All Discussions > Steam Forums > Off Topic > Topic Details
-$ilver- Nov 15, 2020 @ 3:15pm
I have HDMI from PC to TV, but the picture is totally different
I understand the TV screen may not be as good as the laptop screen, however it seems like it does not even try to get it as close as possible. I have to tweak the picture settings and it does in fact get closer, but still not a perfect match and depending on what I am doing, abysmal even. Like on computer games, it is hard if not impossible to make out things on the TV, yet are perfectly visible on the laptop screen, even if I put the brightness all the way up.

And of course the process of trying to change the levels of brightness, color, tint, contrast, etc. takes a while and never really sure which way one has to go to get it as close as possible. So is there a computer process to force the TV to get it as close as possible from PC?

I assumed that by simply using the HDMI cables that obviously it would get it as close as possible and then you can tweak it further. But that is not the case it appears. On that note, why do TVs even have other picture settings like Dynamic, Standard and Movie?

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I play myself on a 65 inches TV, everything is perfect... but it's a 3000 € gaming TV.

Connecting the PC to a standard TV, made only for watching broadcasts or films... is a mistake, since the PC has a resolution of images and writings greater than those on consoles, and unlike them it is not studied and optimized to make it on those low res TVs.

Furthermore, normal TVs do not have a response time and a color range sufficient to be used with PCs, and from what you describe it seems to me that yours TV does not even have the necessary resolution.

Even the next gen consoles coming out now it is not advisable to connect them to normal TVs

Before using a TV with a PC you should make sure that it is at least FULL HD and with a response time of at least 4ms (or you will see trails everywhere), not counting HDR, gaming mode (done on purpose, to reduce latency by removing the filters that TVs have, which with the pc they are not needed) and many other things that you don't seem to know.

In short, the speech is long, pal.
-$ilver- Nov 15, 2020 @ 3:36pm 
I can not complain. The TV was a gift for free and is several years old, but better than the one I was still using from back in the military that is well... old... ^^! I appreciate the info though.

Is there way to transfer what is on the TV onto the PC itself? Maybe my console games would look even better.
Sadly no, man. Sorry to give you bad news but it can't be done.
Televisions do not have a "video card" that allows images to enter other devices, but only an HDMI output port (output through the screen).
To put it simply: your PC has a video card, which "produces" the images which then, through the hdmi or displayport ports (or the old vga), in input, are transmitted by the cable to the output device... that is a monitor or a tv.

In practice, the TV or monitor cannot "produce" images, only reproduce those that are provided to them.

But even if you wanted, for example, to connect the console to the laptop, you can't... the video outputs of laptops only work... well, in output... precisely because even inside laptops there is a video card made only to provide inputs to others devices, but not to receive images.

There are some laptops (now fewer and fewer) that can receive images but only from the antenna connection for the TV... but they are in fact equipped with special TV cards.

But... you can instead connect the console to a pc monitor (not a laptop, a monitor) but the results will not be better in many cases, as the quality of pc monitors is not exploited by the old consoles.
If your TV is very old it might still be the best choice, but of course you will be playing on a much smaller screen, as monitors are smaller than TVs. I used to play PS4 on a 27-inch Asus monitor myself, years ago.
Last edited by Ð⍙︎ℕ︎ ♎♂; Nov 15, 2020 @ 4:18pm
Dr.Shadowds 🐉 Nov 15, 2020 @ 4:20pm 
There couple of things you might know already but worth pointing out.

- Depending on the tv screen resolution and if not same as your laptop, meaning if laptop is 1080p and your tv 4k then things will look little off due to DPI "dot per itch" where pixels are upscale. That be reason to play at the same resolution if possible, but that a bit too big of a stretch when going from 1080p to 4k so performance will tank, and require you to play with game settings.

- The bigger the TV the bigger the DPI, which requires you to sit further back from it, as there a distance zone where if sit too close you see dots, if sit too far it hard to see.

- Some TVs may have settings to adjust to display config with PC, depending on the TV model, but reading the manual, and playing with the settings may get what you want.

- If by chance is a video driver issue, may need to config that to correctly output correct screen resolution, or colours range support, and possibly adjust colours output.
Dr.Shadowds 🐉 Nov 15, 2020 @ 4:25pm 
Originally posted by -$ilver-:
I can not complain. The TV was a gift for free and is several years old, but better than the one I was still using from back in the military that is well... old... ^^! I appreciate the info though.

Is there way to transfer what is on the TV onto the PC itself? Maybe my console games would look even better.
There few things you can look into, but might not be worth it.

Such as video feedback recording not the greatest due to input delay, where you need a device to capture from Tv to either stream to laptop, or connect to your laptop via USB.

If you use an Xbox I remember there software on there where can stream the Xbox to your laptop, or vice versa, same for PS4 but they have their own software, but you can only stream ps4 to laptop, not the other way around.
-$ilver- Nov 15, 2020 @ 4:28pm 
Originally posted by Dan:
Sadly no, man. Sorry to give you bad news but it can't be done.
Televisions do not have a "video card" that allows images to enter other devices, but only an HDMI output port (output through the screen).
To put it simply: your PC has a video card, which "produces" the images which then, through the hdmi or displayport ports (or the old vga), in input, are transmitted by the cable to the output device... that is a monitor or a tv.

In practice, the TV or monitor cannot "produce" images, only reproduce those that are provided to them.

But even if you wanted, for example, to connect the console to the laptop, you can't... the video outputs of laptops only work... well, in output... precisely because even inside laptops there is a video card made only to provide inputs to others devices, but not to receive images.

There are some laptops (now fewer and fewer) that can receive images but only from the antenna connection for the TV... but they are in fact equipped with special TV cards.

But... you can instead connect the console to a pc monitor (not a laptop, a monitor) but the results will not be better in many cases, as the quality of pc monitors is not exploited by the old consoles.
If your TV is very old it might still be the best choice, but of course you will be playing on a much smaller screen, as monitors are smaller than TVs. I used to play PS4 on a 27-inch Asus monitor myself, years ago.


Thank you for all that info. I am also trying to play Shenmue on the Dreamcast to help with learning Japanese. I had used the English version and got what I could from it, as the signs and bill boards and what not are in Japanese, but of course all subtitles and journal entries are in English. I finally found a used copy in great condition for the Japanese version, but then the journal entries, because they are "hand written", are hard if not impossible to read. They are all jammed together and just look blurry. I have tried it on three different TVs now. I was hoping this older, but much larger TV would allow me to read it, but it is no less blurry.

Someone told me on the official forums that is how the Japanese read. They just know from context. I highly doubt that on a much wider scale where almost each and every word you have to guess at. And I have seen many hand written things in Japanese and care is usually taken so others can read such things. (And no I am not talking about special hand writing techniques which there are a few in Japanese and which can look totally different from "beginner" kanji.) One dash added or removed or horizontal instead of vertical or diagonal makes all the difference. Basically some of these kanji look like they just took a calligraphy brush with too much ink and just dabbed it on the paper and then smeared it. ^^!

Anyway I was hoping to replicate what was in the newer TV onto my laptop hoping that would maybe make the kanji "crisper". But if what you said is true, that is not possible either. But since you seem to be knowledgible on the subject... could the issue be it is an American Dreamcast that I am using and or also an American TV? I believe I heard some where that they use different things over seas, so what ever they may be, might be affecting the writing on the screen, maybe a refresh rate or wave lengths, I really do not know. I just know the English subtitles in the American one were readable and I did not have to "guess" what it was that was on there. Thanks again.
-$ilver- Nov 15, 2020 @ 4:31pm 
Originally posted by Dr.Shadowds 🐉:
Originally posted by -$ilver-:
I can not complain. The TV was a gift for free and is several years old, but better than the one I was still using from back in the military that is well... old... ^^! I appreciate the info though.

Is there way to transfer what is on the TV onto the PC itself? Maybe my console games would look even better.
There few things you can look into, but might not be worth it.

Such as video feedback recording not the greatest due to input delay, where you need a device to capture from Tv to either stream to laptop, or connect to your laptop via USB.

If you use an Xbox I remember there software on there where can stream the Xbox to your laptop, or vice versa, same for PS4 but they have their own software, but you can only stream ps4 to laptop, not the other way around.


Thank you for all that as well. Perhaps maybe you could help with my other issue as well, which I will just repost to you.

[I am also trying to play Shenmue on the Dreamcast to help with learning Japanese. I had used the English version and got what I could from it, as the signs and bill boards and what not are in Japanese, but of course all subtitles and journal entries are in English. I finally found a used copy in great condition for the Japanese version, but then the journal entries, because they are "hand written", are hard if not impossible to read. They are all jammed together and just look blurry. I have tried it on three different TVs now. I was hoping this older, but much larger TV would allow me to read it, but it is no less blurry.

Someone told me on the official forums that is how the Japanese read. They just know from context. I highly doubt that on a much wider scale where almost each and every word you have to guess at. And I have seen many hand written things in Japanese and care is usually taken so others can read such things. (And no I am not talking about special hand writing techniques which there are a few in Japanese and which can look totally different from "beginner" kanji.) One dash added or removed or horizontal instead of vertical or diagonal makes all the difference. Basically some of these kanji look like they just took a calligraphy brush with too much ink and just dabbed it on the paper and then smeared it. ^^!

Anyway I was hoping to replicate what was in the newer TV onto my laptop hoping that would maybe make the kanji "crisper". But if what you said is true, that is not possible either. But since you seem to be knowledgible on the subject... could the issue be it is an American Dreamcast that I am using and or also an American TV? I believe I heard some where that they use different things over seas, so what ever they may be, might be affecting the writing on the screen, maybe a refresh rate or wave lengths, I really do not know. I just know the English subtitles in the American one were readable and I did not have to "guess" what it was that was on there.] Thanks again.
Dr.Shadowds 🐉 Nov 15, 2020 @ 4:38pm 
Not sure if the PC version has what you want for the Japanese sign, as I haven't played it yet on PC, but if it does have the japanese sign, play the PC version as it supports new displays, and higher resolution.

But for the Dreamcast do realize they are output at a lower resolution which is a added problem when playing on a higher resolution display, and the fact may be blurry due to design of the game to save performance hit, or to maintain performance target. I would suggest looking into using emulator with your copy of the game, as the emulator can help you upscale the resolution, and even add anti-aliasing support as well, and if there mods/hacks for it that aids in cleaner visual that will help you with reading texts.
The legendary dreamcast and Shenmue are very old products, but for the format I don't think that's the problem .. both in north america and in japan you had the same cathode ray tube television format, the NTSC ... while in europe we had the PAL (in fact at the time our games and yours were not compatible).

If you tell me that in the game you don't just read the writings of magazines or signs, or newspapers... it could simply be that at the time the resolution was low and therefore nobody could, they were there for beauty. But if you tell me you don't even read the subtitles, which are clearly made to be read, something is wrong. The Japanese who go by intuition from the context...is the first time I hear it, honestly.


I remember very little of Shenmue and the Dreamcast, although it is a great work... 20 years have passed and age does not help me, I do not even remember what resolution it was but it was certainly not made to be played on PC monitors, which btw at the time they were still CRT (cathode ray tube)... so your old TV connected to the dreamcast should read everything that was meant to be read.
At this point I am wondering what you are connecting the console to the TV with, as the dreamcast did not have the hdmi... maybe you are using an adapter that ruins the image.

But I know that Shenmue has been remastered and converted and is also for sale here on steam. I see among the supported languages ​​that there is also Japanese, but I don't know if there are also Japanese subtitles... it would be better to ask in the game hub, if there are they will surely be legible.
-$ilver- Nov 15, 2020 @ 5:17pm 
Originally posted by Dan:
The legendary dreamcast and Shenmue are very old products, but for the format I don't think that's the problem .. both in north america and in japan you had the same cathode ray tube television format, the NTSC ... while in europe we had the PAL (in fact at the time our games and yours were not compatible).

If you tell me that in the game you don't just read the writings of magazines or signs, or newspapers... it could simply be that at the time the resolution was low and therefore nobody could, they were there for beauty. But if you tell me you don't even read the subtitles, which are clearly made to be read, something is wrong. The Japanese who go by intuition from the context...is the first time I hear it, honestly.


I remember very little of Shenmue and the Dreamcast, although it is a great work... 20 years have passed and age does not help me, I do not even remember what resolution it was but it was certainly not made to be played on PC monitors, which btw at the time they were still CRT (cathode ray tube)... so your old TV connected to the dreamcast should read everything that was meant to be read.
At this point I am wondering what you are connecting the console to the TV with, as the dreamcast did not have the hdmi... maybe you are using an adapter that ruins the image.

But I know that Shenmue has been remastered and converted and is also for sale here on steam. I see among the supported languages ​​that there is also Japanese, but I don't know if there are also Japanese subtitles... it would be better to ask in the game hub, if there are they will surely be legible.

I am just using the Red, Yellow and the White cables that came with the Dreamcast. I was hoping perhaps after plugging it into the newer TV and then using the HDMI cables to put it to my laptop, that maybe the laptop's screen could possibly handle the writing. To be clear, the Journal entries are meant to be read. In fact they must be read in order to know what to do in the game.

There are a few pamphlets in the game that may be laying on the ground that can not be read, but as you said that is more for adding to the beauty. But the journal entries are meant to be read. I believe however, if they had "printed" it like a newspaper would, instead of simulating someone writing it on pages, it would be able to be read better. But even still, it is not legible.

I am not sure of the Steam version of the game. I believe it does have Japanese, but by this point I already invested in both the Dreamcast versions and the Steam version is partially edited and not made to be used with Workshop so modding it is unlikely. Ehhh... Thanks again! ^^!
the red, yellow and white cables you talk about is the old composite A / V... yellow was the video signal and the other two the stereo audio signal.

If you have a TV that still has these attacks behind it, it is a very old TV and therefore everything should work for you.

The only possibilities then are:
1) the yellow cable is too old... faulty or damaged.
2) the tv, even if old, if it also has an hdmi is not that old... probably its composite A / V inputs are not very compatible with those of the Dreamcast cable.

The things you can do are: buy a good A / V to hdmi adapter and connect the dreamcast via hdmi to the tv... or, even before, buy a good A / V cable if we want to assume that the Dreamcast one is now too old or faulty.

You can find both for a few dollars on amazon :)
crunchyfrog Nov 15, 2020 @ 8:55pm 
Originally posted by -$ilver-:
I can not complain. The TV was a gift for free and is several years old, but better than the one I was still using from back in the military that is well... old... ^^! I appreciate the info though.

Is there way to transfer what is on the TV onto the PC itself? Maybe my console games would look even better.

There is but it really depends on how competent you are with electronics.

As this is an older TV (and it can also depend where you live in the world - from my experience US TVs seem to be traditionally lacking in features us in Europe have, mostly connections), it's quite likely you are gettting a worse picture.

The simple reason being that even though you are using an HDMI, you are going through SOME of the TVs internal electronics.

Modern TVS often have what is called a "gaming mode" where it cuts that out and flows the signal as direct as it can, reducing frame lag.

I would guess that as yours is quite old, and unless it's a major named brand, will likely have a lot of corners cut as far as features inside. SO you will likely be going through all the same smoothing/sharpness filters, and other circuitry which will ALWAYS degrade the picture somewhat.

Of course, you can also just have a ♥♥♥♥ cable, but as HDMI is digital this is unlikely to be the case, as interference doesn't work like that with digital signals.


Your best bet if a better picture is important, is to simply buy a new TV that will do this job. I don't know about prices where you are, but here in Britain you can get a good named brand like Panasonic or Sony for a few hundred that will do an excellent job.

You could also look out for a used one.
crunchyfrog Nov 15, 2020 @ 9:01pm 
Originally posted by -$ilver-:
Originally posted by Dan:
The legendary dreamcast and Shenmue are very old products, but for the format I don't think that's the problem .. both in north america and in japan you had the same cathode ray tube television format, the NTSC ... while in europe we had the PAL (in fact at the time our games and yours were not compatible).

If you tell me that in the game you don't just read the writings of magazines or signs, or newspapers... it could simply be that at the time the resolution was low and therefore nobody could, they were there for beauty. But if you tell me you don't even read the subtitles, which are clearly made to be read, something is wrong. The Japanese who go by intuition from the context...is the first time I hear it, honestly.


I remember very little of Shenmue and the Dreamcast, although it is a great work... 20 years have passed and age does not help me, I do not even remember what resolution it was but it was certainly not made to be played on PC monitors, which btw at the time they were still CRT (cathode ray tube)... so your old TV connected to the dreamcast should read everything that was meant to be read.
At this point I am wondering what you are connecting the console to the TV with, as the dreamcast did not have the hdmi... maybe you are using an adapter that ruins the image.

But I know that Shenmue has been remastered and converted and is also for sale here on steam. I see among the supported languages ​​that there is also Japanese, but I don't know if there are also Japanese subtitles... it would be better to ask in the game hub, if there are they will surely be legible.

I am just using the Red, Yellow and the White cables that came with the Dreamcast. I was hoping perhaps after plugging it into the newer TV and then using the HDMI cables to put it to my laptop, that maybe the laptop's screen could possibly handle the writing. To be clear, the Journal entries are meant to be read. In fact they must be read in order to know what to do in the game.

There are a few pamphlets in the game that may be laying on the ground that can not be read, but as you said that is more for adding to the beauty. But the journal entries are meant to be read. I believe however, if they had "printed" it like a newspaper would, instead of simulating someone writing it on pages, it would be able to be read better. But even still, it is not legible.

I am not sure of the Steam version of the game. I believe it does have Japanese, but by this point I already invested in both the Dreamcast versions and the Steam version is partially edited and not made to be used with Workshop so modding it is unlikely. Ehhh... Thanks again! ^^!

As I use my Dreamcast and many other older consoles, regularly, on long gaming stints I've been getting watery eyes with these older resolutions.

So, I went for ditching the old yellow red and white composite cables, and getting some HD solutions cheap. For my PS2 and Xbox I simply went with a component cable (the green, blue, red, and then red and white for sound), but for the Dreamcast I simply plumped for a cheapo cable by Pound. Cost just under £40, and it's far better than I'd hoped.

I expected it to be reasonably poor but it's a mile better. You can get better solutions, but I don't consider the benefits versus the cost paying that much more for.

So yeah, that would give you the best bang for your buck. Pound also do cables for other consoles too, with varying results.

But as for reading the Japanese wrinting, I fear that's not going to happen because the textures on the standard Dreamcast aren't capable of displaying them. They will look to blurred to read even if you had the best display in the world. Sorry but there's no way round that.

As far as the recent remaster goes I haven't got round to starting it yet, but I'll have a go and report back.
-$ilver- Nov 15, 2020 @ 10:03pm 
Originally posted by crunchyfrog:
But as for reading the Japanese wrinting, I fear that's not going to happen because the textures on the standard Dreamcast aren't capable of displaying them. They will look to blurred to read even if you had the best display in the world. Sorry but there's no way round that.

As far as the recent remaster goes I haven't got round to starting it yet, but I'll have a go and report back.

Thank you for your reply and insight. But at some point the text had to be clear enough for the Japanese to be able to read it. It was an integral part of the game. I can not believe they would of sold a game that was unreadable or they had to guess at it from context, when almost all context had to be guessed at, meaning there was no foundation to begin with. o_0

The other forum had suggested getting better cables as well, but if what you said would be the end result, just a slightly less smudge of writing as it were, I have no need of them.

Originally posted by crunchyfrog:
There is but it really depends on how competent you are with electronics.

Not much.

Originally posted by crunchyfrog:

I would guess that as yours is quite old, and unless it's a major named brand, will likely have a lot of corners cut as far as features inside. SO you will likely be going through all the same smoothing/sharpness filters, and other circuitry which will ALWAYS degrade the picture somewhat.

Of course, you can also just have a ♥♥♥♥ cable, but as HDMI is digital this is unlikely to be the case, as interference doesn't work like that with digital signals.


Your best bet if a better picture is important, is to simply buy a new TV that will do this job. I don't know about prices where you are, but here in Britain you can get a good named brand like Panasonic or Sony for a few hundred that will do an excellent job.

You could also look out for a used one.

Mine is a Westinghouse Digital TV. It's logo reminds me of Williams Pinball. ^^!

No, I do not watch TV nor play many games on it, unless the mood strikes me, but all other games are competent, even on my older TV. I strictly need something to be able to read the Japanese better. But not worth paying hundreds for, especially if even that is no guarantee of being able to do so. ^^! I was just hoping there was a way to reverse the image and I could take advantage of the laptop screen or resolution.

I do appreciate your reply though. Thank you.
crunchyfrog Nov 16, 2020 @ 5:58pm 
I think I'd like to get a bit more clarity about the Japanese writings you're talking about in game, as I may have crossed wires a bit.

I assumed you were talking about say, signs on walss - the sort of background stuff that isn't necessarily meant to be read, but I realise now you're talking about stuff that NEEDS to be read.

So can you clarify a bit more - do you mean like the text he writes in his notebook, or something like that? Could you even provide examples?

Because that should be EASILY able to read even with composite cables. As I said with my setup by the side of my bed, I have 12 consoles currently setup, and running through a couple of switcher boxes into the back of the Panasonic TV. Many of them I've simply changed via cable to HD, but I still have the ability to use the old composite should I need to. And Shenmue on Dreamcast through composite should be PERFECTLY readable.


So if you'd be so kind as to provide a bit more clarity on this it will probably ebale me to solve this easier. If it's stuff like the notebook and you can't read it, then it's going to be down to a couple of things - either the composite cable is crap and unshielded (so RF interference is ruining the signal - try moving that cable WELL away from everything else to see if there's any change), or the Dreamcast needs a bit of love and matintenance, as it may need some capacitors replacing that have dried out. Or worst of all, the TVs junk and is either in need of maintenance or a setup, or is dying.

I can get to the bottom of it, with your help if you're interested, as this very much is my bread and butter these days.

Besides, it'd be silly for me to recommend you a cable if that won't fix anything.
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All Discussions > Steam Forums > Off Topic > Topic Details
Date Posted: Nov 15, 2020 @ 3:15pm
Posts: 47