Will the Australian Refund Policy be carried across the world

[Jason]

I just read about Valve getting sued by the ACCC, and I think it is about time. Thanks for Australia's government for doing something we've all wanted to but don't have the power.

I am wondering why it takes a government entity to call Valve out on this, and whether or not this will eventually be carried across the world to treat everyone with equal respect! :D

That would be great, especially since there are many games on Steam that I've bought that I would love a refund. Certain games are way too misleading now a days, with their lying screenshots and so much more. There really needs to be a way for those gross liars to receive no money.

It has nothing to do with Valve games, I love Valve games, but there's so many other games on Steam that I go "hey that looks good" and then realize it is garbage I just bought. Those people don't deserve their horrible games on Steam, let alone get money for it.

But then again I'm the type of person that thinks any game that forces you to make a separate account to play it and has a separate updater/launcher even though the game is on Steam.....I think those games should either get their act together or be removed from Steam.

Just the simple fact that if you have to use a separate launcher to update a random game instead of using Steam, it messes with your playtime stats, and all of a sudden you have 60 hours of play time in a game you still haven't even booted because of ridiculous updates.


And I bet you this will get locked within a half hour because the moderators really hate serious conversations. The more time I spend writing this the quicker the moderators will remove it, because when the fans take time and put thought into something.......you silence em. I really want things to change but I am afraid of even writing this because I am 99% sure the moderators will do their job and make me want to post things like this less and less. Another huge problem that will never be fixed because the system in place is designed to make that problem continue forever.

[HLCinSC]

引用自 Skyblue：

引用自 HLCinSC：

How do they fine a company that has no physical or banking presence in their country?

For one Valve maintains plant and equipment in australia and whilst nowhere near an expert in this regard, i'm sure there are other avenues of enforcement.

The only way I could think of would be if they intercepted Australian bank/CC companies payments to Steam, but then Steam would likely either decline them or make the publishers raise the price to compensate for what they are losing.

What did you mean by plant and equipment?

[76561198151553868]

引用自 Malik Blishtar：

引用自 Skyblue：

If the game is sold in Australia and must be registered on steam, regardless of where you purchased the game, Valve would be obliged to either register the game or refund your money.
It would be then be Valves responsibility to seek reimbursement from the developer. This is how Australian consumer law works.

If they region lock them it will no longer be available in Australia, that's what I said twice now, then Valve does NOT have to sell them to you.

If the developer(valve has no control whether a developer sell a physical copy of a game in australia) sells a game in australian stores, which requires registration through steam, then Valve would be obliged to do what i posted above.
If a company does not sell a game in Australia then you are correct(but then this changes nothing from what is currently the case).
I think its poignant to remember that above all the Steam platform is just a DRM enforcement platform in essence.

[76561198151553868]

引用自 HLCinSC：

What did you mean by plant and equipment?

Servers and hardware.

[HLCinSC]

引用自 Skyblue：

引用自 HLCinSC：

What did you mean by plant and equipment?

Servers and hardware.

Ah ok that's what I thought but was not sure thanks.

[TGC> The Games Collector]

I wonder how "broken" a product would have to be to get it refunded then.

I've seen quite some people demanding a refund while it's their PC's state to blame that a game doesn't work. Faulty drivers for instance.
Heck even blaming their burnt out card on a game, while it's usually faulty (usually cooling-)hardware responsible for it.

I don't consider that a broken product, it's 3rd party causes that stop the game from working properly. :/ probably going to be alot of exceptions to that refund policy...

Then again, the developers should correctly supply 3rd party tools. For instance GFWL games supplied with a broken launcher not working. Although that shouldn't directly warrant a refund, they should at least fix that problem in a given time instead of abandoning it with "oh, you can find the fix on google". That's just lazy.

If your video card burns out within warranty, those hardware companies usually send a brand new one. :/ too bad something like that can't be done with software.


But the fact that some games can consistently be broken or patched wrong is obviously the developer's responsibility. And they shouldn't ignore it because "all sales are final".

If devs need to give a refund once in a while, they might stop pushing games to Steam because it's easy money with that no refund policy.
And maybe even start a bit more quality control, instead of abandoning a game halfway in the patchwork. It's not really Steam's autoupdate's fault for the broken patches being shoved into it. But since they do provide the service, they should place that responsibility where it belongs.

[RedLightning]

引用自 ♫TGC> The Gritty ♥♥♥♥：

...snip
And maybe even start a bit more quality control, instead of abandoning a game halfway in the patchwork. It's not really Steam's autoupdate's fault for the broken patches being shoved into it. But since they do provide the service, they should place that responsibility where it belongs.

This right here.. exactly this.

[Gabenfoodle]

引用自 RedLightning：

引用自 ♫TGC> The Gritty ♥♥♥♥：

...snip
And maybe even start a bit more quality control, instead of abandoning a game halfway in the patchwork. It's not really Steam's autoupdate's fault for the broken patches being shoved into it. But since they do provide the service, they should place that responsibility where it belongs.

This right here.. exactly this.

So sue the comapnies that break games, not Valve. Simple. And about the auto-update. First, you CAN turn it off. But keep in mind that for people like me who launch up my pc an hour before I play on it, its a good service because I can DL my updates without even getting on my PC

[76561198151553868]

引用自 RedLightning：

引用自 ♫TGC> The Gritty ♥♥♥♥：

...snip
And maybe even start a bit more quality control, instead of abandoning a game halfway in the patchwork. It's not really Steam's autoupdate's fault for the broken patches being shoved into it. But since they do provide the service, they should place that responsibility where it belongs.

This right here.. exactly this.

Yes and no. An early access game would fall into that grey area as, as a consumer you are aware you are purchasing the product "as is"

[Gabenfoodle]

引用自 Mr. McSuave：

引用自 CeriaL KillA：

true lol

The Australian government likes to pretend that the internet is just some fad that will go away eventually. It's really ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ annoying.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[76561198151553868]

引用自 Chuck G Nukem：

引用自 RedLightning：

This right here.. exactly this.

So sue the comapnies that break games, not Valve. Simple. And about the auto-update. First, you CAN turn it off. But keep in mind that for people like me who launch up my pc an hour before I play on it, its a good service because I can DL my updates without even getting on my PC

Valve is being taken to court because they have a "NO REFUND" policy which they sought to enforce in Australia. Under Australian law as Valve is a retailer of games Australian consumers have a legal right to deal with the retailer and not to be forced to go back to the manufacturer for remedy.

[Silicon Vampire]

What happens when they get fewer games and higher prices to compensate?

[76561198151553868]

引用自 Silicon Vampire：

What happens when they get fewer games and higher prices to compensate?

If the developer(valve has no control whether a developer sell a physical copy of a game in australia) sells a game in australian stores, which requires registration through steam, then Valve would be obliged to do what i posted above.
I think its poignant to remember that above all the Steam platform is just a DRM enforcement platform in essence.

[Gus the Crocodile]

引用自 Silicon Vampire：

What happens when they get fewer games and higher prices to compensate?

Higher prices we're used to. Fewer games seems incredibly unlikely seeing every other media is already subject to the same laws and has been for many years, and we've never had people going "nope, not going to sell my product there because it it's broken I have to give a refund". Any developers scared of doing that are not going to be missed, I suspect, and their games would still be available outside Steam anyway.

引用自 Skyblue：

if a game is physically available in australia, yet a consumer chooses to buy it through an overseas competitor such as Ozgameshop for a cheaper price, then Valve would still be obliged to refund.

Huh? It would be Ozgameshop you'd be going to for a refund in this case, no?

[76561198151553868]

引用自 Gus the Crocodile：

Huh? It would be Ozgameshop you'd be going to for a refund in this case, no?

Yes, my mistake.

[TGC> The Games Collector]

引用自 Skyblue：

引用自 RedLightning：

This right here.. exactly this.

Yes and no. An early access game would fall into that grey area as, as a consumer you are aware you are purchasing the product "as is"

Yeah, Early Access should have a bit of a different policy.

I kind of see it as a sort of Kickstarter+ sample. You already have the game... as far as it's done, and you usually only buy EAGs to support the development of that game.

Which is a bit different from buying a game to play it and expecting a fully working end-product.