we can't fathom much and thus "makes" up constructs to deal with what we don't know.

[Abisha]

⛧Black Rainbows⛧ の投稿を引用：

Its my brain that decides who I am. And my hormones my mood. And I can pick to use my brain to change my hormone levels via visualizations, exercise, environmental stimulation (like music), etc.

I tried the whole psychic thing 10+ years and it was self delusions. I really tried, to find something to prove there was more than this dry reality. But, nope, nada was found, besides the imagination. Still, if your really bored, you can for fun create an abundance of sense delusions around yourself, hear voices, see imaginary things, make yourself think and feel phantom body parts, etc.

Theres fun things one can think, but you always gotta keep the ground below in mind. Least you go off the deep end.

Also, just because your self delusions are fake, doesn't mean they can't still hurt you. For instance you can traumatize yourself.

if it's fake then why do Fake operations work?.
Placebo is a thing?.

[Rio]

Abisha の投稿を引用：

⛧Black Rainbows⛧ の投稿を引用：

Its my brain that decides who I am. And my hormones my mood. And I can pick to use my brain to change my hormone levels via visualizations, exercise, environmental stimulation (like music), etc.

I tried the whole psychic thing 10+ years and it was self delusions. I really tried, to find something to prove there was more than this dry reality. But, nope, nada was found, besides the imagination. Still, if your really bored, you can for fun create an abundance of sense delusions around yourself, hear voices, see imaginary things, make yourself think and feel phantom body parts, etc.

Theres fun things one can think, but you always gotta keep the ground below in mind. Least you go off the deep end.

Also, just because your self delusions are fake, doesn't mean they can't still hurt you. For instance you can traumatize yourself.

if it's fake then why do Fake operations work?.
Placebo is a thing?.

Lay of hands never worked for me either. and if you mean the fake surgery in 3rd world where they pull objects out of people to represent negative energy. And that cures people. I wouldn't believe it unless I experienced it personally, on myself. And of course after an actual doctor looked at me over and proclaimed me cured, in writing too. So I could have a material proof.

[Xautos]

Darkie の投稿を引用：

Abisha の投稿を引用：

yea cells, that are made of neutrons and protons, that binds with Quark and Leptons which all work on electromagnetism force.

saying we are cells is bit like saying your building exist out of only one building block.
that's also the reason people are investigating if your thinking patron is multi dimensional.
each thought you create have to go somewhere it takes up "quantum" space.

a good brain teaser is the maxwell demon (if your thinking patron is one quantum unit "heat or cold" you have to store that information somewhere within your brain right.

We have to keep it simplified here, else we would have to post scientific papers and explain evertyhing in detail. It was merely a way to talk about energy and the fact we can't fathom much and thus "makes" up constructs to deal with what we don't know.

indeed, because i haven't a clue what has been written before your reply. for the sake of those who wish to contribute, it would be nice if the debate was kept simple enough to understand.

Panagiotis の投稿を引用：

Do you believe souls exist in us all?

I don't follow metaphysics or religious themes, so my belief is not applicable.

[AustrAlien2010]

I would say, they exist in the same way as dreams exist.
Dreams are real to the dreamer.

[Abisha]

⛧Black Rainbows⛧ の投稿を引用：

Abisha の投稿を引用：

if it's fake then why do Fake operations work?.
Placebo is a thing?.

Lay of hands never worked for me either. and if you mean the fake surgery in 3rd world where they pull objects out of people to represent negative energy. And that cures people. I wouldn't believe it unless I experienced it personally, on myself. And of course after an actual doctor looked at me over and proclaimed me cured, in writing too. So I could have a material proof.

No No faked operations those are real faked it's complicated here is a paper on the subject.

https://books.google.nl/books?id=KhBMCgAAQBAJ&pg=PT22&lpg=PT22&dq=faked+operations+curing+patient&source=bl&ots=XJ9dr2Fpgd&sig=ACfU3U2eip1ac4LYKAh_ypkRVb_CqCAn6Q&hl=nl&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiVo_ijr_rpAhVHzKQKHdNqCvUQ6AEwAHoECAoQAQ#v=onepage&q=faked%20operations%20curing%20patient&f=false

[Rio]

Oh that minor stuff like "Can your thoughts ease physical pain? "

Of course it can. I feel less pain than I should all the time. It doesn't mean anything really. In fact its actually kind of dangerous, I get hurt more often because I don't feel as much pain. Like how I can stay up 3 days and then my body its wrecked. And I can need a recovery period.

I could ignore the carpel tunnel pain, but that just means the damage gets worse. Pain exists for a reason.

One might be able to fully dissociate from physical pain. But I'm not about to try that.

[Morphic]

Darkie の投稿を引用：

Who says we have to be programmed. [...] It will be way to complicated to list all and debate them in full..

That's my point, that theory doesn't really answer anything and is no different than other theories such as Dualism. Thus, it's up to the observer to choose what is most pleasant to them. Hence, I don't buy into the "Meat Robots" theory because it isn't pleasant to me. I like thinking Humans are something more or have the capacity to be.

Darkie の投稿を引用：

But the dualistic thinking springs from the idea that we have a "creator" and are beyond our physical vessel. That I simply don't believe in. (I don't claim to be right, because there is no eternal truth) and that is often what religion and theories like those wants to serve us.

And that's fine since Dualism can't really be proven either and is little different to the "Meat Robots" theory. That's why I touched on Religion possibly being a construct designed for people to act a certain way.

Darkie の投稿を引用：

Before I wrote this very post, before every click on the keyboard, I would actually do it before I became aware of it, so how can it be a conscious choice?? I mean if I already did it, before being aware, I did not take the choice actively. The same goes for what we exprience, it is all delayed, like when I click to refresh, then the page actually refresh before I am aware, it takes time to process. Then we have all the silly but still valid arguments about brain in a jar, because we have good evidence towards that it is likely we can manipulate just about anything in our brain.

The first half of this doesn't really make sense to me. How would you write or click something before you actually became aware of it? Are you referring to thought before action? Or are you referring to instinct? I don't understand how you "did not take the choice actively" when actions such as that aren't reflexive; you need to think about it; however briefly. Unless you are trying to make a cognition argument? Though re-reading it makes it seem like you are trying to make a Consciousness vs Unconsciousness argument... in which case we have a difference in opinion. I tend to favor the Subconscious term as our brains process tons of information at lightning speeds but it doesn't let all that information be the forefront of our attention so as not to overwhelm our higher thought. E.g. to use your analogy; you boot up a game to play but in the background your PC is downloading an update. Your "higher thought" is on the game so you don't notice the Update until you start having performance issues with your game.

As for the "brain in a jar" arguments... there's equal arguments against that as well. That's why, IMO, it comes down to just picking a theory that is most appealing to you. No theory has concrete proof, some just have more circumstantial evidence than others. However, even that evidence is subject to interpretation which then eventually falls into a cognition argument and we are back to Plato's Cave all over again.

[crunchyfrog]

Nope.

Basic critical thinking and scepticism. It's worth believing in when sufficient evidence has been presented. For souls, NO evidence has been presented. Everything that has been offered has been found to be sorely lacking.

So no, nor should anyone.

[Rio]

And if I remember right stress has a negative effect on the immune system. And visualizing beating an illness could reduce stress...So yeah, hormones.

[Rio]

My opinion is this, if you know something probably doesn't exist. but your depressed not believing it. Maybe then believe it, but always remember to be realistic. And that it is okay if people think different.

Its not great to go through your whole life bitter, depressed, or angry. Because you only want to ever be seen as scientific and rational. People already, just are not that.

Belief, is a tool. That can greatly enhance your life. you can throw that away if you want, for sure. But it might leave an empty feeling, or a hopelessness, or anger, etc.

[crunchyfrog]

Munithe EXT の投稿を引用：

I wanna explain something and you're gonna think I'm nuts. It's something I can't prove and will not be able to convince anyone, unless they have had similar experiences.

Throughout my life I have memories of events that have occurred. Things I heard in the news and people talked about. Then when I look them up online, there is no record of it ever happening. The memories are somewhat vague and so I can put it down to a fault with my memory, but I always suspected it was more than that. That's what made me start to think that maybe I had switched dimensions somehow on more than one occasion. It was just a theory and I didn't have too much faith in the idea.

Then it happened again to me last night but this time the memories were too recent, too fresh and too detailed for me to put it down to a fault in my memory. This was enough to convince me this line of investigation was worth pursuing.

I think deja-vu is a phenomenon we experience when our ego switches dimension/consciousness. My experiences with deja-vu also form a large part of my reasoning for my ideas, but I don't want to go into details about that because it will seem far-fetched.

Well, let's break this down.

You have an experience that you can't explain.

There you go- that's as far as you can take it.

[Rio]

Munithe EXT の投稿を引用：

If everyone thought that way, I think we might be extinct by now.

If mean me, all I'm saying is, if its ruining your life not having any belief. And having a belief means your life is great. Maybe have the belief.

Just don't hold other people to it. An specially don't hurt people cuz of it.

[Fajita Jim]

Morphic の投稿を引用：

No theory has concrete proof

So you don't believe in music?

Or film?
Or germs?
Or atoms?
Or games?

You know, Music theory, germ theory, atomic theory, game theory, etc.?

[Blargo]

Fajita Jim の投稿を引用：

game theory

MatPat doesn't exist, confirmed.