Steam Refund Policy :: Steam Discussions

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 8시 40분

Cathulhu님이 먼저 게시:
Refunds do not exist so you can demo games.
You got the first warning.
You should listen to it.

If you keep doing that, you can lose your privilege to refund games, forever.

"You can request a refund for nearly any purchase on Steam—for ANY REASON. Maybe your PC doesn't meet the hardware requirements; maybe you bought a game by mistake; maybe you played the title for an hour and JUST DIDN'T LIKE IT.."

source: https://store.steampowered.com/steam_refunds/

This is clear as day, how could you say something so ignorant? They are breaking a legally binding document THEY CREATED!

I can't go up to my landlord and say "I don't want to pay rent anymore even though it CLEARLY STATES that I am legally obligated to do so".

All legally binding agreements must be respected by both parties. What is even the point of putting a blatantly clear clause on the top of the page?

#76

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 8시 42분

davidb11님이 먼저 게시:
Yeah. THe idea that Valve would lose any lawsuit is beyond laughable when all the laws are on their side.

I suggest you pay attention to how the refund situation works instead of ignoring every single thing about it.

"You can request a refund for nearly any purchase on Steam—for ANY REASON. Maybe your PC doesn't meet the hardware requirements; maybe you bought a game by mistake; maybe you played the title for an hour and JUST DIDN'T LIKE IT.."

source: https://store.steampowered.com/steam_refunds/

I suggest you read it yourself, I uppercased the important parts.

Now tell me what "just didn't like it" means? Valve is in the wrong here and you can easily see that.

#77

󠀡󠀡󠀡⁧⁧the.jester 2021년 5월 15일 오후 8시 47분

TenzoG™ - JD님이 먼저 게시:
davidb11님이 먼저 게시:
Yeah. THe idea that Valve would lose any lawsuit is beyond laughable when all the laws are on their side.

I suggest you pay attention to how the refund situation works instead of ignoring every single thing about it.

"You can request a refund for nearly any purchase on Steam—for ANY REASON. Maybe your PC doesn't meet the hardware requirements; maybe you bought a game by mistake; maybe you played the title for an hour and JUST DIDN'T LIKE IT.."

source: https://store.steampowered.com/steam_refunds/

I suggest you read it yourself, I uppercased the important parts.

Now tell me what "just didn't like it" means? Valve is in the wrong here and you can easily see that.

It also says on the same page:

Abuse

Refunds are designed to remove the risk from purchasing titles on Steam—not as a way to get free games. If it appears to us that you are abusing refunds, we may stop offering them to you. We do not consider it abuse to request a refund on a title that was purchased just before a sale and then immediately rebuying that title for the sale price.

#78

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 8시 54분

󠀡󠀡󠀡⁧⁧the.jester님이 먼저 게시:
TenzoG™ - JD님이 먼저 게시:

"You can request a refund for nearly any purchase on Steam—for ANY REASON. Maybe your PC doesn't meet the hardware requirements; maybe you bought a game by mistake; maybe you played the title for an hour and JUST DIDN'T LIKE IT.."

source: https://store.steampowered.com/steam_refunds/

I suggest you read it yourself, I uppercased the important parts.

Now tell me what "just didn't like it" means? Valve is in the wrong here and you can easily see that.

It also says on the same page:

Abuse

Refunds are designed to remove the risk from purchasing titles on Steam—not as a way to get free games. If it appears to us that you are abusing refunds, we may stop offering them to you. We do not consider it abuse to request a refund on a title that was purchased just before a sale and then immediately rebuying that title for the sale price.

That clause is invalid because of the first clause with a clear outline. There weren't any numbers attached to the end of each word that would allude to that part of the contract so therefore its a "standalone" clause which means that all the words are their default in definition without altercation or "conditions" that connect to a greater meaning.

You can literally hire lawyer and they would tell you the exact same thing, as long as there aren't any numbers/symbols that would connect the word to a condition to that specific term used, its definition is the default to what it means in a accredited legal dictionary.

And valve clearly has not put any symbols or numbers to the terms and sentences for: "Refund, Any Game, for any reason, just didn't like it"

So in other words they are sueable for: Breach of contract - an act of breaking the terms set out in a contract"

I don't live in the US but if I did I would instantly send this case to a lawyer in a heartbeat, i'm going to see if any lawyer online wants to give a 2nd opinion on this matter, they might even try to find this guys and see if they want to initiate a lawsuit for cash.

Cyber2B 님이 마지막으로 수정; 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 00분

#79

Start_Running 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 00분

TenzoG™ - JD님이 먼저 게시:
davidb11님이 먼저 게시:
Yeah. THe idea that Valve would lose any lawsuit is beyond laughable when all the laws are on their side.

I suggest you pay attention to how the refund situation works instead of ignoring every single thing about it.

"You can request a refund for nearly any purchase on Steam—for ANY REASON. Maybe your PC doesn't meet the hardware requirements; maybe you bought a game by mistake; maybe you played the title for an hour and JUST DIDN'T LIKE IT.."

source: https://store.steampowered.com/steam_refunds/

I suggest you read it yourself, I uppercased the important parts.

Now tell me what "just didn't like it" means? Valve is in the wrong here and you can easily see that.

You will note a no point does it say you will be allowed to do so repeatedly/indefinately. And In fact it clearly states that they will revoke the priv if they deem you to be abusing the priv. They don't need to put numbers. Since it's not a bout a number of incidents but rather a pattern of behaviour.

#80

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 04분

Start_Running님이 먼저 게시:
TenzoG™ - JD님이 먼저 게시:

"You can request a refund for nearly any purchase on Steam—for ANY REASON. Maybe your PC doesn't meet the hardware requirements; maybe you bought a game by mistake; maybe you played the title for an hour and JUST DIDN'T LIKE IT.."

source: https://store.steampowered.com/steam_refunds/

I suggest you read it yourself, I uppercased the important parts.

Now tell me what "just didn't like it" means? Valve is in the wrong here and you can easily see that.
You will note a no point does it say you will be allowed to do so repeatedly/indefinately. And In fact it clearly states that they will revoke the priv if they deem you to be abusing the priv. They don't need to put numbers. Since it's not a bout a number of incidents but rather a pattern of behaviour.

That clause is invalid because of the first clause with a clear outline. There weren't any numbers attached to the end of each word that would allude to that part of the contract so therefore its a "standalone" clause which means that all the words are their default in definition without altercation or "conditions" that connect to a greater meaning.

You can literally hire lawyer and they would tell you the exact same thing, as long as there aren't any numbers/symbols that would connect the word to a condition to that specific term used, its definition is the default to what it means in a accredited legal dictionary.

And valve clearly has not put any symbols or numbers to the terms and sentences for: "Refund, Any Game, for any reason, just didn't like it"

So in other words they are sueable for: Breach of contract - an act of breaking the terms set out in a contract"

#81

76561198407601200 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 04분

At the end of the day the refund policy is what it is. You aren't allowed to use it to demo games, that is how the policy currently stands hence why there are warnings given out for demoing games and refunding. I wouldn't hold my breath on the policy changing due to being too cheap to purchase a game or too lazy to watch/read a review.

#82

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 08분

The Living Tribunal님이 먼저 게시:
At the end of the day the refund policy is what it is. You aren't allowed to use it to demo games, that is how the policy currently stands hence why there are warnings given out for demoing games and refunding. I wouldn't hold my breath on the policy changing due to being too cheap to purchase a game or too lazy to watch/read a review.

So your fine with consumer abuse? American Express, Bank of America lay out their terms with conditions attached to each word used. I assume you noticed it when you sign up for credit cards? Cashback, unlimited, No annual fee, Up to x% interest all have little numbers and symbols that allude to extra conditions to that term used.

Thats why its called "Terms and conditions" because it's words with specific and clear conditions that MUST BE FOLLOWED IN ORDER TO BE VALID.

Cyber2B 님이 마지막으로 수정; 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 09분

#83

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 14분

davidb11님이 먼저 게시:
Sorry, but this is how contracts work. No one can claim that the second clause is nullified by the first.
THat's literally against how contract laws work. PERIOD.
Hands down.
It is set in stone. It is more set in stone than the laws of physics themselves, and they're very stable.
Except near a black hole.

You obviously are poor in legalease.

Terms and conditions in other words are Words with conditions that must be followed in order to be valid.

" Refund for any reason "-- if there are no TINY symbols or numbers alluding to additional information, therefore it is legally a standalone word without strings attatched.

The law doesn't care about your morals or "why you think", the law is firm and concise, wether you think its wrong or right. Good and bad morals don't exist in a courtroom.

#84

76561198407601200 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 17분

TenzoG™ - JD님이 먼저 게시:
The Living Tribunal님이 먼저 게시:
At the end of the day the refund policy is what it is. You aren't allowed to use it to demo games, that is how the policy currently stands hence why there are warnings given out for demoing games and refunding. I wouldn't hold my breath on the policy changing due to being too cheap to purchase a game or too lazy to watch/read a review.

So your fine with consumer abuse?

No, which isn't what is occurring. I am also against developer abuse as well. Someone "purchases" a game, demos it, and because they were too lazy to watch a review decides the game wasn't good and requests a refund. The developers, which others do in fact enjoy their game, would take a hit as the money will be removed from their possession and go back to the person who couldn't be bothered to watch a review. Do this several dozen times and before long the developers are out money and have invested time, money and effort into losing money. This can also occur due to people simply wanting to not want to spend money on games and instead will want to keep recycling the same transaction over several games. I'm certain if your father suddenly had money removed from his bank account because the employer felt they didn't do a good enough job after working, this would affect your household. Again, at the end of the day the refund policy is what it is and i wouldn't hold my breath for it to change.

#85

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 17분

davidb11님이 먼저 게시:
And yet, the contract one makes with Valve is a legally binding contract held in U.S. Law.
It is set in stone.
You literally are not allowed to claim otherwise.

Having your account period required you to agree to the Subscriber Agreement.
A contract, which is bound with Terms and Conditions.

You're basically trying to get out of a demonic contract here. :P
You can't get out of one of those. Unless you have a lot of powerful friends.

Terms and conditions

"You can request a refund for nearly any purchase on Steam—for any reason. Maybe your PC doesn't meet the hardware requirements; maybe you bought a game by mistake; maybe you played the title for an hour and just didn't like it.

This clause doesn't have any conditions attached to key terms that allude to additional information, therefore the consumer can legally assume it means exactly what it would mean in any legal dictionary under US law as there are no "conditions" that come extra.

#86

Start_Running 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 21분

TenzoG™ - JD님이 먼저 게시:
Start_Running님이 먼저 게시:
You will note a no point does it say you will be allowed to do so repeatedly/indefinately. And In fact it clearly states that they will revoke the priv if they deem you to be abusing the priv. They don't need to put numbers. Since it's not a bout a number of incidents but rather a pattern of behaviour.

That clause is invalid because of the first clause with a clear outline. There weren't any numbers attached to the end of each word that would allude to that part of the contract so therefore its a "standalone" clause which means that all the words are their default in definition without altercation or "conditions" that connect to a greater meaning.

You're free to believe that. But Valve will and has acted on that clause already. And its been held up. Go talk to a lawyer. They'll tell you the same.

You can literally hire lawyer and they would tell you the exact same thing,

AAnd you can hire a doctor that will tell you the Homeopathy works. WHat's your point?

And valve clearly has not put any symbols or numbers to the terms and sentences for: "Refund, Any Game, for any reason, just didn't like it"

Yes. Your refund can be for anty reason. within the time period. But as said, They never said they would let you do this without limit.

The reasons you can use to justify your refund are technically uunlimited. The number of times they'll let you refund isn't.|

#87

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 22분

The Living Tribunal님이 먼저 게시:
TenzoG™ - JD님이 먼저 게시:

So your fine with consumer abuse?
No, which isn't what is occurring. I am also against developer abuse as well. Someone "purchases" a game, demos it, and because they were too lazy to watch a review decides the game wasn't good and requests a refund. The developers, which others do in fact enjoy their game, would take a hit as the money will be removed from their possession and go back to the person who couldn't be bothered to watch a review. Do this several dozen times and before long the developers are out money and have invested time, money and effort into losing money. This can also occur due to people simply wanting to not want to spend money on games and instead will want to keep recycling the same transaction over several games. I'm certain if your father suddenly had money removed from his bank account because the employer felt they didn't do a good enough job after working, this would affect your household. Again, at the end of the day the refund policy is what it is and i wouldn't hold my breath for it to change.

Lol your morals don't count in a court of law. What is set in stone must be respected by the contractor and the contractee

If you lose your job and can't find another one for a while, the landlord or bank you pay can legally make you homeless if you don't pay your debts, because it's written in a contract.

They don't care if your suffering or if you will die on the asphalt, they will act without hesitation even though it is seen as cruel and unjust to do to a human being. A contract is a contract, there is no room for errors or morals.

#88

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 27분

Start_Running님이 먼저 게시:
TenzoG™ - JD님이 먼저 게시:

That clause is invalid because of the first clause with a clear outline. There weren't any numbers attached to the end of each word that would allude to that part of the contract so therefore its a "standalone" clause which means that all the words are their default in definition without altercation or "conditions" that connect to a greater meaning.
You're free to believe that. But Valve will and has acted on that clause already. And its been held up. Go talk to a lawyer. They'll tell you the same.

You can literally hire lawyer and they would tell you the exact same thing,
AAnd you can hire a doctor that will tell you the Homeopathy works. WHat's your point?

And valve clearly has not put any symbols or numbers to the terms and sentences for: "Refund, Any Game, for any reason, just didn't like it"
Yes. Your refund can be for anty reason. within the time period. But as said, They never said they would let you do this without limit.

The reasons you can use to justify your refund are technically uunlimited. The number of times they'll let you refund isn't.|

Then is has to be LEGALLY CLEARLY STATED with ADDITIONAL CONDITIONS

Why do you think banks, lease agreements, credit cards have little tiny numbers and symbols used at the end of each term? Because its a indication of a LIMITATION, no such exists for the written one by valve.

So you still are wrong for trying to use your dumb morals in a legal situation. Do you think a bank cares if you lose your job and can't afford mortgage payments? Do you think a landlord will not evict you because you can't pay rent? Nobody in the legal world cares about morals, if its set in stone, then there is no "exceptions" unless there is a clear indication that an exception exists.

So If I have to uphold my end of the bargain, legally the contractor has to do so as well.

#89

Cyber2B 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 33분

davidb11님이 먼저 게시:
And the legality of all contracts on Valve are set in stone and valid.
You cannot claim otherwise.

And you have yet to explain why the world economy hasn't collapsed by the 12 billion or so lawsuits that would have all been filed if you were right.
You must explain this or redact your claims.

Doesn't dismiss that i'm still right wether your morals agree or not. The reason companies are abusive is because people let it happen. It just takes the right person, at the right time and place to take action.

And you can clearly see there are no additional conditions for the terms used in the ToS..

Its like staying in a abusive relationship, you know its wrong but you let it happen anyways because you feel powerless, but only because you didn't do anything about it.

Kind of see why the rich stay rich and the poor stay poor?

Cyber2B 님이 마지막으로 수정; 2021년 5월 15일 오후 9시 34분

#90

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