Excessive banning/Censorship on Steam: TOS should be modified.

[Squashbuckler]

Finally back after being banned for one month...


Thanks to everyone who kept this thread alive. Also, thanks to those who have not supported this thread by keeping out message heard!



Herein lies the problem with Censorship:

My Hypothesis was that "Helicopter Parenting" leads to overly sensitive children and a sterile environment. When that hypothesis was banned from the discussion, and "Idea" was effectively eliminated from the minds of anyone who was potentially following this topic.

This is inherently insidious, and damages the fabric our our society as we continue to have ideas eliminated by the gatekeepers of opinions and thoughts. Yes, this is just one forum, but why stop here? How many "bans" are we going to accept and perpetrate on other people? Just let people speak and stop reporting them.

Original Post:

In my 14 years on steam, I have to say that the banning and censorship has now reached a new level. (I cant even offer a descriptive word for fear of being "Banned", once again).

In fact, the TOS is unreasonable should be amended:
"This post contains content that is combative, argumentative, or likely to derail"

What kind of world are we living in when we cannot be "Argumentative?" The oxford Dictionary defines this as " given to expressing divergent or opposite views". This is the foundation of a civilized society, not censored speech.

Moreover, I dont think it is reasonable to be banned for weeks by asking if DEI initiatives are present in a game. That is not a discriminatory commentary, that is a legitimate inquiry with regard to a political position. If I were to ask if right wing ideology is present in a game, or to ask where on the spectrum a game exists, that is not discriminatory discussion. That is simply inquiring as to the political leanings of a game. A purchaser has the right to withhold monies from games that do not fit with his/her alignment.

As human beings, if you keep hitting report and desire to censor speech, eventually when they come for your speech, you wont have any. Speech suppression is a political tool, and those that desire to give up freedoms for security will regret it.

Let people debate and speak on these forums. Who cares if one person calls another person a name. Why do the readers of this post feel the need to hit "report" ?
It is the mark of an educated mind to hear an opinion or criticism, you don't need to accept it. Many have insulted me here and have disagreed with me, and that is fine. If I dont accept their gift (The insult), they are left holding the bag.

The molly-coddling of our youth that is allegedly the reason for mental health issues is nonsense. When an individual has confidence and is unaffected by social media and the opinions of others, they are more resilient.

It seems that any slight criticism or comment results in a "ban". This has absolutely gone too far.

Game companies can openly push political agendas, but any contrary opinion to it results in a ban.

Allow people to speak, and only moderate hate speech ( I.e: Prohibited grounds)

I dont like social justice/DEI initiatives in my games. When I ask about whether or not they are contained, I receive bans. How is this acceptable?

If you are banned by a dev, protest it! Don't let devs push their agendas in forums

If you are the kind of person that keeps hitting report, give it a rest.


At least steam kept this thread going..

Update: Had my Witcher 3 forum post deleted for saying the : " Main story was missing something, and generally weak". I was accused of being a "troll" because I had not yet updated my review from years ago. This is madness.

TL:DR : The forum rules need to change.

[Brian9824]

Leonardo Da Pinchi eredeti hozzászólása:

brian9824 eredeti hozzászólása:

You didn't read it. Freedom of speech means NOTHING when it comes to a private BUSINESS. It only applies to the GOVERNMENT, not private companies like Steam.....

So again you've made the same mistake as many have. You do not actually know what freedom of speech actually means, you just use it as an excuse when you get censored without realizing that freedom of speech only prevents the government from censoring your speech...

Odd that so many people who try to cite the first amendment, don't know what the first amendment entails.

It's not a get out of jail free card for crappy behavior across the board, like they seem to think it is. Lol

Yeah, its kinda sad how so many people don't know the first thing about the constitution. I get if your not American to not know the details, but it takes 30 seconds to look it up and its VERY clear

[Brian9824]

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

brian9824 eredeti hozzászólása:

You didn't read it. Freedom of speech means NOTHING when it comes to a private BUSINESS. It only applies to the GOVERNMENT, not private companies like Steam.....

So again you've made the same mistake as many have. You do not actually know what freedom of speech actually means, you just use it as an excuse when you get censored without realizing that freedom of speech only prevents the government from censoring your speech...

While it is true that freedom of speech primarily protects individuals from government censorship, dismissing its relevance in the context of private businesses oversimplifies the issue and ignores the broader implications of free speech in today's digital landscape.

Again false, please actually READ the first amendment. This will get you started
https://www.carnegielibrary.org/the-first-amendment-and-censorship/

The First Amendment also specifically refers to the interference of government in these rights. This ensures that Americans are free to critique the government, but it does not give Americans blanket immunity to say whatever they want, wherever they want, without consequences. Lata Nott, Executive Director of the First Amendment Center, explains:

There is 0 free speech with regards to individuals and private businesses, it ONLY applies to the government. Claiming anything else is factually wrong.

This amendment gives Americans the right to express themselves verbally and through publication without government interference.

if you don't like steam's rules regarding what content is allowed you are free to leave.

[D-Black Catto]

I got a ban on one forum for writing gibberish in Cyrillic(wrote some cyrilic letters randomly) under the reason "discriminatory content". I checked afterwards, no letters accidentally formed an actual word.

I got a ban on another forum for calling someone a troll.


These two bans in two different community hubs resulted in a two week global community ban that steam gives automatically.

[Brian9824]

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

TLDR

What you WANT it to do doesn't matter. There is no freedom of speech on the steam forums and you are not entitled to it. You cannot say whatever you want, and if you do not agree with that you are free to not use the forum.

Every company in the world has rules for their forums, none of them will allow you to say whatever you want without consequences. You are free to obey the rules or leave, its your choice.

[Mad Scientist]

No amount of text replaces that when you're a guest especially at a private business, you follow the rules or you can be punished else removed for not following them. It's that simple. The site is all ages which means you should act as if there are children around, thus your behavior should match that fact.

The rules are there & they're easy to follow. Simple as that. ♥♥♥ doesn't apply here, 1stA doesn't apply here. Follow the rules, move on, The End.

[Brian9824]

D-Black Catto eredeti hozzászólása:

I got a ban on one forum for writing gibberish in Cyrillic(wrote some cyrilic letters randomly) under the reason "discriminatory content". I checked afterwards, no letters accidentally formed an actual word.

I got a ban on another forum for calling someone a troll.


These two bans in two different community hubs resulted in a two week global community ban that steam gives automatically.

Both sound correct to me, spamming gibberish and insulting other users are both valid reasons for bans, although you'd have to check with the moderators of those forums as game hubs can have different rules from steam community hubs

[Brian9824]

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

TLDR

There is no hindering of something that is not applicable to you.... You can't hinder something that doesn't exist...

You are free to start your own forums where everyone has free speech. Let us know how that goes...

[Boblin the Goblin]

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

brian9824 eredeti hozzászólása:

What you WANT it to do doesn't matter. There is no freedom of speech on the steam forums and you are not entitled to it. You cannot say whatever you want, and if you do not agree with that you are free to not use the forum.

Every company in the world has rules for their forums, none of them will allow you to say whatever you want without consequences. You are free to obey the rules or leave, its your choice.

While it's true that private companies have the right to set rules and policies for their forums and digital platforms, it's important to recognize that the question of free speech extends beyond legal definitions and boundaries. The spirit of free speech and its broader implications for society, democracy, and public discourse cannot be ignored simply because a private company has the authority to regulate its platform.

That's actually exactly what it means. Steam does not advertise it's forums as free speech. They have their rules and regulations plainly visible.

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

Furthermore, as users of these platforms, we have a responsibility to engage in constructive dialogue and advocate for a balance between content moderation and free expression. While we may not be entitled to an unrestricted forum for our speech, we can still strive to create a space that values diversity of thought, encourages respectful debate, and promotes a healthy exchange of ideas.

There is no such responsibility. They have their rules clearly laid out. You can disagree with them but you still have to follow them to continue using a service they are providing you. The forums are not a right, they are a privilege.

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

Ultimately, the role of private companies and platforms in facilitating or hindering free speech will continue to be a topic of debate and discussion. By engaging in a nuanced and respectful dialogue, we can help to promote a more open, inclusive, and democratic society, both online and offline.

It will be a discussion for places that actually influence the outside world in any meaningful way. The Steam forums are not such a place.

You are free to host your own forums or make your own group and police it how you see fit. Steam has no obligation to promote a democratic society on it's forums.

[Tito Shivan]

Mad Scientist eredeti hozzászólása:

No amount of text replaces that when you're a guest especially at a private business, you follow the rules or you can be punished else removed for not following them.

When in Rome, do as the romans do.

[Mad Scientist]

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

Mad Scientist eredeti hozzászólása:

No amount of text replaces that when you're a guest especially at a private business, you follow the rules or you can be punished else removed for not following them. It's that simple. The site is all ages which means you should act as if there are children around, thus your behavior should match that fact.

The rules are there & they're easy to follow. Simple as that. ♥♥♥ doesn't apply here, 1stA doesn't apply here. Follow the rules, move on, The End.

While it's true that private businesses have the right to set rules and policies for their platforms

All that matters is you follow the businesses rules or you may be punished or removed.
Nothing else matters, the rules are incredibly easy to follow. ♥♥♥ does not apply to non-government agencies, it doesn't apply to a private business, and many other places have rules you must obey or you can be trespassed.

It's important to recognize that no matter what your opinion is, only the rules matter.

Tito Shivan eredeti hozzászólása:

Mad Scientist eredeti hozzászólása:

No amount of text replaces that when you're a guest especially at a private business, you follow the rules or you can be punished else removed for not following them.

When in Rome, do as the romans do.

[Boblin the Goblin]

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

SlowMango eredeti hozzászólása:

That's actually exactly what it means. Steam does not advertise it's forums as free speech. They have their rules and regulations plainly visible.



There is no such responsibility. They have their rules clearly laid out. You can disagree with them but you still have to follow them to continue using a service they are providing you. The forums are not a right, they are a privilege.



It will be a discussion for places that actually influence the outside world in any meaningful way. The Steam forums are not such a place.

You are free to host your own forums or make your own group and police it how you see fit. Steam has no obligation to promote a democratic society on it's forums.

First quote:

While it's true that Steam has their rules and regulations plainly visible, it's important to recognize that the question of free speech extends beyond legal definitions and boundaries. The concept of free speech is fundamental to democratic societies and a healthy public discourse. While private companies have the right to regulate their platforms, it is still possible for their policies to have unintended consequences or overly restrict free expression. By engaging in a dialogue and advocating for more inclusive policies, we can help promote a more open and healthy exchange of ideas on the platform.

Second quote:

While it is true that private companies have the right to set rules and policies for their forums and digital platforms, as users, we have the responsibility to engage in constructive dialogue and advocate for a better balance between content moderation and free expression. It is not only our right, but also our responsibility to work towards a more open and inclusive society that values diverse perspectives and fosters healthy debate. Following the rules is important, but so is actively participating in shaping the platform we use. By promoting a culture of respectful dialogue and a commitment to free expression, we can help create a better online community for everyone.

Third quote:

While it's true that the Steam forums may not be a platform that influences the outside world in any significant way, it's important to recognize that the principles of free speech and democratic values extend beyond any single platform or community. As members of a democratic society, we have a responsibility to promote and uphold these values wherever possible, and this includes advocating for them in the context of private companies and digital platforms.

Moreover, even though Steam may not have an obligation to promote a democratic society on its forums, it is still possible for the company to do so in order to create a more open and inclusive community. By engaging in constructive dialogue and promoting a balance between content moderation and free expression, Steam can help to foster a more vibrant and diverse community that values the exchange of ideas and encourages respectful debate.

You are just repeating yourself.

Steam doesn't have free speech.
Steam is under no obligation to allow free speech.
We are under no obligation to criticize their restrictions on their forum.
The forums are a privilege, not a right.
You are free to not use the forums if their restrictions(that you willingly agreed to) do not agree with you.
Steam is not a democratic society and has no obligation to uphold a democratic society in it's forums.

All in all, you are owed nothing and Steam is obligated to nothing but their own interests.

That's it. It isn't deeper than that. It isn't some assault against free speech.

I will not be reading anymore of your responses.

[Mad Scientist]

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

Steam may not be a democratic society, but as users and members of a larger democratic society

Very large amount of the overall userbase from many countries do not live in such, one even has their own client.

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

we have a responsibility to foster healthy debate and open exchange of ideas. While it is true that Steam's forums are a privilege and not a right, our participation in these forums can contribute to a more inclusive and diverse community.

We don't do that here.
It's just gaming related or otherwise about the section itself, nothing else is important & often being anything else typically results in action being taken especially in Off-Topic.
There is just civil & uncivil discussion, relevant or non-relevant discussion. No political beliefs or bandwagon stuff, just relevant discussions. Almost everyone is able to follow the discussion rules without issues, thus are displaying constructive or acceptable-enough behavior, anything else is dealt with more harshly (justifiably so) over time.

Diverse here is just naturally differing opinions.

[( ( < < <🤖> > > ) )]

open and inclusive would be ok if thats what people wanted....

there are people here that are motivated by various ways of being in the world
some of which... that would chose to impose their restrictions and beliefs on others
along with underdeveloped or over developed mentalities that lack restraint or
dont care for others and motivated by disturbing what can be considered open and inclusive...

[Garou]

Squashbuckler eredeti hozzászólása:

Game companies can openly push political agendas, but any contrary opinion to it results in a ban.

Talking on a forum wont change much, but not buying the games you don't like will make the most difference to you and maybe even in general if enough people do the same.

[ShelLuser]

󠀡󠀡 eredeti hozzászólása:

The concept of free speech is fundamental to democratic societies and a healthy public discourse. While private companies have the right to regulate their platforms, it is still possible for their policies to have unintended consequences or overly restrict free expression.

There's a place for everything, and gaming fora aren't it.

Free speech doesn't exist here and the whole discussion about it is pointless, in my opinion it even borderlines the boundaries of trolling. I base that on the simple fact that... in order to gain access to this place you willingly agree to follow Steams terms of service.

So to try and back out from all those while outing hollow phrases such as "free speech", "responsibilities" and "democracies" only results in nonsense which is in my opinion pretty useless. Discussion for the sake of discussing (or maybe Steam awards) because in the end it adds absolutely nothing and also leads to nothing. Save for maybe a bit of laughter.

Like I said: if the rules are such a huge issue, then why consent to following them in the first place? Seems rather immature.


The one thing free speech advocates always seem to forget is that there's nothing in such amendments or constitutions that demands that other parties actually listen to their stuff. Also because "free speech" doesn't exist. Not in the way you envision it. Grab a soapbox and stand in a street to spread your wisdom, but don't be surprised if people band together to haul you away because they don't want you there.

And there's nothing you can do about it.

In the end free speech is about governments; blocking those from going after you for the sole reason of your opinion(s). No more, no less.


Want free speech? Go to Reddit (I'm not even kidding) but don't be surprised if your ramblings get downvoted into oblivion.