Steam reviews need a five star rating scale.

[FOXDUDE69]

The simplistic thumbs up or thumbs down thing can be very misleading. Games aren't just good or bad, there's a gradient there and I know you can explain your rating in the text but when you go to a store page and you see an "overwhelmingly positive" rating of 98%, you might think it's the hottest thing since Jessica Alba, only to buy the game and realize it's just a 4 out of 5 game.

But that's not the biggest problem, the biggest problem is when you have a game that is overall good but has some serious issues. Or a game that's just "good enough" for the price. The reviewer is forced to pick from positive or negative rating and since the experience was overall positive, they pick positive which usually results in games having a "very positive" rating, sitting around 85% when in reality it's a 2.5 or 3 out of 5 game.

The absolute worst scenario is one like Fallout 3's which is left in an abysmal state because of steam's lack of standards and Bethesda's let-the-fans-fix-it attitude resulting in a game that doesn't even launch without being modded by the paying costumer and requires further work to run well. Every new player needs to go through this process but the game is real good after you you spend a good amount of time fixing it, so they leave positive reviews... on a game that doesn't even launch. And it's sitting right now with a "mostly positive" rank on steam.

A simple five star rating scale would help a lot and provide a much more honest and accurate average rating.

Thank you for reading.

[cinedine]

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

Origineel geplaatst door cinedine:

What will be different? You so far failed to explain to me Steam's 78 % recommendations for FO 3 is any different to metacritics 7.8 user score.

Fallout 3 GOTY sells extremely well on GOG and it's not uncommon to see it among GOG's best sellers. There is absolutely no way for us to know just exactly how many of the Fallout 3 reviews on Metacritic come from GOG users, who enjoy a version of the game that is in a much better state compared to the Steam version.

Therefor, if Steam's score is 78% and the Metacritic score is also 7.8, this actually proves that the Steam score is inflated because it enjoys the same score as a score partly obtained from a users that have a version of the game that works out of the box and is more stable without the user having to do anything.

Thank you for proving my point.

That is of course assuming people with technical difficulties who think its an absolute burden to spend five minutes is a significant portion of the Steam user base.
And that these users would give 3 stars or less.

Here's food for thought: there are suggestion on these forums to dismiss reviews of technical ature because they are not reflective of the game and the milage will vary per user. Read: people who think that FO3 should have a higher "score" than it has.
I guess they are just stupid idiots for suggesting something like this.

[Nx Machina]

@ Foxdude

Still ignoring YOU have 90 hours proving it worked on Steam. https://ibb.co/qgTBCjS

or that others run it on Steam including the very first post on your thread from Reboot.

Origineel geplaatst door ReBoot:

Fallout 3 in fact launches very fine without modding. I tried it recently on my Windows 10 rig, without any modding, it works.

Or the video I posted showing it working with GFWL.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyupHUuCx2Y

But thanks once again for proving this is not just about a 5 star rating system.

You may also want to watch this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFU6HFC7z3I

[Quint the Alligator Snapper]

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

My, my still responding.

I respond when I want to, not when you decide whether it is appropriate.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

I stated on another thread "no more" with regard to that thread not any others

You're free to decide on your own whether to post. :)

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

Neither can you choose the client version, disabling auto-updates, list view etc but hey you keep on believing whilst in the meantime I'll sit back and say I told you so.

If you think this is about belief, you are sorely mistaken what the point of the suggestion is.

The point of the suggestion is to raise the idea of a 5-point rating system.

But you still think the thread is about Fallout 3.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

You always seem to confuse a suggestion with the adoption of an idea.

The suggestion always comes before the adoption of the idea.

[Nx Machina]

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

I respond when I want to, not when you decide whether it is appropriate.

My, my, still arguing and proving what I said on another thread, you cannot let go.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

You're free to decide on your own whether to post. :)

I already do and always have been free.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

If you think this is about belief, you are sorely mistaken what the point of the suggestion is.

This is about you wanting the status quo to change because it does not conform to what you WANT it to be. Reviews have to be written a certain way for you to accept them. They do not obviously need to be written to conform to your standard and unless you are writing the review you have no say at all in their construction.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

But you still think the thread is about Fallout 3..

The OP has mentioned Fallout 3 several times on this thread and you keep ignoring it.

Why not ask the OP why they deleted the thread I quoted.

Read: OP post.

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

The absolute worst scenario is one like Fallout 3's which is left in an abysmal state because of steam's lack of standards and Bethesda's let-the-fans-fix-it attitude resulting in a game that doesn't even launch without being modded by the paying costumer and requires further work to run well. Every new player needs to go through this process but the game is real good after you you spend a good amount of time fixing it, so they leave positive reviews... on a game that doesn't even launch. And it's sitting right now with a "mostly positive" rank on steam.

And the quote from the deleted thread.

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

Fallout 3 on Steam is in an abysmal state and the warning on the storefront that reads "Fallout 3 is not optimized for Windows 7 and later." is misleading because it underplays how broken the game actually is.

A more honest warning would read as follows: "Fallout 3 won't even launch without being modded by the player with fixes provided by the community which might not even work for you and further modding will be required in order to have a stable game experience."

The GOG version is in a much better state and, from what I can assess, with only a very small amount of people reporting issues, so I recommend you buy it there.

Notice any similarites?

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

The suggestion always comes before the adoption of the idea.

A suggestion always remains a suggestion UNITL and IF Valve deem it worthy.

[Quint the Alligator Snapper]

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

I respond when I want to, not when you decide whether it is appropriate.

My, my, still arguing and proving what I said on another thread, you cannot let go.

If you want to enjoy the feeling of being proven correct, please, go ahead and pleasure yourself.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

This is about you wanting the status quo to change because it does not conform to what you WANT it to be. Reviews have to be written a certain way for you to accept them. They do not obviously need to be written to conform to your standard and unless you are writing the review you have no say at all in their construction.

I have made no demands on what reviews get written at all in this thread, but for some reason you have thoroughly misunderstood what's going on.

This is about the rating system, not a demand for writing reviews in a certain way.
Specifically, this is a suggestion to give review writers more choice in how they present their reviews.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

The OP has mentioned Fallout 3 several times on this thread and you keep ignoring it.

You are the only one to keep claiming that this thread is about Fallout 3.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

The suggestion always comes before the adoption of the idea.

A suggestion always remains a suggestion UNITL and IF Valve deem it worthy.

And that is not for you to decide anyway.

[FOXDUDE69]

Origineel geplaatst door cinedine:

That is of course assuming people with technical difficulties who think its an absolute burden to spend five minutes is a significant portion of the Steam user base.
And that these users would give 3 stars or less.

Sure, mate. We can pretend people suddenly stopped factoring performance and technical issues into their reviews.
We also need to ignore the countless reviews on GOG that praise that version for being less prone to crashing and stuttering. Many of them reporting zero instances of these issues and often claiming the GOG version is the best version of the game, indicating they own others and some even mentioning the Steam version by name.

Origineel geplaatst door cinedine:

Here's food for thought: there are suggestion on these forums to dismiss reviews of technical ature because they are not reflective of the game and the milage will vary per user. Read: people who think that FO3 should have a higher "score" than it has.
I guess they are just stupid idiots for suggesting something like this.

One would be pretty foolish to suggest that, yes.
We are not talking about issues that only affect a minuscule percentage of the user base. And even if we were, it would still be wrong to silence those voices.
Performance directly impacts enjoyment and is a very important part of the game, it's even the main reason many of us choose PC gaming over console gaming.

Besides, any game that's so poorly optimized that the mileage would wildly vary on a per user basis would benefit from being reviewed on a wider rating scale so we can get a better idea of just how good or bad it really is from it's overall score.

[FOXDUDE69]

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

@ Foxdude

Still ignoring YOU have 90 hours proving it worked on Steam. https://ibb.co/qgTBCjS

I Ignore pointless arguments, yes.
The fact that I have 90 hours in the game doesn't erase reality.
The game is still broken and anyone installing it today is extremely likely to be met with a game that doesn't launch without being fixed and further modding is required to make the game less prone to crashing and stuttering.
Even if some person were to run the Steam version flawlessly out of the box, that still doesn't invalidate the overwhelming amount of accounts that document the exact opposite.

Your arguments are illogical and frankly child-like and that's why they get ignored. Sorry, Kusa-chan.

[Nx Machina]

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

If you want to enjoy the feeling of being proven correct, please, go ahead and pleasure yourself.

My, my the person who redefines definitions for everyone else and always needs to be right.

No - forced updates are this.

No - reviews need to be 5 star or neutral. I need them to be this.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

I have made no demands on what reviews get written at all in this thread, but for some reason you have thoroughly misunderstood what's going on.

You make demands all the time but you define them as opinions.

You really need to read your posts, saves so much egg on your face later.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

This is about the rating system, not a demand for writing reviews in a certain way.

This is about you WANTING something which is not available and everyone else is wrong.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

You are the only one to keep claiming that this thread is about Fallout 3.

Because it is,

Because the OP has brought it up several times and you ignore it.

Here you go directly under your post:

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

The fact that I have 90 hours in the game doesn't erase reality.
The game is still broken and anyone installing it today is extremely likely to be met with a game that doesn't launch without being fixed and further modding is required to make the game less prone to crashing and stuttering.
Even if some person were to run the Steam version flawlessly out of the box, that still doesn't invalidate the overwhelming amount of accounts that document the exact opposite.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

And that is not for you to decide anyway.

It is for Valve to decide, oddly a concept you fail to grasp but I suppose as with all things if you post about it long enough it will happen except for:

List view:

Client version choice:

Option to disable automatic updates:

Reviews written the way you want them to be.

And finally you having the ability to not reply and stick to your guns.

[Nx Machina]

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

I Ignore pointless arguments, yes.
The fact that I have 90 hours in the game doesn't erase reality.
The game is still broken and anyone installing it today is extremely likely to be met with a game that doesn't launch without being fixed and further modding is required to make the game less prone to crashing and stuttering.
Even if some person were to run the Steam version flawlessly out of the box, that still doesn't invalidate the overwhelming amount of accounts that document the exact opposite.

Your arguments are illogical and frankly child-like and that's why they get ignored. Sorry, Kusa-chan.

Always easy to ignore hypocrisy.

The reality that reviews are mostly positive.

The reality that you ignore anyone who has mentioned they have it running.

The reality that you have had the same gripe since 2017.

A broken game does not work at all. Fallout 3 does with a tweak or in my and Reboot's case no tweaking at all. Download and play.

By the way thanks for keep mentioning Fallout 3 and proving me right and Quint wrong when he keeps sating the thread is about 5 star ratings. Bless you.

Child-like? Kusa-chan?

Well done proving I am correct when you are lost for words and grasp at straws.

[FOXDUDE69]

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

The reality that you ignore anyone who has mentioned they have it running.

Why is it that you keep repeating the same pointless arguments?
I already said that even if some person were to run the Steam version flawlessly out of the box, that still doesn't invalidate the overwhelming amount of accounts that document the exact opposite.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

By the way thanks for keep mentioning Fallout 3 and proving me right and Quint wrong when he keeps sating the thread is about 5 star ratings. Bless you.

You are the one who keeps bringing up Fallout 3 out of the blue like you did in post #317
The last time I mentioned Fallout 3 previous to that was in a response to Cinedine because he he himself brought it up. You might want to google "paranoid delusions" and have a quick looksie.

[Quint the Alligator Snapper]

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

If you want to enjoy the feeling of being proven correct, please, go ahead and pleasure yourself.

My, my the person who redefines definitions for everyone else and always needs to be right.

The fact that you think the point of this is about being "right" shows that you're missing the point.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

You make demands all the time but you define them as opinions.

You fail to understand what a suggestion is.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

You really need to read your posts, saves so much egg on your face later.

There's only egg if you crack open an egg yourself and pour it on your screen.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

This is about the rating system, not a demand for writing reviews in a certain way.

This is about you WANTING something which is not available and everyone else is wrong.

Everyone else? No, there are clearly other people who disagree with you, but you have conveniently forgetten about them.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

It is for Valve to decide, oddly a concept you fail to grasp but I suppose as with all things if you post about it long enough it will happen except for:

If you actually think that I think that posting about it long enough will make it happen, then you're presuming incorrectly that your own delusional route of thinking is shared by me.

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

List view:

Client version choice:

Option to disable automatic updates:

What do these have to do with the topic here?

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

Reviews written the way you want them to be.

Once again, we've been talking about the review system. That includes both people who agree and disagree with me...except you.

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

You are the one who keeps bringing up Fallout 3 out of the blue like you did in post #317
The last time I mentioned Fallout 3 previous to that was in a response to Cinedine because he he himself brought it up. You might want to google "paranoid delusions" and have a quick looksie.

Don't even need to go to post #317; just look at post #2, courtesy of Shogun Blade (a.k.a. Kusa).

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

The absolute worst scenario is one like Fallout 3's which is left in an abysmal state because of steam's lack of standards and Bethesda's let-the-fans-fix-it attitude resulting in a game that doesn't even launch without being modded by the paying costumer and requires further work to run well. Every new player needs to go through this process but the game is real good after you you spend a good amount of time fixing it, so they leave positive reviews... on a game that doesn't even launch. And it's sitting right now with a "mostly positive" rank on steam.

So your are using a review star system to disguise your usual attack on Steam and Fallout 3.

FACT: - Steam has nothing to do with Fallout 3 beyond been a storefront and host for Bethesda's game.

I previously stated on another of your threads I have a working version of Fallout 3 including Xbox live without using any patching whatsoever or the dll trick. Video below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyupHUuCx2Y

When did you become the arbiter of when a review needs to only contain information you think appropriate or that any review should fit a criteria you set?

Your definition of a game has no relevance to another's experience of a game or whether they are immersed in a game or not. Reviews are after all only the opinion of another who may be both wrong and right or neither and a star rating system would not alter that.

I personally never read nor watch reviews I always form my own opinion of game.

[Nx Machina]

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

Why is it that you keep repeating the same pointless arguments? I already said that even if some person were to run the Steam version flawlessly out of the box, that still doesn't invalidate the overwhelming amount of accounts that document the exact opposite.

You on this thread raised Fallout 3 and continued to. Just some examples.

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

The absolute worst scenario is one like Fallout 3's which is left in an abysmal state because of steam's lack of standards and Bethesda's let-the-fans-fix-it attitude resulting in a game that doesn't even launch without being modded by the paying costumer and requires further work to run well. Every new player needs to go through this process but the game is real good after you you spend a good amount of time fixing it, so they leave positive reviews... on a game that doesn't even launch. And it's sitting right now with a "mostly positive" rank on steam.

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

A confirmation of a game working for a person doesn't suddenly invalidate the countless reviews, both positive and negative that claim it doesn't, and the constant stream of new threads from unsuspecting players asking for help. This is not a case of the game just being broken for a tiny minority. It's the opposite and it's been going on for years. Imagine putting so much effort into defending a company that, and this is also fact, leaves their games broken for their fans to fix! Also a fact is that a storefront is responsible for the products they sell. So both Bethesda AND Valve are at fault here.

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

You do what you want. Fix Bethesda's games for all eternity if you want to. Doesn't mean I have to do the same or keep my mouth shut about Steam's lack of standards and the sorry state of game preservation, especially concerning a game that is still being sold. All your arguments about Fallout 3 are feeble and illogical.Do you have something to say about the review rating scale instead? Because that's what this thread is about and I already wrote that Fallout 3 is just one of several broken games Steam is selling and I used it as an example because it was the case I was most familiar with.

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

You were the one to chose to focus on Fallout 3, not me. The existence of another thread warning users of the state of the game doesn't, in any way, mean I cannot talk about the game in another thread, especially when it's relevant for the topic at hand. Your argument is child-like.

So what happened to your thread "Warning others"? The one I quoted.

Origineel geplaatst door Foxdude:

You are the one who keeps bringing up Fallout 3 out of the blue like you did in post #317. The last time I mentioned Fallout 3 previous to that was in a response to Cinedine because he he himself brought it up. You might want to google "paranoid delusions" and have a quick looksie.

What a tangled web we weave we we set out to deceive. May be you should Google.

[FOXDUDE69]

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

Don't even need to go to post #317; just look at post #2, courtesy of Shogun Blade (a.k.a. Kusa).

And then he also argues that I have had the same gripe since 2017.

Well, of course I've had the same gripe since 2017! Bethesda hasn't done anything about Fallout 3 in 2018, 2019 and 2020 either so why would my opinion magically change?!

This guy, bro! He can't be real! Hahaha!

[FOXDUDE69]

Origineel geplaatst door Shogun Blade:

You on this thread raised Fallout 3 and continued to. Just some examples.

Me responding to other people about the topic of Fallout 3 is not the same as raising the topic myself. You can't be for real!

[Nx Machina]

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

The fact that you think the point of this is about being "right" shows that you're missing the point.

My, my you are still here, still ignoring FoxDude has mentioned Fallout 3 several times.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

You fail to understand what a suggestion is.

Still arguing.

By the way a suggestion is not a given, Valve need to comply so I obviously do.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

There's only egg if you crack open an egg yourself and pour it on your screen.

You really cannot let go.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

Everyone else? No, there are clearly other people who disagree with you, but you have conveniently forgetten about them.

As you conveniently forget about those others who disagree with you. Obviously you don't not based upon the number of posts you have made arguing with the same people. That word blindness must be terrible.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

If you actually think that I think that posting about it long enough will make it happen, then you're presuming incorrectly that your own delusional route of thinking is shared by me.

Delusional route?

Come Quint you can do better than that or rather you could if you had something to say rather than take a dig because you are lost for words.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

What do these have to do with the topic here?

Not for you to decide - my posts - no backseat moderating.

Origineel geplaatst door Quint the Alligator Snapper:

That includes both people who agree and disagree with me...except you.

I do not agree - Neutral worthless - 5 star worthless. My opinion which I am free to state.