Wuhuuuu May 31, 2019 @ 5:20am
Indie-infested game store
Hi, I log on to Steam once every month cause I'm really keen on trying out a new game.
However, I haven't bought anything in ages because Steam is infested with Indie games.

I get that broke hipster developers think it's fun to build 8-bit garbage games and post them on Steam.

The real games are way too hard to find because of the indie-infested store, which results in choice paralysis. You can't find the gold among the trash and you close the client yet again.

There should be a filter that allows you to leave out every single Indie game in the store so you can find actual games and not the ones that looks like Super Nintendo blockbusters.

There are currently 2 options on Steam, which is probably why their sales are declining like crazy:

- Free-to-play games where you can hardly move without make 11 microtransactions
- Indie games that were made in 15 min by a developer who hammered a keyboard in his face for 14 min straight and then spend the last minute submitting the crap on Steam.

Please do something to fix this infested games store
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Showing 1-15 of 38 comments
aiusepsi May 31, 2019 @ 5:26am 
You could consider excluding the indie tag from the store preferences: https://store.steampowered.com/account/preferences/
Crazy Tiger May 31, 2019 @ 5:59am 
Originally posted by Wuhuuuu:
Please do something to fix this infested games store

Nothing to fix. You can set preferences, exclude tags and ignore games. Use those tools.

Last edited by Crazy Tiger; May 31, 2019 @ 5:59am
Start_Running May 31, 2019 @ 6:05am 
Never mind that indie is a very nebulous tag (THe witcher series, Sesuna's sacrifice, Half Life 2, these are all indie games). Might I suggest trying EA's origin service. Might be more your speed.
Garou May 31, 2019 @ 8:51am 
Originally posted by Wuhuuuu:
- Indie games that were made in 15 min by a developer who hammered a keyboard in his face for 14 min straight and then spend the last minute submitting the crap on Steam.

Do you even know how long it takes to make even a simple game? :cleanseal:
Aachen May 31, 2019 @ 8:56am 
Originally posted by Spooky:

Do you even know how long it takes to make even a simple game? :cleanseal:

“Indie” means drag-and-drop asset-flip, right? :spazdunno:

I’m surprised that OP hasn’t leveraged their development method into a whole studio, easy as it (apparently) is!
k0marac May 31, 2019 @ 9:13am 
Not all indie games are asset flips
Last edited by k0marac; May 31, 2019 @ 9:13am
cinedine May 31, 2019 @ 9:27am 
Originally posted by Aachen:
I’m surprised that OP hasn’t leveraged their development method into a whole studio, easy as it (apparently) is!

It's easy, but not sustainable. At some point you will run out of keyboards or faces. :steammocking:
Aachen May 31, 2019 @ 9:31am 
Originally posted by cinedine:

It's easy, but not sustainable. At some point you will run out of keyboards or faces. :steammocking:

That’s where my (formerly) secret indie-dev strategy comes in: rearcoding.
Wuhuuuu Jun 15, 2019 @ 2:55am 
I'm mainly referring to those $5 cringy 8-bit games that no in their right mind would ever want to play. Steam has become a roach nest with 85% retro graphic garbage content that for some reason is allowed to be in the store
Crazy Tiger Jun 15, 2019 @ 2:59am 
Then don't use the word Indie. The Witcher 3 is an indie game.

Games are games. Just because you think they're not games or don't like them, doesn't mean you get to deny others what they want and like. If it gets sold, there is a market for it.

You might want to think about how you search the stores and which tools you do or do not use. I say this, because I don't come across such games in my search and store. But I don't simply "browse" the store.
MasterManiac Jun 15, 2019 @ 3:23am 
What's indie, what isn't indie...I mean, once you're done with the semantics (and once we're past the fact that the OP *really* could have framed his argument in a more positive, constructive fashion), there's just no denying the fact that Steam has a *serious* problem with content quality guidelines.

It's not that I want to "ban" games that fall beneath my own personal quality/content standards. No, far from it. That's a silly and unreasonable thing to ask, OP. I just would like to see a better effort made to empower shoppers with the ability to suppress not-desired content, simply for the sake of convenience.

As it is now, browsing through the storefront is a bit of a nightmare. And there's no denying it: there's a ton of blatantly-obvious low-effort games on this storefront. C'mon, these guys don't even try to hide it, so there's no point pretending that wanting to dump this stuff in a wastebin is some sort of assault against indie developers. It's entirely within reason to be able to sort this stuff based on simple developer pedigree.

Yes, clogging the storefront with hundreds of severely undesirable titles - many of which are well and truly self-aware of their low quality, shovelware nature, even joking about it in their description - is a bad idea. It renders the shopping experience noisome and unpleasant, and detracts from the end-user's perception that there's actually quality content on the platform. This deluge of low-effort content is going to make rival storefronts seem cleaner, better-curated, and more desirable in the end, I'm afraid.

The Xbox 360 handled this wonderfully, by placing these titles in their own, separate category: the Indie Arcade. There were *plenty* of quality indie games which were featured in the store proper, but the *really* low-key stuff had a place to be hosted where it didn't clutter the rest of the shop. And let's be real: there was a *lot* of junk there, several titles the sort that wouldn't even start properly.

I'm no prude. I'm totally cool with adult content, so don't take this the wrong way, but I am sick to death of the onrush of "hentai" this and "hentai" that clones ... all low-to-no-effort clicker games which have utterly infested the storefront. Yeah, I'm cool with seeing the occasional adult-themed game. I want to see it, I signed off on it - that doesn't mean I want to open the doors to let in every no-effort art gallery out there, and have to wade through hundreds of them while I look for new games to buy. Also, I'm tired of quasi-political clickbait titles, and YouTube-bait schlock. In short, shopping on Steam really bites now, because of all the chaff. The solution? Steam Indie Arcade. Low pedigree devs pushing shovelware get to do so right into the dustbin where such titles belong. High sales, positive reviews, or some other metric could automatically elevate a game from the "arcade" status, possibly, and put it on the regular storefront.

Ostensibly, Steam playtests every game at least once. That should be enough time for the tester to check a box regarding whether or not the game is an obvious Arcade contender, I mean really. Maybe give the developer an option to appeal if they *really* think they deserve reconsideration. Otherwise, these devs who know what they're doing when they submit "bird pewp simulator 2000" have their product go under the counter, where it needs to be asked about. Honestly, I think this very basic level of curation would do *MUCH* to improve the quality of submissions in general. Why? Because as of now, bird pewp simulator gets to stand shoulder-to-shoulder with Witcher 3, Doom, and whatever else. And it's silly.

Give it a good browsing system, and end users looking for low-budget content can search that catalog to find the diamonds in the rough. Give devs who *really* care about their games, despite the low budget, some sort of fair point of ingress, and let those devs enjoy elevated pedigree so future releases automatically go to the regular storefront. It could be like a sort of "green-light" system, where already-released games can be thumbed-up enough so that a developer can "graduate" out of the Arcade label.

For example, a passionate developer makes his first game, "Good-Lookin' Ghoul Busta" or whatever. It's very indie, and looks the part...and because of this, maybe the initial approval process put this new guy in the Arcade. *However,* this game really catches on, because this guy really put a lot of effort into it, and it's got some really solid mechanics. People start giving the dev a big, green thumbs-up. Since the Arcade probably doesn't get a huge amount of traffic, this doesn't take too much, but enough positive attention lets the dev "graduate" out of Arcade status.

On the flip side, low-effort content from low-effort devs can be flagged as such, not be banned, but be cleared from the storefront proper if enough "big red buttons" get pressed. This idea isn't perfect, or even fully formed (nor is it as I've described it immune to abuse). However, a system *like* this would, I feel, make the browsing experience better for everyone. *AND,* as I said, I bet it would actually push developers to think twice about quality, because "showing up" really won't be enough to rub shoulders with devs who actually care.
Last edited by MasterManiac; Jun 15, 2019 @ 3:39am
Start_Running Jun 15, 2019 @ 4:19am 
Originally posted by MasterManiac:
What's indie, what isn't indie...I mean, once you're done with the semantics (and once we're past the fact that the OP *really* could have framed his argument in a more positive, constructive fashion), there's just no denying the fact that Steam has a *serious* problem with content quality guidelines.
Have you considered that the notion of 'quality' ijn an entertainment product is pretty ridiculous? THink about it.. If you enjoy a game but someone else doesn't, does that make the game good? WHat about the reverse?

It's not that I want to "ban" games that fall beneath my own personal quality/content standards. No, far from it. That's a silly and unreasonable thing to ask, OP. I just would like to see a better effort made to empower shoppers with the ability to suppress not-desired content, simply for the sake of convenience.
Because the mental cpacity to ignore the stuff they don't like is beyond the average consumer?"

As it is now, browsing through the storefront is a bit of a nightmare. And there's no denying it: there's a ton of blatantly-obvious low-effort games on this storefront. C'mon, these guys don't even try to hide it, so there's no point pretending that wanting to dump this stuff in a wastebin is some sort of assault against indie developers. It's entirely within reason to be able to sort this stuff based on simple developer pedigree.
Low effort. I do really enjoy when people who have never done something comment on the effort it takes. If you're browsing randomly with little idea of what you're looking for then of course you're going to see a lot of stufff you personally don;t want. Have you considered that maybe, just mayvbe that you need to employ a different search strategy? YOu know there are like 5 different discovery tools available on steam?

Yes, clogging the storefront with hundreds of severely undesirable titles - many of which are well and truly self-aware of their low quality, shovelware nature, even joking about it in their description - is a bad idea. It renders the shopping experience noisome and unpleasant, and detracts from the end-user's perception that there's actually quality content on the platform. This deluge of low-effort content is going to make rival storefronts seem cleaner, better-curated, and more desirable in the end, I'm afraid.
YOu're making assumptions. On any given day I can find without searching , at least one game to put on my wishlist or follow list. How? Well I find that people who complain about low quality have a few common characteristics. They have no idea what they actually like, they are searching via the most vague criteria and tend to be looking for the cheapest game games they can find.

Hint . CHange the ordering to 'user reviews' instead of price -low to high'

Creating walled gardens really just creates aribitary hoops and hurdles for actual developers and makes it less likely a consumer will actually find a nice gem.
MasterManiac Jun 15, 2019 @ 4:46am 
Oh, BOY. I *love* these types of people: the perpetually offended! I'm going to resist the urge to just block you out of the gate, assuming you do in fact want a conversation, and *aren't* just trying to get a rise out of people (though crap like "Because the mental cpacity to ignore the stuff they don't like is beyond the average consumer?" does not inspire much confidence to that effect).

So here we GO!

1)The notion of "quality" in entertainment is ridiculous? Um. No. Next question? Yeah, sorry, I legitimately don't think I could give that a better answer. It's pretty simple, like "do you think it's healthy to breathe air?" Not a very nuanced question, if you're asking me if the concept of "quality" applies to entertainment any less than it does food, drink, or construction. What a load of pants.

Yes, as much as it must pain me to admit, there is simply an objective difference in quality between "TRUMP PUTIN BROFEST THE MOVIE THE GAME" and Resident Evil 2. I shouldn't have to explain that the metrics which factor into a simple evaluation of said quality include, but are not limited to, scope of the project, dedication of developers, quality of assets, artistic merit, so on and so forth. But I will, I guess.

Yes, I'm comfortable in assessing the difference in quality between a game developed carefully and with great dedication by a team of 300 talented professionals, and a "game" which is a thrown-together collection of screenshots indispersed with meme .gifs put together by one guy in his underwear for the lols.

2) These junk games clutter the store and frustrate browsing. Simple fact. Also, another simple fact: people are really, really getting sick of it, and it's *THE* most common complaint in regards to the platform. And that's as much time as I'm devoting to that assertion.

3) What does the number of "discovery tools" have to do with the simple fact that the storefront is a cluttered mess? I'm not interested in "discovery tools," I'm interested in a clean, simple, and direct storefront experience - y'know, the kind that can be found on GOG, green man gaming, Fanatical, Origin, even friggin' uPlay... basically everywhere else?

4) This is a load of rubbish.

5) "Walled gardens." Yeah, that's called "curation." "Discrimination" isn't always a naughty word. AND the lack of curation is making the Steam storefront look like a joke, sufficient that it IS indeed being mocked. It only makes the competition look more attractive.

I do not hate Steam. I tolerate it, though I will admit to not really liking it - primarily because the interface is very cluttered, frustrating, and not easily customized. Any suggestions I make are entirely honest - this is not just mindless criticism.

That said...I do really hate shopping on Steam, and wherever possible, I peruse other, better-organized storefronts which have far better structure, far less throwaway games cluttering everything, and no silly distractions (review groups, streaming video junk) that I can't disable in some way. My opinions are entirely subjective, but I'm sure I'm not the only person in the world held back by these issues. I'm not anti-Steam - I'd actually love to see it improve, and become more accessible.
Last edited by MasterManiac; Jun 15, 2019 @ 4:59am
Fear dot Com Jun 15, 2019 @ 4:49am 
Well, a huge bulk of Steam's games are indies. And a lot of them are really good. But, I can't blame the OP. How many crap games constantly abuse the label of "indie" and completely sour that tag? It's come to the point where if I see indie and horror in the same description, I automatically assume it sucks :P.
Darren Jun 15, 2019 @ 5:00am 
Steam considered it and in the end they decided they weren't able to properly curate games. Games they thought would be terribly unpopular sold lots of copies and games they thought were well made sold very few.

This left Steam with a choice they could either continue to attempt to act as a gatekeeper, or they could step aside and provide some tools (which they continue to work on) to attempt to sort through to find what you want (you've got Curators, and the Discovery Queue as the big two and the Discovery Queue is pretty good if you don't go through too many queues and you play games you enjoy frequently to allow to it learn your preferences a bit).

They can definitely do more on the discoverability front (the queue isn't perfect and they've got a lot more data from all the transactions people have done that could potentially make it even more effective) but they don't seem to have any desire to walk back their decision to allow pretty much anything on the store as long as it's not straight up trolling.
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Date Posted: May 31, 2019 @ 5:20am
Posts: 38