In Defense of Old Gamers

[The Brown Hornet]

Yes gentleman we who grew up in the 80s are officially old gamers. As a result we are probably also somewhat annoying to younger gamers as we complain too much about the current state gaming. As for me ... Guilty as charged!

My guess is that you youngsters probably wonder if we dislike gaming so much these days why do we stick around, alright I'll give you three reasons though there certainly are many:

1. We are the first hardcore gaming generation - Gen X. We started it, evolved it, and revolutionized gaming so we take pride in it.

2. Our kids (who are getting older themselves) keep us exposed, engaged, and involved in gaming; who do you think has the money to purchase and buy all the latest hardware tech and gizmos (looking at you Steam Deck) we do!!

3. Habit, it's embedded in our DNA, we were privileged to see and experience every console and PC generation so far. We bought, played, loaned, traded, and collected every game when it was still fresh and new; from Space Invaders to Cyberpunk which I'm assuming is the most technically advanced game today.

So with that said it's kind of hard to stop doing something you've been doing your whole life but I do believe it's winding down for Gen X, not from lack of interest but because those big generational leaps in gameplay and design don't seem to be happening anymore. What comes next has been mostly the same.

If anyone young or "old"...hmmm let's say wise, wants to contribute to this topic have at it!

[The Brown Hornet]

Dr.Shadowds 🐉 původně napsal:

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

Some of the changes that older gamers debated were akin to the style and types of games; I can recall gamers feeling at different times that there were too many side scrollers, platformers, space shooters, fighting games, sport titles, mascots, etc... Debates were never about the technology or tv screens, we debated the games themselves. Today gamers appear to be more interested in the "tech" rather than actual games.

True, things have shifted to about "tech" being main focus for major games, where devs push focus around DLSS, DLAA, FSR, and etc. I do complain about how devs push tech to being needed to get said performance, and quality. Example games that rely on needing frame gen, and upscale heavily is bad sign IMHO because if try to run it natively performance tank really bad. Now I do give credit to the tech itself, but not to devs that cop out using tech to skip out on such as optimizations, and visual quality that just IMO.

We're in agreement on that, I keep wondering all this tech is being developed to play what?!!! Games that never needed it and work fine without it?!! The only way to justify it is to produce games that won't run or operate properly without it?!l

[[dse]Circlestrafe]

xBCxRangers původně napsal:

SLAYER187 původně napsal:

Gaming today is nothing like back in the day For starters going too toys r us (and everywhere else) and paying $40 and $50 bucks for games in not cheaper then today's games priced at $60 and $70 is hillarious.

That's funny. I don't remember games being that much. In fact they were so cheap, i remember a kid at Electronic Boutique trying to sell me a game he thought i'd like (of the WW2 genre) on PS2, and i said sure, throw it in there.

It def was not no 50 or 60 bucks for me to have said that.

I thought they were around 20 bucks or something.

No...I paid $50-$60 for games in the late 80s and 90s. Yes, there were some games in the $30 range and below.

King's Quest III was $49.95 at Radio Shack in 1987 (that's about $140 in today's dollars) that I bought with my paper route money. I distinctly remember my mom repeatedly asking me if I was sure it was worth that price. Yes. It was. And yes, I technically paid 140 bucks for a single video game while in high school with money I earned getting up every day at 5am to deliver a freakin' newspaper. Now kids just get handed a $500-$1500 smartphone and ♥♥♥♥♥ about everything being too expensive.

My brother and I split the cost of a $325 Supra Diamond Monster 3D Voodoo 1 card JUST for GLQuake; in 1997 I believe it was.

EVERYTHING videogame related is CHEAPER now than ever before. FACT.

[wesnef]

dseCirclestrafe původně napsal:

xBCxRangers původně napsal:

That's funny. I don't remember games being that much. In fact they were so cheap, i remember a kid at Electronic Boutique trying to sell me a game he thought i'd like (of the WW2 genre) on PS2, and i said sure, throw it in there.

It def was not no 50 or 60 bucks for me to have said that.

I thought they were around 20 bucks or something.

No...I paid $50-$60 for games in the late 80s and 90s. Yes, there were some games in the $30 range and below.

Yep. "Big" PS2 games were $50. The $20 PS2 games were the "Greatest Hits" reissues of the best-sellers.

[Komarimaru]

xBCxRangers původně napsal:

Crazy Tiger původně napsal:

It's clear you never looked at the catalogs on those consoles. Heck, I had quite some indie games on my 360 that I got from the xbox store. Just have a browse at the Switch catalog, loads of indies.

Your view on gaming implies quite heavily that you didn't actually do much gaming.

Well i look at the Xbox store every day. And when we look at the "Most Played" and "Most Paid" games, i'm not seeing these overly hyped games making it into the Top 5 or even the Top 10. Its always Fortnite, Warzone, Roblox a copy past sports game or GTA, a ten year old game?

Look at this...

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/most-played/games/xbox

Where's "Indiana Jones"? Where is Starfield. Where are the games that costs fortunes to develop, yet they are not playing?

They're at the bottom. Most of that list, are 5 years or older games.

They're playing Siege, GTA, copy paste sports, and 10 year old GTA, Skyrim, Minecraft and all the older stuff. And i'd say PS is not much different

Curious, I see Indiana Jones there in Most Played. And Starfield.

[xBCxRangers]

Komarimaru původně napsal:

xBCxRangers původně napsal:

Well i look at the Xbox store every day. And when we look at the "Most Played" and "Most Paid" games, i'm not seeing these overly hyped games making it into the Top 5 or even the Top 10. Its always Fortnite, Warzone, Roblox a copy past sports game or GTA, a ten year old game?

Look at this...

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/most-played/games/xbox

Where's "Indiana Jones"? Where is Starfield. Where are the games that costs fortunes to develop, yet they are not playing?

They're at the bottom. Most of that list, are 5 years or older games.

They're playing Siege, GTA, copy paste sports, and 10 year old GTA, Skyrim, Minecraft and all the older stuff. And i'd say PS is not much different

Curious, I see Indiana Jones there in Most Played. And Starfield.

As i said, all the way the bottom. Ahead of them, is GTA, Skyrim, Fallout 4, Fallout 76, and a host of others.

These were the hyped huge games, where we have to agree, tens of millions of investments and time. And yet WITH Game Pass, that's where they stand, as folks opt for the older games.

The whole point being, Tiger claimed the small indie developers were making up for the lacking Triple A gaming industry.

But as you can see, that is not the case on consoles.

And so we have to be careful not to be "Steam Centric" being Steam has always been known to prop up small studios. But that is not the gaming industry as a whole.

[Tito Shivan]

Komarimaru původně napsal:

Curious, I see Indiana Jones there in Most Played. And Starfield.

He's also loading the question, Starfield and Indy are both single player games.
Marvel Rivals is there on top but he somehow skipped it.

[HIVEmind]

I don't miss my commador 64. I had to push play on a cassette tape and wait an hour. But I do say this. Back then games were more smarter today we have fps and blood and gore.

We de-evolved in most of today's games. You have to weed out the stuff.

[Dr.Shadowds 🐉]

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

Dr.Shadowds 🐉 původně napsal:

True, things have shifted to about "tech" being main focus for major games, where devs push focus around DLSS, DLAA, FSR, and etc. I do complain about how devs push tech to being needed to get said performance, and quality. Example games that rely on needing frame gen, and upscale heavily is bad sign IMHO because if try to run it natively performance tank really bad. Now I do give credit to the tech itself, but not to devs that cop out using tech to skip out on such as optimizations, and visual quality that just IMO.

We're in agreement on that, I keep wondering all this tech is being developed to play what?!!! Games that never needed it and work fine without it?!! The only way to justify it is to produce games that won't run or operate properly without it?!l

True like there way to make stunning looking games, and even lowering system requirements to a certain degree, which all about having experience, and effort put into making it.

I give you good/bad example from Capcom, see with Resident Evil 2 it didn't have that DLSS, and most people didn't bother using FSR because it FSR 1 which isn't greatest, but yeah it look great, and ran great, but when they slap on DLSS it cause tiny performance hit because it was rushed added into the game, but it greatly prove a point "tech" can only improve so much if already done a good job from the start, which meant didn't even need "tech" at all, making it a niche like how people want whip cream on top of their ice cream, it nice, but not needed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nDINyDhYyHI

I understand point of the tech, and I praise it even with the tech demos, I just can't praise devs that cop out relying heavily on the tech to just do minimum, or recommended settings to running the game that itself is kind of concerning which if someone want to play modem games, they have to keep opting for newer tech just to play newer games. Like example you could be sitting on GTX 1080 ti that on par with RTX 4060, but here the joke, if game is forced DLSS, well you're SOL because lack the very "tech" just to play the game, and not even software problem, it a full on hardware problem.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=su38wosiPZg

[Komarimaru]

xBCxRangers původně napsal:

Komarimaru původně napsal:

Curious, I see Indiana Jones there in Most Played. And Starfield.

As i said, all the way the bottom. Ahead of them, is GTA, Skyrim, Fallout 4, Fallout 76, and a host of others.

These were the hyped huge games, where we have to agree, tens of millions of investments and time. And yet WITH Game Pass, that's where they stand, as folks opt for the older games.

The whole point being, Tiger claimed the small indie developers were making up for the lacking Triple A gaming industry.

But as you can see, that is not the case on consoles.

And so we have to be careful not to be "Steam Centric" being Steam has always been known to prop up small studios. But that is not the gaming industry as a whole.

And yet, single player games, are still in the most played. Kinda counteracts your point you were trying to make.

[Start_Running]

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

Start_Running původně napsal:

"We dislike gaming..."
You speak only for yourself m8. Myself and many others couldn't be happier at the golden age of gaming we find ourselves in.

I'm not saying we dislike, I'm saying others may think we dislike based on what we write and post at times

Again. there is no 'We' in this.

[Boblin the Goblin]

xBCxRangers původně napsal:

Crazy Tiger původně napsal:

Why do you keep talking in "we"? Do you think you're somehow representative for your fellow gamers of the same era?


Except that's not true. Gaming isn't dependant on the big studios, nor is it crashing.

Seriously, get that nonsense out of your head.

You're being too "Steam Centric". Of course on Steam, it has always been a haven for smaller independent developers. That is not the case everywhere else. Be it PS, Nintendo, Xbox it's most all about Triple A titles.

Point being, if the Triple A's are getting hammered, there's really not much else on other outlets than Steam. I wish there was. Given it's not, and if the big studios are being hammered as they are, that is considered a huge problem for gaming and the gaming industry.

You literally have no idea what you are talking about.

As you've said, you're "gaming knowledge" is stuck on PS2 era games.

[Start_Running]

Komarimaru původně napsal:

xBCxRangers původně napsal:

As i said, all the way the bottom. Ahead of them, is GTA, Skyrim, Fallout 4, Fallout 76, and a host of others.

These were the hyped huge games, where we have to agree, tens of millions of investments and time. And yet WITH Game Pass, that's where they stand, as folks opt for the older games.

The whole point being, Tiger claimed the small indie developers were making up for the lacking Triple A gaming industry.

But as you can see, that is not the case on consoles.

And so we have to be careful not to be "Steam Centric" being Steam has always been known to prop up small studios. But that is not the gaming industry as a whole.

And yet, single player games, are still in the most played. Kinda counteracts your point you were trying to make.

Coincidentally SIngle Player games get the least amount of play in the media news cycles...

[RPG Gamer Man]

I swear the newest generation have no clue about pc's. The other day someone put a magnet on a pc. LOl..i once did this and destroyed one of my pc's before.

[BJWyler]

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

Yes gentleman we who grew up in the 80s are officially old gamers.

The 70's, but we'll not quibble over a decade, shan't we.

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

As a result we are probably also somewhat annoying to younger gamers as we complain too much about the current state gaming. As for me ... Guilty as charged!

Here you can speak for yourself. I don't do much complaining about the current state of gaming because there really isn't all that much to complain about - at least anything that was any different from decades ago.

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

My guess is that you youngsters probably wonder if we dislike gaming so much these days why do we stick around, alright I'll give you three reasons though there certainly are many:

It's not only youngsters wondering that. And they are also wondering why people need to b and m over really insignificant things - or even worse - just make up some BS to try to flex their poor opinions.

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

1. We are the first hardcore gaming generation - Gen X. We started it, evolved it, and revolutionized gaming so we take pride in it.

Well, maybe the first hardcore gamers, but we certainly did not start it. The Boomers did. We just took what they gave us and ran with it, but we didn't really shape it until the 90's.

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

2. Our kids (who are getting older themselves) keep us exposed, engaged, and involved in gaming; who do you think has the money to purchase and buy all the latest hardware tech and gizmos (looking at you Steam Deck) we do!!

That all depends on your status in life. Hell, just from reading these forums, it seems like the vast majority of gamers here today are poor as dirt and constantly rattling the tin cup for free stuff. And don't get me started about the complaints about how expensive everything seems to be - like upgrading Windows, apparently or the latest graphics cards....

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

3. Habit, it's embedded in our DNA, we were privileged to see and experience every console and PC generation so far. We bought, played, loaned, traded, and collected every game when it was still fresh and new; from Space Invaders to Cyberpunk which I'm assuming is the most technically advanced game today.

That is true, however I don't see Cyberpunk as the most technically advanced game. From an actual technical standpoint, you have VR and AR games that are pushing the boundaries of new tech. There's cloud gaming and game streaming that are exploring new avenues of gaming culture. You have many games that have continued to push the envelope in terms of graphical processing and technology - which is really the thing that has driven the gaming industry as a whole, and as a result, PC technology too. If it wasn't for the gaming community of yesteryear demanding better graphics with every release, PC technology would be a few tech generations behind at this point.

The Brown Hornet původně napsal:

So with that said it's kind of hard to stop doing something you've been doing your whole life but I do believe it's winding down for Gen X, not from lack of interest but because those big generational leaps in gameplay and design don't seem to be happening anymore. What comes next has been mostly the same.

If anyone young or "old"...hmmm let's say wise, wants to contribute to this topic have at it!

I would hardly call it winding down. Hell, I am playing more games now than I ever have before. There is a plethora of choice now available to us that we didn't have decades ago. Sure innovation and technology plateau from time to time - it's no different in gaming than it is anywhere else. You are going to hit that ceiling until a breakthrough is made somewhere that pushes the realms of what is possible by leaps and bounds again. But the thing is, you don't need to be innovative all the time to still be fun and successful. There are only so many ways to swing a sword in an RPG. There are only so many ways to turn a wheel in a driving simulator. There are only so many ways to plan a pawn's move in a strategy game. There's only so many ways to hit a golf ball in a sports game.

So speak for yourself when you say there is a lack of interest in gaming, or that everything is now the same as what has come before. I am finding myself inspired and excited by many games - big and small on almost a daily basis. So what if Tomb Raider 2013 has gameplay and mechanics similar to Far Cry? I enjoyed the world crafted and the experience as much as I did the original 1996 version. If people are finding it difficult to get any joy out of gaming today, then I say they need to do some serious self reflection instead of trying to blame some nebulous corporate mindspark for the problems.

We are in a Golden Age of gaming right now, and it's only getting better. There is no lack of choice in games from dozens of different genres and from studios large and small, all the way down to a single creator. Gaming as a whole, while still a luxury hobby is more affordable than it has ever been in the past. So speak for yourself, because this old Gen Xer is having a blast being a gamer more than I ever have, and I can't wait to see what else comes down the road before I even think about hanging up my hat.

[Amaterasu]

Look, OP, I've been gaming since 1992. I've been gaming for, oh ♥♥♥♥ it's been 33 years. I remember the 90s. I remember figuratively crapping myself when I first saw the N64 and its graphics, okay. Not growing up in the 80s(I was born in the 80s) doesn't make someone a young gamer. You have to realize that the youngest someone can be on steam without parental consent is 13. Which means they could've been born in 2012. Which would've been 20 years after I started gaming from when we've gone from 16-32 bit pixel art... to High definition 3D Graphics.

In the past 33 years, people have come around and made doom and gloom predictions about gaming and all other things and it's always failed to come true. Gaming is as good as it used to be if not better. If there's something new I don't like, I know that people have figured out how to get something old that I like working.

Gaming outside of AAA Monetization fests, has only gotten better, we are in a golden age of creativity. Where even people like me can make a game on our own.