Steam could easily add a flag to allow Windows 7 to work with Chrome

[malkom]

The Steam client could easily have a flag that ignores the Goggle Chrome code so allowing it to run on Windows 7 machines.

A few weeks ago the Guild Wars 2 game client was updated and immediately stopped working on W7 machines.
However, Anet who produce GW2 actually care about their players and by putting a flag in the launch shortcut allowed it to ignore Chrome code work to normally on W7 machines. Its still working fine now on my W7 and there is no warning from Anet about it not working in the future.

By the way I've been a software developer for nearly 40 years so I'm not suggesting the impossible although it would mean Valve doing more work and more complexity for them.

In the end its Valve's decision whether to cut off us W7 users or spend a bit more on such a reduced functionality Steam client for W7.


Anyhow, as for me, I won't add any more game to my 46 already on Steam.


Note, W7 is not a dead abandoned OS as many seem to think so.
Officaly W7 went out of support in January 2020 but nearly every week Microsoft are giving updates to core features like .NET, security patches etc. Some updates have been over 900MB.

There are still around 200 million unique W7 machines that regularly connect to the web.

Of course, times moves on.

[andchaos]

brian9824님이 먼저 게시:

Umm you linked a 20+ year old article so what do you expect .... So yeah if you go back over 20 years you aren't going to find many of them running windows back THEN. Now its a very different story and its the most common OS used

Encyclopedia - 2019 = "20+ year old"??? - so you have year 2039+, greetings to the future :D

[Banana {JESUS IS LORD}]

nah its not chrome thats the problem

its chromium

chrome is a browser which has nothing to do with steam

chromium is a framework which steam requires and win7 no longer supports

[Brian9824]

andchaos님이 먼저 게시:

brian9824님이 먼저 게시:

You should actually post the entire quote instead of modifying it to try to make it say something it doesn't. The FULL quote you edited

"“Support to Microsoft Win 7 is not available from January 14 hence it is important all existing terminals running on Windows 7 are upgraded to Windows 10."

"Alternatively, Microsoft has offered extended security updates for terminals currently running on Windows 7" - that means that corporations can pay for extendet support so they dont run them without support, if you dont understand that then its not my problem.

Yeah your articles are all old. Extended support ended January 2023, several months ago...
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/microsoft/microsoft-ends-windows-7-extended-security-updates-on-tuesday/

Windows 7 Professional and Enterprise editions will no longer receive extended security updates for critical and important vulnerabilities starting Tuesday, January 10, 2023

andchaos님이 먼저 게시:

brian9824님이 먼저 게시:

Umm you linked a 20+ year old article so what do you expect .... So yeah if you go back over 20 years you aren't going to find many of them running windows back THEN. Now its a very different story and its the most common OS used

Encyclopedia - 2019 = "20+ year old"??? - so you have year 2039+, greetings to the future :D

Yeah thats the latest renewed trademark for their site, not the date of their article. You can see the article has existed since at LEAST 2016 easily, and from actually reading the article you can see that it predates 2003.

That number is expected to approach 300,000 by 2003

It's clearly written pre-2003 since they don't know how many atms were going to be in existence then....

In fact if you use the wayback machine to look at their old version - https://web.archive.org/web/20161112005229/https://www.encyclopedia.com/computing/news-wires-white-papers-and-books/atm-machines

It clearly lists it as having a 2002 copyright

So yep, 21 years old. Welcome to the present.

[ShelLuser]

Well, since this thread is still active I just might as well....

malkom님이 먼저 게시:

The Steam client could easily have a flag that ignores the Goggle Chrome code so allowing it to run on Windows 7 machines.

No, they can't and I'll tell you why...

Ever bothered to actually look into the Steam client software itself? Because something tells me you didn't.

See, if you look in the Steam clients program folder you'll come across some interesting files. Amongst which:

• d3dcompiler_46.dll
  
• d3dcompiler_46_64.dll
  
• ThirdPartyLegalNotices.html

So, Direct3D is a technology that is part of DirectX: Microsofts graphics drivers. Speaking of which, notice how that provides a specific version for 64 and 32bit usage? That's not going to last forever.

And if you look at the the legal notices you'll notice that DirectX is just one out of many libraries which the Steam client is using. So what about all of that?

malkom님이 먼저 게시:

By the way I've been a software developer for nearly 40 years so I'm not suggesting the impossible although it would mean Valve doing more work and more complexity for them.

For an allegidly veteran software developer you sure don't seem to know or understand very much about the development process.

Because as everyone can see the Steam client relies on quite a large collection of so called SDKs: Software Development Kits. And some of those are also in the process of dropping support for legacy platforms. You can see one example above where there's a clear distinction between 32 and 64bit usage.

So I guess you're now also suggesting that Valve should "just" develop their own libraries?

Another thing... what about quality control? Generally speaking it's fair to say that Windows development is heavily focussed on Visual Studio, Microsoft's own flagship IDE. If you look at its system requirements[learn.microsoft.com] you'll quickly notice that it doesn't even run anymore on legacy systems.

Of course there are also 3rd party development platforms, not everything is centered around VS, but that's also not my point here: how do you propose a company like Valve to support legacy products if the very tools they use for development stopped working for or on them?

Or are you now suggesting that Valve should "just" release their client for legacy systems while hoping and maybe praying that things will work out because they have no means to do any testing themselves?

That's quite an interesting business model.

malkom님이 먼저 게시:

In the end its Valve's decision whether to cut off us W7 users or spend a bit more on such a reduced functionality Steam client for W7.

No, it's Microsoft's decision which has ended support for Windows 7 three years ago already[support.microsoft.com].

See, there's another thing you're now overlooking: support (or lack thereof) and liability originating from that fact.

Would Valve continue to support Windows 7 right up to a point where major backdoors are going to be massively exploited then they could actually be held acccountable for supporting outdated and insecure environments and thus by doing so also potentially putting their customers in danger. Fully on their own accord while Microsoft has already stated that it will no longer support Windows 7.

See, there's also a legal manner to keep in mind. Because you can bet that this would be a situation where laywers would have a field day.

Strange that such a "veteran software developer" like yourself doesn't seem to know about such liability issues or apparently forgot all about 'm.

And lets not pretend that this can't happen... even Windows 10 is under constant scrutiny[www.forbes.com].

Then, as for Windows 7:

https://stack.watch/product/microsoft/windows-7/

https://www.techradar.com/news/windows-7-and-xp-are-vulnerable-to-a-major-security-exploit-so-patch-now

https://www.cvedetails.com/product/17153/Microsoft-Windows-7.html?vendor_id=26


All without receiving any more updates. I think Windows 7 users have bigger fish to fry than the drop of support from Steam. IMO it's time for a reality check. And I say so because if you check the Steam fora you'll read plenty of threads about people who allowed themselves to get scammed out of their items. Now imagine them using a system that can be easily remotely exploited.

[andchaos]

brian9824님이 먼저 게시:

It's clearly written pre-2003 since they don't know how many atms were going to be in existence then....

So what? its says clear thet ATM was developed and run under dedicated IBM OS, you running away from the point playing dump. If you want a actual article look o the officia IBM site, they still support ATM with the IBM MQ OS, so.... whatever

[Nocturne]

ShelLuser님이 먼저 게시:

Anything you wrote here doesn't matter. Any '3rd-party dlls" Steam is using are working just fine on Windows 7, and there's no need to update every 00001 version change. "Security risks" of other people are not your concerns. In fact, you should've worry about such using overbloated Win11, as well as Chrome with it's own telemetry. But you simply don't care, you are scared only of those "scary vulnerabilities!11" newsletters are throwing to you. I bet you don't even care to distinguish local ones(more than 75% -> doesn't matter) from remote ones.
And don't play dumb as if win10 wasn't affected by that wave of cve's in 2019. First of all, one was fused only with <=7th gen of processors, and even then only software update was enough. Another one needed just to disable old smb. And one was general and SSL based, which doesn't have anything to do with specific OS. Anyway most of that was affecting win10 as well and was fixable manually. And even if theoretically something isn't - it can be just blocked by firewall(not by default one, ofc). Nothing super-difficult or impossible. Well - for me at least :] If it's so hard and scary for you — that doesn't mean you have right to be fearmonger over everyone.

[ShelLuser]

Nocturne님이 먼저 게시:

ShelLuser님이 먼저 게시:

Anything you wrote here doesn't matter. Any '3rd-party dlls" Steam is using are working just fine on Windows 7

For now. Thanks for demonstrating that you totally missed the point.

Also... demonstrating what I believe to be sheer ignorance because... that's quite a bunch of remote code execution issues that were discovered on Windows 7 this year. Remote kernel execution, remote elevation overrides....

But you're right: none of that matters, it's not as if you're using the Internet where any website could try to exploit all of that.

Sorry but this display of ignorance really says it all for me. Who cares about online security.... with a bit of luck they're only going to use your network as a base of operations so that it will only hinder others, not you. So... all good, right?!

[Brian9824]

andchaos님이 먼저 게시:

brian9824님이 먼저 게시:

It's clearly written pre-2003 since they don't know how many atms were going to be in existence then....

So what? its says clear thet ATM was developed and run under dedicated IBM OS

Yeah back in 2003 6 years before windows 7 even existed. Once windows 7 came out it was a far better platform and most haven't run. I mean back in the day they also told people smoking was good for the lungs.... So we can add your news article to the list of stuff that is no longer true or applicable....

andchaos님이 먼저 게시:

, you running away from the point playing dump. If you want a actual article look o the officia IBM site, they still support ATM with the IBM MQ OS, so.... whatever

Sorry, but your ignoring that what your describing hasn't been accurate in nearly 20 years. The current most common OS used for ATM's is windows 7 by far. You googled it and didn't realize it was so outdated, the only reason I knew it was because I have a friend in banking who works with their older systems, so no shame in not knowing.

Again actual RECENT articles, not ones from 20+ years ago - https://www.electronicspecifier.com/news/blog/is-your-atm-moving-from-windows-7-to-windows-10

[andchaos]

brian9824님이 먼저 게시:

Yeah back in 2003 6 years before windows 7 even existed. Once windows 7 came out it was a far better platform and most haven't run.

I realy dont get your problem, its a fact that it was developd to work with that dedicated systems , and it is a fact they they use the IBM OS system to today, if there was WinXP used in some regions to save costs then so what?

brian9824님이 먼저 게시:

I mean back in the day they also told people smoking was good for the lungs.... So we can add your news article to the list of stuff that is no longer true or applicable....

So when medical documentation from back then sayd that you need to eat to stay alive, so you will now stop eat? its no longer true because it was back then? no, you declaration is completly delusional, the truth is still the truth, and it does not matter if it was stated yesterday or last year.

[Brian9824]

andchaos님이 먼저 게시:

I realy dont get your problem, its a fact that it was developd to work with that dedicated systems , and it is a fact they they use the IBM OS system to today, if there was WinXP used in some regions to save costs then so what?

We were discussing how its used TODAY, how ATM's were built and designed 20+ years ago isn't relevant to today.

It's not really that convoluted. I pointed out your article mentions windows 7 devices. You are errnoeously assuming every device is a computer, and furthermore that every computer is also potentially running Steam.

As I pointed out and proved that is false and those "devices" include millions of ATM's, business machines, etc that will NEVER be a steam customer, so your basing your logic on a series of faulty assumptions.

Already showed you documentation, Windows 7 is the most current ATM system. Windows XP WAS popular, but almost all the ATM"s upgraded years ago when Windows XP was discontinued as well...

andchaos님이 먼저 게시:

So when medical documentation from back then

If that medical documentation was proven false i'd acknowledge it, I wouldn't keep trying to use how something was not understood 20+ years ago ignoring reality.

[Sam]

Indubitably steam don't support obsoletes.. clearly(?!)

[Kindred]

andchaos님이 먼저 게시:

TheBasedSociety님이 먼저 게시:

Please try to make an argument in good faith, though. This same old "millions of PCs run Windows 7", millions of what? Neglected office computers? Machines in parking lots? No one uses it for gaming anymore.

I use it for gaming, so thats already one more than no one, so you lying to others with you assumtions based on nothing,

you trying so activly to convince others to something they dont want, and for what reason? what are you trying to achieve with it? what do you think your loose if others just use the OS that runs best with they hardware/software? whats your point in arguing against it?

I'm also still using Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 for gaming. There's a lot of games that don't work with Windows 10 or 11. There's also a lot of PC retro gamers who prefer playing older games that only work on older operating systems like Windows XP & 7, which begs the question. Why is Steam and GOG still selling these games if it's dropping support for Windows 7 & 8.1? These games will no longer work under Windows 10/11 properly or will require messing around with DirectX/OpenGL wrappers or other fixes which is a pain in the ass.

[Komarimaru]

Kindred님이 먼저 게시:

andchaos님이 먼저 게시:

I use it for gaming, so thats already one more than no one, so you lying to others with you assumtions based on nothing,

you trying so activly to convince others to something they dont want, and for what reason? what are you trying to achieve with it? what do you think your loose if others just use the OS that runs best with they hardware/software? whats your point in arguing against it?

I'm also still using Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 for gaming. There's a lot of games that don't work with Windows 10 or 11. There's also a lot of PC retro gamers who prefer playing older games that only work on older operating systems like Windows XP & 7, which begs the question. Why is Steam and GOG still selling these games if it's dropping support for Windows 7 & 8.1? These games will no longer work under Windows 10/11 properly or will require messing around with DirectX/OpenGL wrappers or other fixes which is a pain in the ass.

Well, for one. If the game came out during Windows 7 era, it will work on 10 and 11. My entire XP library works on Windows 10 as well.

I even went to one of my retro rigs, with a Q9650 and GTX 280x3, and installed Windows 10 over Vista 64 bit. Ran just fine, games still worked.

The only time I've had issues running a game natively, was due to Hardware more than Operating System, or due to 16bit software. But why we have retro rigs, and even emulation environments.

So, the claim that games won't run on 10 and 11, are generally false, especially if they were Windows 7 era games.

[Crashed]

Kindred님이 먼저 게시:

andchaos님이 먼저 게시:

I use it for gaming, so thats already one more than no one, so you lying to others with you assumtions based on nothing,

you trying so activly to convince others to something they dont want, and for what reason? what are you trying to achieve with it? what do you think your loose if others just use the OS that runs best with they hardware/software? whats your point in arguing against it?

I'm also still using Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 for gaming. There's a lot of games that don't work with Windows 10 or 11. There's also a lot of PC retro gamers who prefer playing older games that only work on older operating systems like Windows XP & 7, which begs the question. Why is Steam and GOG still selling these games if it's dropping support for Windows 7 & 8.1? These games will no longer work under Windows 10/11 properly or will require messing around with DirectX/OpenGL wrappers or other fixes which is a pain in the ass.

Windows 10 actually has better compatibility with old DirectX versions than 8.1 which has a flaw with vsync when emulating lower color modes.

[Chesmu]

malkom님이 먼저 게시:

The Steam client could easily have a flag that ignores the Goggle Chrome code so allowing it to run on Windows 7 machines.

A few weeks ago the Guild Wars 2 game client was updated and immediately stopped working on W7 machines.
However, Anet who produce GW2 actually care about their players and by putting a flag in the launch shortcut allowed it to ignore Chrome code work to normally on W7 machines. Its still working fine now on my W7 and there is no warning from Anet about it not working in the future.

By the way I've been a software developer for nearly 40 years so I'm not suggesting the impossible although it would mean Valve doing more work and more complexity for them.

In the end its Valve's decision whether to cut off us W7 users or spend a bit more on such a reduced functionality Steam client for W7.

Thanks very much for mentioning all that, me and many others been asking for possibilities to continue Steam on W7, as you said, times moves on, that means adding such function would get easier as the day passes.

My personal conclusion is that Microsoft is sponsoring Steam or something, if you pay attention to their announcement, they ask players a lot to upgrade faster to 10 and take sides, instead of neutrally announcing the change.