Steam Client for Apple Chips
I want to be able to use my Mac without having to install Rosetta for most of my apps. Could you please release a version of the Steam Client for Apple Chips?
Senast ändrad av TheHadouJHyrule; 29 dec, 2020 @ 1:05
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Visar 1-15 av 19 kommentarer
Cathulhu 29 dec, 2020 @ 1:19 
What for? I'm not aware of a Steamgame that got updated for M1. I'm pretty sure that most devs won't bother and will leave Mac OS for good after all those stunts that Apple pulled.
Ursprungligen skrivet av Cathulhu:
What for? I'm not aware of a Steamgame that got updated for M1. I'm pretty sure that most devs won't bother and will leave Mac OS for good after all those stunts that Apple pulled.

As if they haven't already when Mac stopped supporting all 32 bit applications
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
I want to be able to use my Mac without having to install Rosetta for most of my apps. Could you please release a version of the Steam Client for Apple Chips?

Why?

macOS
  • Disabled “Enable GPU accelerated rendering in web views” and “Enable hardware video decoding” settings on Apple M1 devices due to poor HW-accelerated performance currently through Rosetta.

https://store.steampowered.com/oldnews/79170

:qr:
Mad Scientist 29 dec, 2020 @ 9:09 
The market for that OS is far too low and the company has questionable practices from factory, right to repair, proprietary systems and other ethical issues such as forcing x64.

Not even worth the cost of manpower, imo.
If you want performance or to use the Steam Client without issues, you know what you need to do.
Satoru 29 dec, 2020 @ 11:00 
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
I want to be able to use my Mac without having to install Rosetta for most of my apps. Could you please release a version of the Steam Client for Apple Chips?

Do you actually understand what the entire M1 apple silcon conversion means?

Your games now officially are absolutely totally screwed. In a few more years Apple will kill Rosetta and ALL YOUR STEAM GAMES WILL STOP WORKING.

Apple already made gamedevs mad with

1) Deprecating 32-bit increasing whining from Apple users
2) Making idiotic 64-bit warnings as if it was the devs fault
3) Making devs 'digitally sign' all their games and for every update which oh wait you have keep paying apple for
4) Deprecating OpenGL which will make your game stop working even if Rosetta doesnt kill them first

Gamedevs are abandoning Apple because apple does not care about games and makes making games on Apple even worse than dealing with Linux users, which says a lot
Senast ändrad av Satoru; 29 dec, 2020 @ 11:01
Ursprungligen skrivet av Satoru:
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
I want to be able to use my Mac without having to install Rosetta for most of my apps. Could you please release a version of the Steam Client for Apple Chips?

Do you actually understand what the entire M1 apple silcon conversion means?

Your games now officially are absolutely totally screwed. In a few more years Apple will kill Rosetta and ALL YOUR STEAM GAMES WILL STOP WORKING.

Apple already made gamedevs mad with

1) Deprecating 32-bit increasing whining from Apple users
2) Making idiotic 64-bit warnings as if it was the devs fault
3) Making devs 'digitally sign' all their games and for every update which oh wait you have keep paying apple for
4) Deprecating OpenGL which will make your game stop working even if Rosetta doesnt kill them first

Gamedevs are abandoning Apple because apple does not care about games and makes making games on Apple even worse than dealing with Linux users, which says a lot

I'll provide a TL:DR

If you think gaming on a Mac was a joke before, you have an even funnier joke coming along.
Ursprungligen skrivet av Lily McFluffy Butt:
Ursprungligen skrivet av Satoru:

Do you actually understand what the entire M1 apple silcon conversion means?

Your games now officially are absolutely totally screwed. In a few more years Apple will kill Rosetta and ALL YOUR STEAM GAMES WILL STOP WORKING.

Apple already made gamedevs mad with

1) Deprecating 32-bit increasing whining from Apple users
2) Making idiotic 64-bit warnings as if it was the devs fault
3) Making devs 'digitally sign' all their games and for every update which oh wait you have keep paying apple for
4) Deprecating OpenGL which will make your game stop working even if Rosetta doesnt kill them first

Gamedevs are abandoning Apple because apple does not care about games and makes making games on Apple even worse than dealing with Linux users, which says a lot

I'll provide a TL:DR

If you think gaming on a Mac was a joke before, you have an even funnier joke coming along.
1) Apple deprecated 32-bit apps as a security measure because they are less secure than 64-bit apps.
2) Apple has this anti-malware detection system on their operating systems, and when an app developer begins spreading malware, the detection system requires all developers to digitally sign their apps, so they can revoke the certificates of those developers that are are actually spreading malware to help protect your Mac. Sure, they may have to pay for it, but it's all necessary to help hold developers accountable, in case they ever start to take the dark path of cybercrime.
3) OpenGL is property of Hewett-Packard, a company that Apple no longer has licensing rights to their technologies, which is why OpenGL was deprecated on the Mac in the first place.
4) Apple is discontinuing production of Intel processors in their Macs because of the lack of processors being supplied.
5) Apple is discontinuing support of AMD discrete graphics in their Macs because AMD is now attempting to compete with Apple. The same thing can be said about NVIDIA dedicated graphics, which is why Apple had to develop their own chip, so that they could stay in the market and avoid going bankrupt.

Being said, I don't think Apple is abandoning the gaming market, and neither are the developers. The only way games and software made by a developer would stop working is if the developer went out-of-business or the licensing rights of a game or software title was revoked by the developer away from the publisher, which would result in an absence of updates, and is not Apple's fault. That kind of decision is made by the developers themselves, and not Apple. You should really think it over next time before you two jump to conclusions that gaming on the Mac is a joke.
Senast ändrad av TheHadouJHyrule; 7 jan, 2021 @ 11:10
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
Ursprungligen skrivet av Lily McFluffy Butt:

I'll provide a TL:DR

If you think gaming on a Mac was a joke before, you have an even funnier joke coming along.
1) Apple deprecated 32-bit apps as a security measure because they are less secure than 64-bit apps.
2) Apple has this anti-malware detection system on their operating systems, and when an app developer begins spreading malware, the detection system requires all developers to digitally sign their apps, so they can revoke the certificates of those developers that are are actually spreading malware to help protect your Mac. Sure, they may have to pay for it, but it's all necessary to help hold developers accountable, in case they ever start to take the dark path of cybercrime.
3) OpenGL is property of Hewett-Packard, a company that Apple no longer has licensing rights to their technologies, which is why OpenGL was deprecated on the Mac in the first place.
4) Apple is discontinuing production of Intel processors in their Macs because of the lack of processors being supplied.
5) Apple is discontinuing support of AMD discrete graphics in their Macs because AMD is now attempting to compete with Apple. The same thing can be said about NVIDIA dedicated graphics, which is why Apple had to develop their own chip, so that they could stay in the market and avoid going bankrupt.

Being said, I don't think Apple is abandoning the gaming market, and neither are the developers. The only way games and software made by a developer would stop working is if the developer went out-of-business or the licensing rights of a game or software title was revoked by the developer away from the publisher, which would result in an absence of updates, and is not Apple's fault. That kind of decision is made by the developers themselves, and not Apple. You should really think it over next time before you two jump to conclusions that gaming on the Mac is a joke.

1. Security measure? That's their lame excuse? And this excuse is made even lamer by your second point.
2. Someone doesn't just go ahead and make a well-known program, then add malware later. That'd kill their profits because people would pirate the safe version. If something has viruses, it's always had viruses. And Macs are not 100% safe from viruses. They just don't get as many because not as many people use Macs.
3. That's Apple's problem for not renewing the license, isn't it?
4. Lack of processors being supplied? Is this a joke? Can they not bulk order them since Apple is incredibly rich?
5. I wonder why companies might try to compete with Apple, hmmm... Also Apple going bankrupt? That's hilarious.

If Apple isn't intentionally screwing themselves out of the gaming market, then they're doing it by accident through sheer incompetence. They can come up with all the reasons and excuses they want, but at the end of the day, if they stop supporting what many games, new and old, still use, they're going to fail in that regard.
Ursprungligen skrivet av Lily McFluffy Butt:
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
1) Apple deprecated 32-bit apps as a security measure because they are less secure than 64-bit apps.
2) Apple has this anti-malware detection system on their operating systems, and when an app developer begins spreading malware, the detection system requires all developers to digitally sign their apps, so they can revoke the certificates of those developers that are are actually spreading malware to help protect your Mac. Sure, they may have to pay for it, but it's all necessary to help hold developers accountable, in case they ever start to take the dark path of cybercrime.
3) OpenGL is property of Hewett-Packard, a company that Apple no longer has licensing rights to their technologies, which is why OpenGL was deprecated on the Mac in the first place.
4) Apple is discontinuing production of Intel processors in their Macs because of the lack of processors being supplied.
5) Apple is discontinuing support of AMD discrete graphics in their Macs because AMD is now attempting to compete with Apple. The same thing can be said about NVIDIA dedicated graphics, which is why Apple had to develop their own chip, so that they could stay in the market and avoid going bankrupt.

Being said, I don't think Apple is abandoning the gaming market, and neither are the developers. The only way games and software made by a developer would stop working is if the developer went out-of-business or the licensing rights of a game or software title was revoked by the developer away from the publisher, which would result in an absence of updates, and is not Apple's fault. That kind of decision is made by the developers themselves, and not Apple. You should really think it over next time before you two jump to conclusions that gaming on the Mac is a joke.

1. Security measure? That's their lame excuse? And this excuse is made even lamer by your second point.
2. Someone doesn't just go ahead and make a well-known program, then add malware later. That'd kill their profits because people would pirate the safe version. If something has viruses, it's always had viruses. And Macs are not 100% safe from viruses. They just don't get as many because not as many people use Macs.
3. That's Apple's problem for not renewing the license, isn't it?
4. Lack of processors being supplied? Is this a joke? Can they not bulk order them since Apple is incredibly rich?
5. I wonder why companies might try to compete with Apple, hmmm... Also Apple going bankrupt? That's hilarious.

If Apple isn't intentionally screwing themselves out of the gaming market, then they're doing it by accident through sheer incompetence. They can come up with all the reasons and excuses they want, but at the end of the day, if they stop supporting what many games, new and old, still use, they're going to fail in that regard.
1) It's not an excuse. It's just common knowledge.
2) You're right! App developers don't add malware later. However, manual background checks for malware often go unnoticed. Apple created this detection system to weed out the bad developers they missed in their background checks.
3) Apple didn't have a choice in renewing their license with HP. HP wouldn't offer them the option to renew because, like AMD and NVIDIA, they wanted to compete against them.
4) It is not a joke! Intel couldn't keep up with the demand for their processors, which is why their partnership will eventually end.
5) Companies wanted to introduce their own technologies for their own products, which is why many computer component partnerships are being revoked, because they don't want to share their profits with other companies. On top of that, I can reassure you that Apple is NOT going bankrupt! Also, I find your hate for Apple disgusting.

Being said, it's like you don't even care about Apple that you wouldn't even care to read my comment in its entirety. Bottom line, if you're not going to read my comment completely and acknowledge it, then don't, but this is no place for negative comments. You would know if you read the Steam Community Guidelines.
Washell 7 jan, 2021 @ 11:48 
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
5) Apple is discontinuing support of AMD discrete graphics in their Macs because AMD is now attempting to compete with Apple. The same thing can be said about NVIDIA dedicated graphics, which is why Apple had to develop their own chip, so that they could stay in the market and avoid going bankrupt.
Apple worrying about bankruptcy:

https://i.imgur.com/xSD0YwI.png

As for the rest of your points, Apple wants everything in house for full control, and full profit margin. The reasons they give are just window dressing so don't appear too evil.
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
Being said, I don't think Apple is abandoning the gaming market, and neither are the developers.
Apple can't abandon what they never supported anyway. Developers however will make a simple cost/benefits analysis. If it costs more to make an M1 version of their game than they expect to sell, bye bye apple.
Senast ändrad av Washell; 7 jan, 2021 @ 11:50
Ursprungligen skrivet av Washell:
Apple worrying about bankruptcy:

https://i.imgur.com/xSD0YwI.png
I can't believe how many haters are living in this world. It's just too sad.
Ursprungligen skrivet av Washell:
Apple can't abandon what they never supported anyway. Developers however will make a simple cost/benefits analysis. If it costs more to make an M1 version of their game than they expect to sell, bye bye apple.
You have a point there. Nobody should transition their apps if they can't afford it. However, if they wait too long, their app's current architecture will eventually be deprecated everywhere, as Apple is notorious for setting personal computing trends, and then the app developer will have no choice but to fold all because they ignored all the warning signs of potential overall deprecation. Do you really think they'd want that? I think not.
Senast ändrad av TheHadouJHyrule; 7 jan, 2021 @ 12:06
Washell 7 jan, 2021 @ 12:48 
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
I can't believe how many haters are living in this world. It's just too sad.
It's not hate, it's just a fact. A company with nigh on $200 billion in cash reserves and still printing money with their phones and tablets doesn't worry about bankruptcy.
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
as Apple is notorious for setting personal computing trends,
The last time Apple set a personal computing trend, as in PC's, not devices, was commercially shipping a system with a GUI in 1983. The last time Apple set a trend in PC gaming is never.

Apple's desktop devices have, apart from the early years when they had nearly exclusive market share of the publishing and graphical sectors, always been a niche market that sold on style first and function second. They've always been heavy handed in what would run, restricting the user but, in all honesty, do deliver a solid, stable system as a result.

But the decision to move to their own developed chip is to complete the ecosystem of phone, tablet, desktop (and soon car), have it all in own control for maximum stability, integration and, last but definitely not least, profit margin.

They've made 3 decisions in the last (two?) year(s) that are detrimental to gaming. Phasing out 32 bit support, depreciating openGL and moving to a non X86-64 based chip. Anyone who still persists gaming on an Apple really has only themselves to blame.

That said, both Unity and Unreal engine have beta versions running on the M1 chip, so maybe it's not all as bleak as it might appear to be.
Senast ändrad av Washell; 7 jan, 2021 @ 12:48
Ursprungligen skrivet av Washell:
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
I can't believe how many haters are living in this world. It's just too sad.
It's not hate, it's just a fact. A company with nigh on $200 billion in cash reserves and still printing money with their phones and tablets doesn't worry about bankruptcy.
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
as Apple is notorious for setting personal computing trends,
The last time Apple set a personal computing trend, as in PC's, not devices, was commercially shipping a system with a GUI in 1983. The last time Apple set a trend in PC gaming is never.

Apple's desktop devices have, apart from the early years when they had nearly exclusive market share of the publishing and graphical sectors, always been a niche market that sold on style first and function second. They've always been heavy handed in what would run, restricting the user but, in all honesty, do deliver a solid, stable system as a result.

But the decision to move to their own developed chip is to complete the ecosystem of phone, tablet, desktop (and soon car), have it all in own control for maximum stability, integration and, last but definitely not least, profit margin.

They've made 3 decisions in the last (two?) year(s) that are detrimental to gaming. Phasing out 32 bit support, depreciating openGL and moving to a non X86-64 based chip. Anyone who still persists gaming on an Apple really has only themselves to blame.

That said, both Unity and Unreal engine have beta versions running on the M1 chip, so maybe it's not all as bleak as it might appear to be.

In my opinion, people should just stop making video games and their engines compatible with Mac. Clearly, Apple doesn't care about gaming. Companies would lose, what, a few sales? Not "forced to fold" like what Hadou thinks would happen.
Wolfgang 7 jan, 2021 @ 13:02 
This whole discussion reminds me of this meme: https://pikabu.ru/story/myi_znaem_7632237
Senast ändrad av Wolfgang; 7 jan, 2021 @ 13:06
cinedine 7 jan, 2021 @ 13:19 
Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
Ursprungligen skrivet av Washell:
Apple worrying about bankruptcy:

https://i.imgur.com/xSD0YwI.png
I can't believe how many haters are living in this world. It's just too sad.
Ursprungligen skrivet av Washell:
Apple can't abandon what they never supported anyway. Developers however will make a simple cost/benefits analysis. If it costs more to make an M1 version of their game than they expect to sell, bye bye apple.
You have a point there. Nobody should transition their apps if they can't afford it. However, if they wait too long, their app's current architecture will eventually be deprecated everywhere, as Apple is notorious for setting personal computing trends, and then the app developer will have no choice but to fold all because they ignored all the warning signs of potential overall deprecation. Do you really think they'd want that? I think not.

I can't believe that there are still Apple fanboys in the world ...

Apple setting trends in personal computing? The mouse botton and the first GUI. That's literally it.
For them to set trends anywhere they have to open up their ecosystem and not closing it even more. And be affordable.

Ursprungligen skrivet av TheHadouJHyrule:
Ursprungligen skrivet av Lily McFluffy Butt:

I'll provide a TL:DR

If you think gaming on a Mac was a joke before, you have an even funnier joke coming along.
1) Apple deprecated 32-bit apps as a security measure because they are less secure than 64-bit apps.
2) Apple has this anti-malware detection system on their operating systems, and when an app developer begins spreading malware, the detection system requires all developers to digitally sign their apps, so they can revoke the certificates of those developers that are are actually spreading malware to help protect your Mac. Sure, they may have to pay for it, but it's all necessary to help hold developers accountable, in case they ever start to take the dark path of cybercrime.
3) OpenGL is property of Hewett-Packard, a company that Apple no longer has licensing rights to their technologies, which is why OpenGL was deprecated on the Mac in the first place.
4) Apple is discontinuing production of Intel processors in their Macs because of the lack of processors being supplied.
5) Apple is discontinuing support of AMD discrete graphics in their Macs because AMD is now attempting to compete with Apple. The same thing can be said about NVIDIA dedicated graphics, which is why Apple had to develop their own chip, so that they could stay in the market and avoid going bankrupt.

ad 1) They are not. At least not the 99.9 % that have no need for encryption.

ad 2) Digital signatures are a thing on Windows too. It's simply to verify that a patch or update is actually from the same company. Fun fact: the malicious Solarwind updates were digitally signed, too.

ad 3) OpenGL is free to use. That's the Open part in the name. It is also not owned by HP. It's maintained by Khronos Group and HP is not even a member anymore. On the other hand guess what: Apple is. Even of the highest tier.

ad 4+5) Nope. They simply desinged their own chips and don't need Intel anymore. ARM includes a graphics unit, so there is no need to include a dedicated one. AMD and Nvidia are nowhere competing with Apple nor does Apple compete with them.
It's all about controlling the supply chain and increase and obfuscate their already insane profit margins.

But hey, I hope the Kool Aid at least is tasty.
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Datum skrivet: 29 dec, 2020 @ 1:04
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