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What is considered cheating in your view?
I have had this arguement for some time now with several people in a few game discussions and would like to see what more people think on this topic...

What do you consider cheating in a game? If you go by the legal definition of cheat it means:

Cheat (verb) to act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, especially in a game or examination

The arguemtent I have been having is that buying things in games (i.e. weapons, armor, etc..) that give you an advantage or bypasses the "earning" period to achieve the same content others take time to get would fall within the definition of cheating but since the developeres of the game allow it they now call this Pay 2 win...

So.. Do you consider Pay 2 win the same as cheating?
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Toast の投稿を引用:
I'm not familiar with the game, but I will say that I wouldn't consider it a bad thing as long as the unlocks are balanced or are merely cosmetic and therefore do not give an unfair advantage to the player who buys them. That's the difference between P2W and some other arbitrary progression system.

oh, well it does gives you different advantages as each character has different weapon sets and armors along with special ability. I.E there a sniper character you pay $10 for or 50k credits which takes forever playing to get and he can run in stealth mode across the map lol. So a new player can spend $10 to get him while others playing for a month still don't have him.
Sir Dookface McFerretballs の投稿を引用:
In my view?

Singleplayer games? Cheat all you want! Hell, cheats oftern make singleplayer games MORE FUN. Especially with games that have tons of mods.

Cheating WITH FRIENDS in co-op or PvP private servers or LAN? Can be tons of fun, since you all agreed on it. Using cheats to make things harder in PvP, hell yeah. Imagine playing Mariokart with an "everyone gets lightning bolts" cheat.

Hell, I don't care if people cheat in grindy PvE only games, as long as they aren't loot ninjas or somehow making other players have a harder time.

Cheating in online multiplayer PvP? There is a special pit in hell reserved for you!

lol like the last part...

but at least you agree that the term cheating appliers to it all. The main issue I had was people saying I was an imbecile becuase they don't agree that P2W is cheating lol. I may not agree with them but not going to go to the extreme of calling them crap to back my opinions...
Kyubey の投稿を引用:
I tried dirty bomb, its kinda cool, I dont have a problem with you buying a new character to support the game. I was still able to do good with a pistol being free2play

I would like to say it was to support the game lol, yeah that would sound better. But lets be honest, I bought a character for the ability and wepaons they had as I knew it would give me a better advantage :) . So I accept the term cheating would be applied here but that's where others say otherwise. I just think it makes it unfair to even have P2W options as it's nothing more than saying cheating is ok as long as you pay money to do it.
☢» MACHIN3 «☢ の投稿を引用:
[...]

So.. Do you consider Pay 2 win the same as cheating?

No. P2W is a concept actively introduced and encouraged by the developers of the game. By its very definition, it's not cheating.

It is, however, enough reason for me to stop playing said game. If I'm to lose, it better not be because the opposing player(s) happened to spend more cash than me.
☢» MACHIN3 «☢ の投稿を引用:
Sir Dookface McFerretballs の投稿を引用:
In my view?

Singleplayer games? Cheat all you want! Hell, cheats oftern make singleplayer games MORE FUN. Especially with games that have tons of mods.

Cheating WITH FRIENDS in co-op or PvP private servers or LAN? Can be tons of fun, since you all agreed on it. Using cheats to make things harder in PvP, hell yeah. Imagine playing Mariokart with an "everyone gets lightning bolts" cheat.

Hell, I don't care if people cheat in grindy PvE only games, as long as they aren't loot ninjas or somehow making other players have a harder time.

Cheating in online multiplayer PvP? There is a special pit in hell reserved for you!

lol like the last part...

but at least you agree that the term cheating appliers to it all. The main issue I had was people saying I was an imbecile becuase they don't agree that P2W is cheating lol. I may not agree with them but not going to go to the extreme of calling them crap to back my opinions...

P2W games are companies finding a way to profit off the overly competitive "gamer jocks" that aren't good at "real" sports, people with gambling addictions, and people with too much money.

I CAN understand people wanting to pay to "skip" a lot of grinding, but givng them things that cannot be reasonably obtained through the F2P, if at all, is just bad form, and often leaves the people that grind to the top a sour taste that ultimately hurts the game in the long run.

Personally, I just avoid most online multiplayer PvP and F2P-P2W games entirely.
Doing anything the game doesn't intend you too do(Using glitches, Using cheat mods)

(unless the game supports mods and you use said mods then that ain't cheating)
最近の変更はgantryが行いました; 2017年6月1日 23時43分
Sir Dookface McFerretballs の投稿を引用:
☢» MACHIN3 «☢ の投稿を引用:

lol like the last part...

but at least you agree that the term cheating appliers to it all. The main issue I had was people saying I was an imbecile becuase they don't agree that P2W is cheating lol. I may not agree with them but not going to go to the extreme of calling them crap to back my opinions...

P2W games are companies finding a way to profit off the overly competitive "gamer jocks" that aren't good at "real" sports, people with gambling addictions, and people with too much money.

I CAN understand people wanting to pay to "skip" a lot of grinding, but givng them things that cannot be reasonably obtained through the F2P, if at all, is just bad form, and often leaves the people that grind to the top a sour taste that ultimately hurts the game in the long run.

Personally, I just avoid most online multiplayer PvP and F2P-P2W games entirely.
P@W is a sales model which fits a certain demographic. It was originally assumed as a compensation point for gamers with less time to grid levels. The issue is real gamers see that as a sin. Which is a real odd quandary, as gamers worth their weight are FAR Superior that gamers who op in, through cash. Yet the general good vs ♥♥♥♥ stay the same versus hardware, and in 6 months you either see those ♥♥♥♥ players die off as they suck or they spin on into top-shelf games.

This comment is mostly a biased one, as how do a cash player get the same gear I get. The difference is immediately apparent, ad should offer those players so real honor, They take the cash monkeys apart, and only those with the skill to stand with them are left. They prove they are the head of barter town.

Ok. this rarely happens, I am going to ask you dook... do you feel what I am saying!!!!
最近の変更は😼Studio Cat😼が行いました; 2017年6月2日 0時05分
Forgive my errors. I corrected as I could. 3 days o sleep is killing do to my, uh, plague...
Using cheating software or using game exploits and bugs (such as hole in map that allows to go throught wall or under floor)

Hardware cheating, such as recoil compensation in mouse driver.

Quitting game in DayZ few seconds before you killed. It allowed you to survive and reconnect. I dont know if they fixed it (never played game, only watches some youtube letspaly)

Many mods in World of Warcraft.

Mods in World of Tanks, even though for some reason they are allowed. Things like remove leaves from trees, or show most vulnerable spots on each tank. It also makes game look so ugly, ruining all aesthetics.

Some people see only externail software as cheating, and anything that wont cause automated anti-cheat ban is not cheating, but I do not agree with them.


Pay2win is not cheating, it's just unfair business model from game maker.

最近の変更は僕の名前 (仮)が行いました; 2017年6月2日 0時33分
☢» MACHIN3 «☢ の投稿を引用:
I have had this arguement for some time now with several people in a few game discussions and would like to see what more people think on this topic...

What do you consider cheating in a game? If you go by the legal definition of cheat it means:

Cheat (verb) to act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, especially in a game or examination

The arguemtent I have been having is that buying things in games (i.e. weapons, armor, etc..) that give you an advantage or bypasses the "earning" period to achieve the same content others take time to get would fall within the definition of cheating but since the developeres of the game allow it they now call this Pay 2 win...

So.. Do you consider Pay 2 win the same as cheating?

I was about to quote pretty much the definition at you, but you brought up a thought provoking theory with Pay 2 Win games.....theoretically one could argue either way on those. But I would say its not cheating because the player purchasing said advantage is not acting dishonestly or unfairly, they are utilizing the tools the game was designed around for advantage....this would be like playing Call of Duty without using any of the subsequent unlocks and only the default basic class loadouts....its a mechanic of the game so therefore is not cheating, unlike knowingly exploiting the game through external software.

....that being said I don't like P2W games as a concept....I remember playing some in years past and it definitely is frustrating to be the one at a disadvantage.
Eva 2017年6月2日 4時05分 
illicit actions that give you an advantage over the ones that dont cheat. could be hacks. could be exploits.

altough i wouldnt punish people who take advantage of exploits because its rather stupid to punish someone for finding a use for game mechanics that put them on an advantage.
Cheating is: When two parties forge an agreement, then one side proceeds into violating it.

Cheating is: When you play a videogame, prop up the console, input a code and get an unintended and obviously unfair, effect.

Cheating is: When you return home dead tired from a full day's work, only to find your soulmate riding someone you don't know, in your stead.

Pay 2 win is obviously cheating, yes. Both inside videogames and in real life. You earn nothing, your money earns you the goods.
最近の変更はCaptain Morganが行いました; 2017年6月2日 12時11分
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全スレッド > Steam 掲示板 > Off Topic > トピックの詳細
投稿日: 2017年6月1日 21時21分
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