Steam Refunds... my opinion. (No hate towards Valve)

[Jake]

To be honest, it's kind of♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥me off. I got my money back, which I'm thankful for.
But that fact that steam thinks it's even POSSIBLE to ABUSE a refund system they set in place nerve-racks me.
My opinion, and mine souly... if they don't want you to "abuse" it, or whatever they call it, they should make it a bit more strict for their standards, instead of complaining about it non-stop.

Refunds are a good thing, and cannot be flipping abused, in my opinion. They are set in place for people who don't want, like, need, or work the games they have purchased. How is this a bad thing?

It's complicated... I'm mad at them but at the same time I'm not.

I understand that I have refunded like eight-games in the past hour (speaking generally here, not literally.), but... PLEASE, LET ME JUST DO IT WITHOUT YOU TELLING ME I'M ABUSING A SYSTEM YOU SET IN PLACE FOR YOUR CUSTOMERS!

I'm tired when writing this, so excuse me if I have said something insanely stupid and what not. Comment your thoughts, because I am afraid I will be denied refunds later on after today... I just don't understand how this thing can be abused.

EDIT - I refunded the games because I don't know whether or not I'm going to take a BREAK from gaming or not, I couldn't decide so I got my money back in the meantime.

[mirandia]

Steam had to establish a refund system according to EU law, even they didnt like it. They made it even a little better and made it possible for worldwide use. U can find the information here
https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=8620-QYAL-4516

[Kargor]

Even forum threads casually "recommend" refund abuse as in "just try them out and refund them if you don't like them".

I don't know whether Steam has special conditions with payment providers such as PayPal, but there are generally (at least) two problems with refunds:

First, transaction fees with the payment providers. If the game says "4.99" you expect to pay "4.99". There is a payment fee involved, but Steam is paying that. There is another payment fee when Steam sends the money back to you -- and, unfortunately, you expect to get 4.99 back. So, Steam has payed two fees and gotten nothing out of it.

Second, publishers. Yes, Steam is basically allowing you try out their games and return them even though they work perfectly fine. I don't know how pissed the publishers have been about this policy, but its a political/business consideration that Steam has to take into account. If publishers would be like "hey, great, it's realy nice of you to do that!" they would have added more demos to the store in the years before... but they didn't.

Myself, I look at games BEFORE I buy them. Granted, it's almost impossible for me to refund anything since most of my purchases happen elsewhere, or simply because I don't usually play a new game right away -- but I've never had a case of "damned, I wish I could refund this" since I generally have a good idea about what I'm buying. If I end up giving a "thumb down" it's usually not an issue I discovered early on.

[Satoru]

mirandia eredeti hozzászólása:

Steam had to establish a refund system according to EU law, even they didnt like it. They made it even a little better and made it possible for worldwide use. U can find the information here
https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=8620-QYAL-4516

I recommend you read your own laws first

EU laws ENFORCE the old no refund policy

EU laws do not require steam provide you with any refunds at all

Refunds on Steam are provided as a EXTRA to the EU law of “no refunds” and can be revoked at their discretion because it is NOT mandated by EU law

[Radene]

Kargor eredeti hozzászólása:

Even forum threads casually "recommend" refund abuse as in "just try them out and refund them if you don't like them"

Probably because Steam's refund policy itself clearly states that as a valid reason to get a refund?

[Start_Running]

Kargor eredeti hozzászólása:

First, transaction fees with the payment providers. If the game says "4.99" you expect to pay "4.99". There is a payment fee involved, but Steam is paying that. There is another payment fee when Steam sends the money back to you -- and, unfortunately, you expect to get 4.99 back. So, Steam has payed two fees and gotten nothing out of it.

Hence why if they see you doing it too often.. they will yank the refunds from you, and any charges associated with a given payment method, so basically creating a new account and starting over again won't work if you're using bthe same card or paypal account.

Second, publishers. Yes, Steam is basically allowing you try out their games and return them even though they work perfectly fine. I don't know how pissed the publishers have been about this policy, but its a political/business consideration that Steam has to take into account. If publishers would be like "hey, great, it's realy nice of you to do that!" they would have added more demos to the store in the years before... but they didn't.

THe policy as it stands was what was agreed upon by the majority of publishers. I'm not sure how the payment timing works but I do know that steam pays out to publishers on fortnightly basis.Hence why the 2 week thing.

[Start_Running]

Eisberg eredeti hozzászólása:

mirandia eredeti hozzászólása:

Steam had to establish a refund system according to EU law, even they didnt like it. They made it even a little better and made it possible for worldwide use. U can find the information here
https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=8620-QYAL-4516

Actually no, it had nothing to do with EU law. In fact EU law allows for no refund as soon as the person starts downloading the game, they just had to put an extra agreement box for them to agree to.

The refund policy did not come because of any law, it came from a market shift with more and more platforms having a refund policy.

I find it very amusing how often people assume it was the EU or the Australian government forcing VAlve to do refunds. Shows how little people read beyond the headlines. As said, the EU laws were okay with Valve prior to the new policy and the issue with AUstralia was simply that it was a matter of disclosure. The courts actually up held that VAlve had the right to refuse refund in all the cases presented.

[Mivo]

Kargor eredeti hozzászólása:

First, transaction fees with the payment providers. If the game says "4.99" you expect to pay "4.99". There is a payment fee involved, but Steam is paying that. There is another payment fee when Steam sends the money back to you -- and, unfortunately, you expect to get 4.99 back. So, Steam has payed two fees and gotten nothing out of it.

This is not correct. I deal with refunds through PayPal in my day job, so I have some insight in how this works (not related to Steam, but PayPal's policies are the same). In case of a refund that is initiated by the vendor (here: Steam), that is: the refund is voluntarily given to the customer, PayPal also refunds the fee that they had taken from the vendor. The vendor is not paying the fee for the original transaction nor is there a fee for the refund.

This is different in case of forceful chargebacks, especially through credit card companies, in which case there is a hefty fee. But normal refunds through the vendor do not incur any fees. Steam may have arrangements with developers where the developer has to pay a fee to Steam in case of refunds, but as far as PayPal is concerned there are no fees.

[Jake]

Thank you all for the helpful info! I'll take my time and think about purchases and refunds from now on.

[nigelcrouch123]

I only refund if the game i just got does not work, if i don't like the game, thats just my own fault for not reserching it more beforehand, and maybee i would come back too it later.I don't refund alot incase I hit a limit and screw myself up for when I need too again.

[Jake]

nigelcrouch123 eredeti hozzászólása:

I only refund if the game i just got does not work, if i don't like the game, thats just my own fault for not reserching it more beforehand, and maybee i would come back too it later.I don't refund alot incase I hit a limit and screw myself up for when I need too again.

I can understand, yeah.

[Bidus Biedulin]

There should be no refund system for short games that can be completed in less than 2 hours. Even if it's rush. Nope. Watch it on YT instead if you have a refund in mind. If you buy something and it's conscious decision made after research and game is fun/stable has good mechanics, just stick with it. Someone put time/money/skills/heart/risk into it. Don't be an ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

So far I have refunded ONE game. It was a good and fun game, but certain mechanics tied to gameplay made it tedious/tiresome/boring. Shame. I didn't find any info on this though so I felt I'll try a refund. If only that game was designed in a better way I would buy more copies and send to friends.

Zefar eredeti hozzászólása:

People should research the game a bit before buying it because refunds cost companies money.

Caveat Emptor. That's why read a lot of posts, reviews (here and other sites), I watch YT vids. I just want to make sure it's a good game. It's really worht reading several different reviews as one of them may mention a feature you don't like. This way I saved myself annoyance with two games. Spending time reading 12 reviews of one game was worth it. The other took me almost 15 reviews to get crucial info on some not mentioned feature that I HATE. No buy. Money saved. Frustration/disappointment averted :P



DO F******* RESEARCH people.

[RedLightning]

LunaFortuna eredeti hozzászólása:

Steam is literally the only place that offers such amazing refunds.

Under 2 hours of playtime and you're good to go if you're not over the deadline.

Try walking into Walmart, Target, or any retailer, and ask for a refund on a used PC game. Hahahaha.

I did that ONCE in... 2002? Or so. A game wasn't working at all. All they let me do is exchange it for the same exact game. No refunds. Luckily, the game worked once I exchanged it for another copy.

GOG also makes you jump through way more hoops when it comes to refunds.

This is literally the best and most fair refund place for PC games, and, it baffles me that people still complain.

Physical retailers (as I said, Walmart, Target, etc) will never refund used and opened PC games.

GOG is very strict on refunds.

Steam is fairly laid back so long as you follow the refund rules.

And yet... here we are, finding faults in everything.

I'm sensing a trend on Steam after all the complaining about the refund system (which is better than most PC game refund systems), the sales, etc - Steam users will always complain about something, it seems.

I've gotten my money back twice from walmart one for a PC game.. and one for a Nintendo 3DS game.

It is not impossible, and boy.. in the process I learned a few things.

[Tito Shivan]

Bidus eredeti hozzászólása:

There should be no refund system for short games that can be completed in less than 2 hours.

That's not how things work. If you refund games, you refund games, short and long, cheap and expensive. Just like there's no difference between returning a 6 seat dining table and a coffee one.

RedLightning eredeti hozzászólása:

I've gotten my money back twice from walmart one for a PC game.. and one for a Nintendo 3DS game.

It is not impossible, and boy.. in the process I learned a few things.

I'm not aware of US regulations, but opened software and media falls usually in a no-refund zone (Here in EU you're legally not owed a refund for opened software & media)
Stores may on a one time basis to suck the loss and refund the item (usually to avoid the customer making a scene) but not under legal requirement.

Maybe you could share what you learned so everyone can learn it too?

[Teksura]

Tito Shivan eredeti hozzászólása:

RedLightning eredeti hozzászólása:

I've gotten my money back twice from walmart one for a PC game.. and one for a Nintendo 3DS game.

It is not impossible, and boy.. in the process I learned a few things.

I'm not aware of US regulations, but opened software and media falls usually in a no-refund zone (Here in EU you're legally not owed a refund for opened software & media)
Stores may on a one time basis to suck the loss and refund the item (usually to avoid the customer making a scene) but not under legal requirement.

That sounds like how it works in the US as well. Most places specifically state that stuff like music, video, and software all can only be returned if unopened. In my time working retail, I've never actually seen anyone successfully get an exception to this.

[RedLightning]

Teksura eredeti hozzászólása:

Tito Shivan eredeti hozzászólása:

I'm not aware of US regulations, but opened software and media falls usually in a no-refund zone (Here in EU you're legally not owed a refund for opened software & media)
Stores may on a one time basis to suck the loss and refund the item (usually to avoid the customer making a scene) but not under legal requirement.

That sounds like how it works in the US as well. Most places specifically state that stuff like music, video, and software all can only be returned if unopened. In my time working retail, I've never actually seen anyone successfully get an exception to this.

Well I guess you were not around when I got my money back. I stand up for rights that we used to take for granted. Untill, at least the corps got seriously greedy and engineered laws and EULA jargon to protect them to the utmost.... aaandd found ways to enforce it all to the utmost degree.

Though it begs to question why Valve does what it does with 'scammers' and 'hackers' and 'resellers'

But they do next to nothing to those that exploit 'spacewars' on a daily basis, I wonder how much Valve is losing to bandwidth to just those fools alone.