Request for Removal of the Dislike Button on Steam Workshop Items

[FirePrince]

Dear Steam Team,

I hope this message finds you well. I am writing to express my concerns regarding the Dislike button on Steam Workshop items and to request its removal. The presence of the Dislike button has several negative impacts on the community and the overall user experience. Here are the key issues:

1. **Unfair Impact on Ranking Lists**: The Dislike button significantly skews the ranking algorithms, often pushing down high-quality content unjustly. This can lead to excellent mods and workshop items being buried under less relevant content, simply due to a few dislikes.

2. **Encourages Misuse**: Unfortunately, the Dislike button invites misuse. Users can downvote items out of spite, competition, or personal bias rather than on the actual quality or utility of the item. This behavior undermines the purpose of the Workshop, which is to celebrate and share creative works.

3. **Negative Community Atmosphere**: The ability to dislike items publicly can foster a negative environment. Creators may feel discouraged and demoralized by seeing their work disliked, which can stifle creativity and reduce the overall number of contributions to the Workshop.

4. **Lack of Constructive Feedback**: A simple dislike does not provide any constructive feedback to creators. Unlike comments or reviews, dislikes offer no information on what aspects of the item might need improvement, making it difficult for creators to enhance their work based on user input.

5. **Disproportionate Influence of Early Feedback**: Items often receive a disproportionate number of dislikes shortly after release, which can set a negative tone and affect their long-term reception. Early negative feedback can prevent items from gaining the visibility they deserve, regardless of their true quality.

6. **Psychological Impact on Creators**: Receiving dislikes can have a demoralizing effect on creators, leading to frustration and a decreased willingness to share future projects. This can result in a decline in the diversity and richness of content available on the Workshop.

Given these concerns, I kindly request that the Dislike button be removed from Steam Workshop items. Instead, encouraging users to leave constructive feedback through comments and reviews would be a more effective way to maintain a positive and supportive community.

Thank you for considering this request. I believe that removing the Dislike button will foster a more encouraging environment for creators and enhance the overall experience for all users.

Best regards

[Anonymous Helper]

All that applies to like button as well so Valve should remove both or are you suggesting making Steam Workshop an echo chamber where only positive opinions are allowed? Negative opinions are usually more valid than positive ones anyway.

Case in point: I tend to read only negative reviews when considering if I want to purchase game or not. Most of the positive reviews are useless for that beyond overall rating for the game.

[Zefar]

If all you have is an upvote button, everything would be overwhelming positive.

Dislike button is needed.

[Lily McFluffy Butt]

Originally posted by FirePrince:

Dear Steam Team,

I hope this message finds you well. I am writing to express my concerns regarding the Dislike button on Steam Workshop items and to request its removal. The presence of the Dislike button has several negative impacts on the community and the overall user experience. Here are the key issues:

1. **Unfair Impact on Ranking Lists**: The Dislike button significantly skews the ranking algorithms, often pushing down high-quality content unjustly. This can lead to excellent mods and workshop items being buried under less relevant content, simply due to a few dislikes.

2. **Encourages Misuse**: Unfortunately, the Dislike button invites misuse. Users can downvote items out of spite, competition, or personal bias rather than on the actual quality or utility of the item. This behavior undermines the purpose of the Workshop, which is to celebrate and share creative works.

3. **Negative Community Atmosphere**: The ability to dislike items publicly can foster a negative environment. Creators may feel discouraged and demoralized by seeing their work disliked, which can stifle creativity and reduce the overall number of contributions to the Workshop.

4. **Lack of Constructive Feedback**: A simple dislike does not provide any constructive feedback to creators. Unlike comments or reviews, dislikes offer no information on what aspects of the item might need improvement, making it difficult for creators to enhance their work based on user input.

5. **Disproportionate Influence of Early Feedback**: Items often receive a disproportionate number of dislikes shortly after release, which can set a negative tone and affect their long-term reception. Early negative feedback can prevent items from gaining the visibility they deserve, regardless of their true quality.

6. **Psychological Impact on Creators**: Receiving dislikes can have a demoralizing effect on creators, leading to frustration and a decreased willingness to share future projects. This can result in a decline in the diversity and richness of content available on the Workshop.

Given these concerns, I kindly request that the Dislike button be removed from Steam Workshop items. Instead, encouraging users to leave constructive feedback through comments and reviews would be a more effective way to maintain a positive and supportive community.

Thank you for considering this request. I believe that removing the Dislike button will foster a more encouraging environment for creators and enhance the overall experience for all users.

Best regards

Yeah no. If dislikes affect you this much, then maybe the internet in general is too much for you. I post mods too, and dislikes have never been an issue. If you're getting massive amounts of dislikes, maybe it's a quality issue than the community just being negative.

[Ben Lubar]

The dislike button means people will click that instead of posting comments saying that the addon is bad. And asking a LLM to write your post for you shows how little thought or care went into your post.

[CANCELCULTURE]

Originally posted by Anonymous Helper:

All that applies to like button as well so Valve should remove both or are you suggesting making Steam Workshop an echo chamber where only positive opinions are allowed? Negative opinions are usually more valid than positive ones anyway.

Case in point: I tend to read only negative reviews when considering if I want to purchase game or not. Most of the positive reviews are useless for that beyond overall rating for the game.

dislike buttons don't even show the static count of people that dislike anyway

Valve instead uses some funny math-washing calculation to lower the count on the shown likes number for every dislike

Where are the dislikes counts?

https://store.steampowered.com/news/collection/steam/?emclan=103582791457287600&emgid=6216734321444879616

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3258856495

I don't even see that workshop ugc shows number of likes or dislikes, so what's the point?
They sure show the number of awards though. And exactly how is the 5 star rating determined?
https://steamcommunity.com/?subsection=workshop

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3258346482 4 stars 44 ratings?

[Spawn of Totoro]

Originally posted by Zefar:

If all you have is an upvote button, everything would be overwhelming positive.

Dislike button is needed.

Agreed.

Originally posted by CANCELCULTURE:

Originally posted by Anonymous Helper:

All that applies to like button as well so Valve should remove both or are you suggesting making Steam Workshop an echo chamber where only positive opinions are allowed? Negative opinions are usually more valid than positive ones anyway.

Case in point: I tend to read only negative reviews when considering if I want to purchase game or not. Most of the positive reviews are useless for that beyond overall rating for the game.

dislike buttons don't even show the static count of people that dislike anyway

Valve instead uses some funny math-washing calculation to lower the count on the shown likes number for every dislike

Where are the dislikes counts?

https://store.steampowered.com/news/collection/steam/?emclan=103582791457287600&emgid=6216734321444879616

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3258856495

I don't even see that workshop ugc shows number of likes or dislikes, so what's the point?
They sure show the number of awards though. And exactly how is the 5 star rating determined?
https://steamcommunity.com/?subsection=workshop

As you pointed out, it does have an effect on the rating. There would be no rating, if there wasn't an up and down vote.

The math is a basic percentage calculation. The more votes, the more accurate it becomes. Nothing really "funny" about it.

For workshop items, there is a place for the owner of the item to view the likes and dislikes. It is listed under "Item Stats" on their workshop page. It just isn't made public as it isn't really relevant when you have the overall rating.

This is what it looks like for the owner of the workshop item:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3258926506

[Nx Machina]

Working as intended.

Great mod

Needs work

[GGcake]

Remove workshop together. Problem solved

[FirePrince]

OK, to be more clear and on point. Yes, the text is written entirely by an LLM and I just fully agree with it, so yes, it's that simple. I've made a lot of mods over the years, so I know what I'm talking about.
So let the LLM answer and just state the facts the AI has analyzed:

Originally posted by LLM:

While the Dislike button might seem like a helpful tool for expressing negativity, its current implementation on the Steam Workshop creates more problems than solutions. Here's why:

1. Unbalanced Impact: Dislikes hold undue weight on ranking lists compared to Likes. A single Dislike can outweigh several Likes, unfairly hindering the visibility of potentially good content.
   
2. Misrepresentation of Quality (Echo Chamber): The Dislike button doesn't accurately reflect an item's quality, only that someone didn't like it (or misunderstood it). This subjectivity allows a few biased users to disproportionately affect an item's visibility, often burying high-quality mods. A mod disliked for its art style might have excellent gameplay, but the Dislike button creates an echo chamber where only the most popular styles rise, stifling diversity.
   
3. Discouragement for Creators (Psychological Impact): The current system disproportionately punishes mods with even a few Dislikes. The fear of receiving undeserved Dislikes can be discouraging for new and existing creators. It can stifle creativity and reduce the overall quality and quantity of Workshop submissions. Discourages Experimentation: Fear of Dislikes discourages creators from trying new ideas or taking creative risks. This homogenizes the Workshop and limits the potential for innovation. This makes it difficult for them to improve their work.
   
4. Susceptibility to Abuse (Unreliable Signal): The Dislike button is vulnerable to misuse. Groups, competitors, trolls, or even automated bots can easily manipulate the system through botting or coordinated campaigns, unfairly burying content they dislike.
   
5. Promotion of a Negative Atmosphere: The presence of a Dislike button cultivates a negative atmosphere where users focus on what they don't like rather than what they do. This undermines the spirit of collaboration and support that is crucial for a thriving creative community. Harassment Tool: Dislike brigades can be used to harass creators they dislike. This negativity creates a hostile environment and discourages participation.

Here's an alternative approach to consider: Would you rather see a Workshop full of hidden gems simply because they received a few undeserved Dislikes, or a platform that promotes the best content based on genuine user interest?

A Better Way Forward, alternatives to Dislikes, instead let's focus on:

• Improved Reporting System: Instead of Dislikes, a more robust reporting system for malicious content (bugs, stolen assets, etc.) would be beneficial. This allows Steam to address genuine issues effectively.
  
• Detailed Reviews: Encourage users to leave constructive criticism that helps creators improve.
  
• Upvotes and Awards: Highlighting good content through Likes and Awards is a more positive and informative way to promote quality creations. By emphasizing Likes and positive feedback, we can create a more encouraging environment for creators. This allows high-quality content to rise naturally based on genuine user interest. Users can organically promote the content they enjoy.

In conclusion, the Dislike button does far more harm than good. It does not provide meaningful feedback, it promotes toxicity, and it discourages creativity. Removing this feature would lead to a more positive, supportive environment where creators feel encouraged to share their work and users can engage in constructive dialogue.

Thank you for considering these points. Let's focus on building a community that fosters creativity and collaboration, rather than one that enables negativity and discouragement.

In my personal view, the Dislike button is completely unnecessary and even ridiculous. A better indicator of an item's quality would be the subscribe and unsubscribe ratio (additional to the existing system). As a creator of complex Stellaris mods that require updates every couple of months and if this receiving numerous downvotes there is not much motivation to update or continue this mod anymore. If my mod has 20K subscribers, I'd rather re-upload it than update it due to excessive downvotes. This trend forces some creators to release a new version of their mod with every vanilla update (which should be somehow inefficient).

I’ve also experienced a significant drop in rankings (about 20 places) due to a single downvote, which seems disproportionate. Additionally, the "Most Subscribed" list is flawed. It features mods that are eight years old, not updated, and with much fewer subscribers than newer, more relevant mods, yet they still rank at the top. This outdated ranking system undermines the discovery of current and functional mods.

Best regards

[Spawn of Totoro]

Originally posted by FirePrince:

OK, to be more clear and on point. Yes, the text is written entirely by an LLM and I just fully agree with it, so yes, it's that simple. I've made a lot of mods over the years, so I know what I'm talking about.
So let the LLM answer and just state the facts the AI has analyzed:

Originally posted by LLM:

While the Dislike button might seem like a helpful tool for expressing negativity, its current implementation on the Steam Workshop creates more problems than solutions. Here's why:

1. Unbalanced Impact: Dislikes hold undue weight on ranking lists compared to Likes. A single Dislike can outweigh several Likes, unfairly hindering the visibility of potentially good content.
   
2. Misrepresentation of Quality (Echo Chamber): The Dislike button doesn't accurately reflect an item's quality, only that someone didn't like it (or misunderstood it). This subjectivity allows a few biased users to disproportionately affect an item's visibility, often burying high-quality mods. A mod disliked for its art style might have excellent gameplay, but the Dislike button creates an echo chamber where only the most popular styles rise, stifling diversity.
   
3. Discouragement for Creators (Psychological Impact): The current system disproportionately punishes mods with even a few Dislikes. The fear of receiving undeserved Dislikes can be discouraging for new and existing creators. It can stifle creativity and reduce the overall quality and quantity of Workshop submissions. Discourages Experimentation: Fear of Dislikes discourages creators from trying new ideas or taking creative risks. This homogenizes the Workshop and limits the potential for innovation. This makes it difficult for them to improve their work.
   
4. Susceptibility to Abuse (Unreliable Signal): The Dislike button is vulnerable to misuse. Groups, competitors, trolls, or even automated bots can easily manipulate the system through botting or coordinated campaigns, unfairly burying content they dislike.
   
5. Promotion of a Negative Atmosphere: The presence of a Dislike button cultivates a negative atmosphere where users focus on what they don't like rather than what they do. This undermines the spirit of collaboration and support that is crucial for a thriving creative community. Harassment Tool: Dislike brigades can be used to harass creators they dislike. This negativity creates a hostile environment and discourages participation.

Here's an alternative approach to consider: Would you rather see a Workshop full of hidden gems simply because they received a few undeserved Dislikes, or a platform that promotes the best content based on genuine user interest?

A Better Way Forward, alternatives to Dislikes, instead let's focus on:

• Improved Reporting System: Instead of Dislikes, a more robust reporting system for malicious content (bugs, stolen assets, etc.) would be beneficial. This allows Steam to address genuine issues effectively.
  
• Detailed Reviews: Encourage users to leave constructive criticism that helps creators improve.
  
• Upvotes and Awards: Highlighting good content through Likes and Awards is a more positive and informative way to promote quality creations. By emphasizing Likes and positive feedback, we can create a more encouraging environment for creators. This allows high-quality content to rise naturally based on genuine user interest. Users can organically promote the content they enjoy.

In conclusion, the Dislike button does far more harm than good. It does not provide meaningful feedback, it promotes toxicity, and it discourages creativity. Removing this feature would lead to a more positive, supportive environment where creators feel encouraged to share their work and users can engage in constructive dialogue.

Thank you for considering these points. Let's focus on building a community that fosters creativity and collaboration, rather than one that enables negativity and discouragement.

In my personal view, the Dislike button is completely unnecessary and even ridiculous. A better indicator of an item's quality would be the subscribe and unsubscribe ratio (additional to the existing system). As a creator of complex Stellaris mods that require updates every couple of months and if this receiving numerous downvotes there is not much motivation to update or continue this mod anymore. If my mod has 20K subscribers, I'd rather re-upload it than update it due to excessive downvotes. This trend forces some creators to release a new version of their mod with every vanilla update (which should be somehow inefficient).

I’ve also experienced a significant drop in rankings (about 20 places) due to a single downvote, which seems disproportionate. Additionally, the "Most Subscribed" list is flawed. It features mods that are eight years old, not updated, and with much fewer subscribers than newer, more relevant mods, yet they still rank at the top. This outdated ranking system undermines the discovery of current and functional mods.

Best regards

Using AI for your argument is a bad idea. It really isn't a reliable way to post an argument and often has many errors. It has been know to state false and non-existent case laws, leading to a fine for the lawyers as well.

There are issues too, with the one you posted. I see so many counter arguments in the same article, it is ridicules. You really should re-read it.

Subscribe and unsubscribe ratio is a horrible and inaccurate way of doing it. People can and do subscribe to a mod, then dislike a game and refund it. You can even subscribe to mods for games you do not own.

There are other who unsubscribe from mods after beating a game.

Subscribe and unsubscribe ratio would be very chaotic with it changing far more then a rating.

The most subscribed is just that, the most subscribed. You already pointed out another huge flaw in using it as such. Mods not being updated or no longer working will always be an issue. I tend to look at most popular (that uses the rating) or recently updated... both, if there is an option to do so.

Making a lot of mods doesn't mean you know any better about the rating system then anyone else here, just that you have made a lot of mods. Valve, however, does know about the rating system and how it works. Best to leave it up to those with the number and statistics.

[Lily McFluffy Butt]

OP, it feels like you put way too much emotional focus on the ratings of your mods. It's clear the dislikes upset you, no matter what kind of "facts" you try to hide behind. If you can't handle dislikes, internet content creation might just not be the thing for you. And considering you have to go out of your way to see them, this seems rather unhealthy for you.

[Ben Lubar]

I have unsubscribed from many more mods than I have rated as bad. Sometimes you're just done using a mod and you didn't have a bad experience. Sometimes you hit subscribe by accident and immediately hit unsubscribe. There are many reasons why someone might unsubscribe from a mod without hating it.

[B✪✪tsy]

Originally posted by Anonymous Helper:

All that applies to like button as well so Valve should remove both or are you suggesting making Steam Workshop an echo chamber where only positive opinions are allowed? Negative opinions are usually more valid than positive ones anyway.

Case in point: I tend to read only negative reviews when considering if I want to purchase game or not. Most of the positive reviews are useless for that beyond overall rating for the game.

Twitter does not have a dislike button. It's more or less the same thing, content is content.

And as for the reviews, I also usually read the negative reviews first. With the dislikes people leave bieind on workshop items there is nothing to read, the dislike is meaningless while it does have an effect on the visibility rating of the workshop item.

[FirePrince]

I rather suggest a downvote for comments on Steam like in Youtube.
A downvote for a modder is like a slap in the face and means "it's not finished yet" (even if the mod itself says it's in beta and not finished yet).

It's just funny to read the comments and non-arguments here. But I accept the counter-arguments at Subscribe and Unsubscribe.

@Lily McFluffy Butt: is just going personal for no reason. I mean writing a topic fully from an LLM should be most impersonal what I (or you) can do here.

@Spawn of Totoro: just saying the arguments are false because they are from an LLM without arguing, makes no sense in terms solving the problem. It just saying, because someone was false in the past he will be forever not reliable.
But I honor you give a longer answer.
But that you are saying ""Making a lot of mods doesn't mean you know any better about the rating system then anyone else here" is just completely illogical conclusion and just another attempt to neutralize my point of view with non-arguments.

[Ben Lubar]

Originally posted by FirePrince:

@Spawn of Totoro: just saying the arguments are false because they are from an LLM without arguing, makes no sense in terms solving the problem. It just saying, because someone was false in the past he will be forever not reliable.

A machine designed to produce plausible sounding false information isn't trustworthy just because you waited a few months and asked it again.